I have been invited to be an understudy, if you will, for one of the Demystifying Divas, who take on a topic a week.
This week's topic?
What lies do we tell our significant other?
The first thing that popped into my head when I read the question for this week was poor Ruth Fisher on 6 Feet Under. Poor repressed Ruth, having had a series of relationships after the death of her husband ... finally finds someone she clicks with. She meets him they date for 6 weeks, they get married. BOOM! It's a tornado. He is funny, giving, sexy, and he looks just like James Cromwell. He is kind, he makes her laugh, and they have sex so loudly that they wake up the rest of the family. Sure he's been married 7 times before, and he doesn't talk to the majority of his kids ... but what does that matter? Ruth is an eternal optimist. She can love him all the way through it, she can love him so HARD, and so TRULY ... that he will have a break-through in communication and suddenly be a great dad to his abandoned kids. Ruth? Don't be an idiot. The dude is what, 68? 69? You think he can change?
But anyway, back to the topic.
While yes, there appeared to be some shadows on the horizon of this new and passionate love during last season ... nothing can compare to what is going on THIS season.
Dude turns out to be an OCD nightmare, gibbering about mercury in the water, and building out a bomb shelter that would rival the one in Blast from the Past. Dude is obsessed with the end of the world. Dude has bouts of complete black despair. Dude is dragged out of the bomb shelter screaming, and put into an ambulance and taken off to the nuthouse. Ruth goes to visit him, carrying an enormous bag of oranges for some reason. As though he will develop scurvy after being in the hospital for only a week. But anyway, the doctor says to Ruth, assuming that she, as the wife, would know this: "Well, of course he has had a long history of mental problems ..."
Ruth did not know this. Ruth was not aware she had married a loony-tunes manic-depressive who is fixated on polluted water to the degree that he is willing to live in a bomb shelter permanently. No. She thought she was marrying a sexy loving geologist who just had some communication issues with his family.
Long point longer: Something like: "I have a history of paranoid schizophrenia" should probably not be withheld from the significant other. It should probably be revealed early on in the dating process, so that the mate is not blindsided by the information. We should always feel free to CHOOSE what we are getting into, and a history of mental illness is important information.
Same thing with sexually transmitted diseases, obviously.
Or information like: "I only have 5 months to live." I would want to know that from the get-go.
Also, if someone is, say, $100,000 in debt ... I think you should obviously know that before settling down with the person. Do you want to marry someone who carries such a huge amount of debt? Are you willing to take that on?
Again: it's important that you feel that you are choosing all this stuff, that even if you do say Yes to this person, at least you know exactly what you are getting into.
All of these things are clues. If someone says, "No. I don't have a raging case of herpes", and they are lying and sleep with you anyway? That's cause for justifiable homicide. Tell the truth. Don't lie if it's going to hurt the other person.
But I also don't think you should always feel the need to tell the truth, and for the same reason. I think sometimes we, in relationships, need to manage our OWN problems, and not involve the partner in every single emotional decision we make, no matter how trivial. People get all caught up in telling EVERYTHING, every thought, breath, up, down ... This to them is "honesty".
But what did Yeats say? "Never give all the heart ..."
Wise words, wise words.
You ever see that movie Closer? They talked a lot about "truth" in that movie. "If I can't be totally truthful with you ..." "I need to be honest with you ..." Well, you know what truth and honesty looked like to me in that movie? A lot of pain and torment. No relaxation whatsoever. Brutality. They used "truth" to hurt one another, to get back at one another. They used "honesty" as a weapon. I have seen couples in real life do this. They spend an exhaustive amount of time being "truthful' and coming clean about EVERYTHING... when from my point of view: why bring it up? What difference does it make? Can you handle working out certain problems on your own? Or do you need constant supervision from your mate?
I can talk myself out of a tizzy fit. Something will happen, a boyfriend will say something that sets me off on a tizzy ... but within 2 or 3 seconds, I can say: "Okay. Wait. You're totally over-reacting. Stop." I don't feel the need to divulge to him every time that happens. Is that a lie? I know some people who feel if they are not basically using their boyfriend as their own Journal, and using him as the repository for every single thought that comes through their heads, then they are not being "honest".
If my boyfriend goes out with his friends and gets a lap dance ... uhm ... am I supposed to feel threatened, first of all? Because I kind of don't. And second of all ... why would he need to tell me? I don't care. I see women put their men through the WRINGER over stuff like this, and I just don't. Like, they ANGST about it, they PUNISH their men over it, they feel almost like he's cheated ... Now if my boyfriend was going to a strip club on a nightly basis, that might give me some pause. But on occasion? Strip clubs don't bother me in the least. I just don't care. Get a lap dance, man, live it up. I don't need to hear about it, you don't need to confess ... and you don't need to feel guilty if you don't tell me. Besides, I'll be home watching Only Angels Have Wings for the third time in a row, which is my equivalent of a strip club ... so if you're not threatened by that behavior, then I'm not threatened by your behavior.
I'm not a big fan of total truth. I'm not a big fan of unblinkered honesty. I think it can get exhausting, and I think a lot of joy and happiness depends on cutting the other person SOME SLACK. And not RIDING THE PERSON'S ASS ALL THE TIME asking them to tell the truth, be honest, share more, share more ...
Uhm, you know what? Please don't share TOO much.
If I've gained 10 pounds, you can rest assured that I already KNOW THAT, and if I ask you, "Does this dress make me look fat?" I am not asking for the truth. I am asking you to reassure me, and tell me I look attractive. This is Dealing With Women 101, and most men know the rules. I do not think we should prey on one another's insecurities. If I am aware that my boyfriend is insecure about, say, his paunch, or his receding hairline (regardless of the fact that I think he's a gorgeous hunk!!) - then I will not mention it. I will not make him more aware of it, and I will bombard him with reassurances of how hot I think he is.
Dear prospective mate: Do I need to know that you were so in love with your ex-girlfriend that when she broke up with you you sold your house, shaved your head, became a Buddhist monk, set yourself on fire, and lived to tell the tale?
Well, actually, yes. I do need to hear that story, because it sounds like a good one.
But to detail every relationship? Especially as I get older, this becomes less and less important to me. Yeah, we all have pasts. My past gets longer by the second. So what. What are we doing right NOW?
There are times, in the early parts of a relationship, when "confessing" stuff is beautiful, part of getting closer. You know. When questions like: "What were you like in high school?" are asked, and then long monologues ensue, with much laughter. Fun conversations where you sort of get caught up on the person's life from before the point at which you met them. I love conversations like that. (I'm only into them once I feel comfortable with the guy, though. If I feel like I'm being interrogated on my past too aggressively - or if it's a quid pro quo kind of thing too early in the game - I get cagey and vague with my answers. You have to earn my trust, it doesn't come on the first date. But I remember with my first boyfriend, we would have these looooong beautiful hilarious conversations where we would tell each other stories from our own childhoods. It was awesome.)
But the nitty-gritty of past relationships? Nah, keep it to yourself. I'm certainly gonna keep the nitty-gritty of my past relationships to myself. It doesn't matter. Let's just start from the here and now, see where that takes us.
More Divas on the topics of LIES:
Fistful of Fortnights, Kathy, Twisty, Silk, and Chrissy (she's the one I'm understudying for - thanks, girl!!)
And the boys weigh in on this topic!
The Wizard, Phin, Stiggy, and Naked Villainy
It's an awesome thing ... all the different opinions, and weigh-ins ... Definitely click around and see what everyone is saying.
Thanks for inviting me to be an honorary Diva, girls!
Posted by sheilaGreat job, darlin! We're ever so pleased to have you with us! ;)
Posted by: Kathy at June 21, 2005 12:27 PMThanks, Kathy ... it was fun.
Posted by: red at June 21, 2005 12:31 PMI love this post. It shows not only that you're a mature, responsible adult but that you're just a rockstar by nature.
Something that makes me a little annoyed in general is when friends and/or lovers overshare in lieu of real intimacy (oversharing by talking about their bowel habits, for instance). One thing I love, love, love about Z is he knows when to be quiet. His silence is the best mirror ever - because it makes me examine my own words, and so often I'll say something and he'll be quiet, and I'll end up laughing at my own absurdity. He doesn't overtalk. He doesn't undertalk. That way, everything he says is weighted with honesty and truth, and I can trust it absolutely.
I'm trying to learn how to be honest about my life. For over twenty years I've never said a word about my childhood, or if I did, I'd lie. Then I just started to realize that by selling lies, I wasn't helping people who were interested in me, and I wasn't dealing with the past the way I needed to.
Okay, I'm rambling now. Blame it on mommy brain, and the fact that everything you write is so compelling!
Posted by: RTG at June 21, 2005 1:05 PMRTG:
"His silence is the best mirror ever - because it makes me examine my own words, and so often I'll say something and he'll be quiet, and I'll end up laughing at my own absurdity."
That's beautiful. Yeah, totally. You can pretty much work stuff out on your own, but he's not going anywhere in the meantime. Comfort.
Very cool.
Posted by: red at June 21, 2005 1:35 PMI think there is a time and place for everything. My first long term relationship was filled with sharing stories. (His, however, were embellishments, I found out later). But we knew each others triggers and used to do things to deliberately hurt one another when we were mad. Because he knew all my past hurts, he could do it whenever. And vice versa.
Now, my boyfriend and I share past information when its relevant. Like, when I realize that I am over-reacting to a situation, I freak out. We deal with it, then the next day, Im like, "look, that was about me, not you and this is why." I think those kind of conversations can be totally helpful. Its all a learning process, being with someone. I think lying is 100% wrong, but there is a time and place to share certain things with your partner. And they'll come up when its time.
Posted by: LB at June 21, 2005 1:41 PM"Something like: 'I have a history of paranoid schizophrenia' should probably not be withheld from the significant other"
Dealing With Women 101: Hey I remember that class, it's one of the many I failed miserably. Luckily the Wife realizes I'm a simpleton and only kicks, slaps and chastises when absolutely necessary.
Great Post.
phin: hahaha
Exactly - this goes back to my essential point which is:
Let's all just cut each other some SLACK. And don't sweat the small stuff. And other such cliches.
Posted by: red at June 21, 2005 2:20 PMWhoops forgot to finish my thought: "Something like: 'I have a history of paranoid schizophrenia' should probably not be withheld from the significant other" so when is the proper time to tell your wife about the multiple voices in your head?
It just never seems like the right moment.
Posted by: phin at June 21, 2005 2:22 PMOne of the things I've hated hated hated about dating; people who mistake "a solipsistic desire to inflict self-serving cruelty" with "honesty".
Posted by: mitch at June 21, 2005 3:17 PMHow do you cope with; "now tell me what you really think"? Combined with a very direct look, surely it is very difficult for anyone to deceive a sensitive partner?
Posted by: Ken at June 21, 2005 5:03 PMI suppose it's all in how you say it.
I am very sensitive to when people are blowing smoke up my ass, and lying to me (especially when it comes to my work). But criticism is a delicate thing. You gotta have some diplomacy.
if it's criticism aimed to help me grow? I am ALL FOR IT. But if it's aimed to cut me down? You will have an enemy for life.
I've had friends come to see me in bad plays and their responses have ENRAGED ME because it was so dishonest. Like: don't fucking LIE to me, I KNOW that play was a piece of crap, so don't condescendingly tell me "Good job" as though I'm a fucking idiot. Give me some credit.
So there's THAT way to go.
But then I've had awesome conversations with other friends after they came to see a bad show I was in, where we have great talks about what went wrong with the production, how my performance could be improved, etc.
It's all in how you put the truth.
But don't lie to me and think I'll buy it. ESPECIALLY when it comes to my work. You can lie to me and tell me I'm the most beautiful woman in the entire world. haha I know it's not true, but that doesn't bother me. If you're doing it too woo me then it will probably work.
But you lie to me about what you think about my work, and we are DONE. I need someone who 'gets' my work.
Posted by: red at June 21, 2005 5:13 PMKen - and yeah, come to think of it - after babbling back an answer for 5 minutes ... I think there's a difference between holding stuff back and outright deception.
Like I mentioned in the post: If my boyfriend spent more hours at a strip club than he did with me, and he also lied about it - then I would probably break up with him.
But here's the deal: If I come to my boyfriend, and hand him my latest short story, and say: "Tell me what you really think", then I really mean that. I really want to know.
Posted by: red at June 21, 2005 5:15 PMSo how should one respond if you were to say, "Does this suck?" about the same story? By analogy with the "Do I look fat in this dress?", question, one should lie, if necessary, to say something nice. (I'm sure that would never be necessary with your stories, this is just a hypothetical of course.)
FWIW, I'd like to think that I'd see the phrasings above as requests for validation rather than criticism, but when presented with a question, I tend to see it as a problem to be solved rather than an emotional minefield to be maneuvered through. And I'm pretty sure that 20 years ago I wouldn't even have seen a difference between the two phrasings. I may have been truly clue-deficient then, but I don't think I was (am?) alone.
And what if it did suck (or looked truly horrible, in the case of a dress)? FWIW, I think that at some point you need to be willing to fall on the grenade and tell the unwanted truth. But making the switch from being reassuring to a necessary, if unpleasant, honesty is hard to time or phrase well.
In the interest of full disclosure, I suppose I should note that this isn't entirely academic for me, as I both write and edit for a living. I've needed some pretty direct criticism at times, probably more often than I've gotten it; not that that makes it pleasant to receive.
Posted by: Doug Sundseth at June 21, 2005 7:29 PMCrap,
Does the fact that I'm well over $100,000 in debt mean I'll never have a chance at getting married? Who wouldn't want to take that on and release me from the oppression? I guess I need a sugar momma.
Posted by: Jay at June 21, 2005 8:58 PMJay - We all should have a sugar momma.
Posted by: red at June 21, 2005 11:46 PMDoug -
I definitely compartmentalize. When it comes to my work, I only can deal with objective critiques. And objective critiques can be good or bad, I don't care ... But platitudes fill me with a sense of danger and dishonesty.
But I need my boyfriend to tell me he thinks I'm beautiful, plain and simple. Hopefully, if he's with me, he already thinks I'm beautiful, so it's not a huge struggle for him to tell me so. And I can give as good as I get ... this is not a one-way street.
But with my work? Really, I can only deal with brutal truth.
My best acting teacher would cut right to the heart of things with me. I would finish my work and say to him immediately, "Okay ... so what worked with what I just did?"
He would tell me everything I did right. Which gave me confidence - which you need, when you're an artist. To hear that you have nailed something, that you are on the right track ... And I have talent, so there was always SOMEthing i was doing right.
Then, I would always ask, "So what next? What didn't I get? What didn't work? What's the next step?"
And he would give it to me straight.
I would trust this man with my life ... because he always gave it to me straight, good or bad.
Posted by: red at June 21, 2005 11:51 PMI'll watch "Only Angels Have Wings" with you anytime. Your place or mine - since I know we both have a copy :)
Posted by: CW at June 22, 2005 12:07 AMBrutal truth is good - at the right time.
Bull$hit also works - at the right time.
Timing is everything.
When I know I've done sweet F all, my boss ragging at me will pi$$ me off, but only because I have no defense, because he is right.
When I "look fat" in a dress, I already know it. I'm with you, Red. Tell me how you're still attracted to me anyway (ideally without mentioning the extra 10 lbs).
"...Dear prospective mate: Do I need to know that you were so in love with your ex-girlfriend that when she broke up with you you sold your house, shaved your head, became a Buddhist monk, set yourself on fire, and lived to tell the tale?
Well, actually, yes. I do need to hear that story, because it sounds like a good one.
But to detail every relationship?...My past gets longer by the second..."
I am so with you on that. Enough already. Kids? (yes/no, regardless, an important question). Marriages? (may go to commitment, may not, depends).
As the ultimate single, Bridget Jones, would ask, "Are you a fuckwit?" (probably THE most important question you can ask, and there is really never a good time to ask it).
I could go on, but will spare everyone. Excellent post.
Posted by: Candace at June 25, 2005 2:02 AM