Again, just like my April viewing diary, this will be a pretty tough read for anyone not into Supernatural. It may be a tough read for those who DO watch Supernatural (especially if you loved the last 3 seasons. If this applies to you: my apologies in advance. I’m just speaking my truth.) I decided to re-watch straight through Season 11 to Season 14. Season 12 left such a bad taste in my mouth I’ve never re-watched a single episode. (I re-watched “Regarding Dean” last month for my piece on men looking at themselves in the mirror.)
But it was an interesting experiment and some things have occurred to me through this experience.
1. Binge-watching Season 12 is a much different experience than watching it drip out in real time. Binging covers up a multitude of sins. The momentum helps. It’s a way better season binged. It’s still not in any way, shape or form, good, and I hate SO MUCH OF IT, but the binge-format helps HIDE a lot of the bad-ness of it.
2. Season 12 works beautifully compared to season 13. Season 13 is so mis-guided, so … awful … with so many elements that don’t work … that I watch, thinking, “What the FUCK am I subjecting myself to?” Dinosaurs? Freakin’ “dark Kaia” with a sword, twirling and whirling through a primeval forest, are you fucking KIDDING me. I dislike trash-talking actors. In general, I avoid it. But Asmodeus? The Wayward girls? Mary Winchester? The drop-off in quality is alarming. Season 13 makes Season 12 look like a masterpiece.
So those are my two macro observations. I am glad I submitted to a re-watch. It was illuminating.
This is going to be a pretty grim read.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 1 “Out of the Darkness, Into the Fire” (2015; d. Robert Singer)
Ah, we had such hopes then.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 2 “Form and Void” (2015; d. Philip Sgriccia)
Of all the badass things Sam has ever done, this has got to be Top 5 Badassery.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 3 “The Bad Seed” (2015; d. Jensen Ackles)
I was so into the potential of Amara. Not for any reason other than it put Dean into a zone we had never seen before. Something new. A challenge from within. It SOFTENED him. This was the tension of Season 11 until it all went to hell. Also, my God, look at this:
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 4 “Baby” (2015; d. Thomas J. Wright)
A masterpiece. Top 5 of the entire series. Side note: I have many thoughts on Castiel, especially watching these last 3 seasons back to back. He is such a liability – how many times has he made poor choices that fuck everything up? I mean, he freakin’ broke Sam’s brain. This is a betrayal on such a deep level – and it’s SAM – which is Dean’s Achilles heel. Hell, it’d be my Achilles heel too. You break my brother’s BRAIN? You’re not FAMILY anymore, pal. In my opinion, Dean’s “You’re dead to me” in Season 14 was a long time coming. Here, in “Baby,” the use of Castiel is the best use of the character in YEARS. He’s a voice on the phone, he’s support staff, he’s deadpan and literal (very funny), and he’s there but not there. He’s there in SERVICE to the brothers. It works totally. Everything about this episode is perfect.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 5 “Thin Lizzie” (2015; d. Rashaad Ernesto Green)
The exchange about the “toilet water” is hilarious.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 6 “Our Little World” (2015; d. John F. Showalter)
This scene, people. THIS SCENE. They WENT THERE.
Alien (1979; d. Ridley Scott)
Brie Larson has been going around saying she’s proud to be the first woman to head up a Marvel franchise (which, of course, is great). But she goes on: she’s playing someone that little girls FINALLY can look up to. As though we’ve been in a desert until she came along. She’s so happy to “normalize” the idea of a woman heading up an action franchise. Hey, Brie. Watch more movies.
Aliens (1986; d. James Cameron)
For my second column on Film Comment, I wrote about the relationship of Ripley and Hicks in Aliens. The reaction to this column was overwhelming.
Extremely Wicked, Shockingly Evil and Vile (2019; d. Joe Berlinger)
Zac Efron is so damn good in this. I reviewed the film for Ebert.
Dead to Me, Season 1, episode 1 (2019; d. Amy York Rubin)
Allison made me watch the pilot for this series, and it was wonderful. I already love both of these actresses so much, and the material is really really interesting. I will continue on with it!
Non-Fiction (2019; d. Olivier Assayas)
I’m a big fan of Assayas’ work (and his collaboration with Binoche). His latest feels very Woody-Allen-inspired.
Tolkien (2019; d. Dome Karukoski)
I reviewed the film for Ebert.
The Letter (1940; d. William Wyler)
One of Bette Davis’ very best. On another level. All I will say is: watch the movie again and watch her right hand throughout, the hand that shot the gun in the first scene. The hand remembers what she did. Always.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 7 “Plush” (2015; d. Tim Andrew)
I have many thoughts, too, with this re-watch, at what the Wayward thing did to Donna and Jody. I’m sorry if my comments upset people. I am just speaking my own truth. I understand people are into different things for different reasons. So my comments are not meant like “You’re stupid if you liked it.” And I do not appreciate those of us who critiqued Wayward Sisters being called sexist, misogynist, all that other bullshit. You do yourself no favors when that’s how you deal with criticisms. I’m just saying what was true for ME. Donna is sort of a Charlie stand-in, she’s “us,” the regular person who finds herself in these extraordinary circumstances. So was Jody at the start, really. Donna’s “vibe” comes from another world, though, a smiley Midwestern world, completely different from the gloom-doom SPN universe. This puts her in line with Charlie’s energy, too. Plus the fact that she’s a woman. So they’re these cheerful positive women who somehow get into the inner circle, as friends, and it’s a wonderful thing, when it works. Separating Donna out, into the so-called “badass” world of Wayward … just didn’t work. She works best in COMPARISON with Sam and Dean. This is one of my drum-beats. These secondary characters – whether it’s Donna or Garth or, hell, Amelia – work only in so far as what they help reveal about Sam and Dean. It works best when these are fully fleshed-out real and eccentric characters. Like Ellen and Jo. Donna is more one-dimensional than Ellen and Jo, but her THING works really well in connection to Sam and Dean. She’s a new element, she’s different, she’s a wild-card thrown into the mix. Suddenly, though, all that eccentricity vanished in the Wayward pilot … suddenly she’s a badass with a flamethrower and a huge smile … and there’s nothing to compare her to. Donna can’t exist in a vacuum. This is the thing about the concept of the show, and what Kripke set up in the pilot, and which many fans (weirdly) seem to resent. This is the Sam and Dean show. You can’t escape it. You can TRY, and Dabb has tried. And he has failed. I mean, now we have a huge cast of random AU hunters walking through the bunker, NONE of whom are distinct, and NONE of whom reveal ANYthing about Sam and Dean. There is a fundamental misunderstanding at the TOP LEVEL at what the show even IS. At any rate, all of this is to say: Watching “Plush” is a relief. Because this is where Donna can shine. In contrast to the brothers.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 8 “Just My Imagination” (2015; d. Richard Speight Jr.)
Peak Supernatural. Season 11 was so good. We’re moving into a really really strong sequence of episodes here. I watch this one all the time. I pop it in on the regular. “Drop Dead Fred.” “Totoro.” “So let’s say Bozo’s legit. Which … hello, Crazy Town, but okay …”
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 9 “O Brother, Where Art Thou?” (2015; d. Robert Singer)
Here is where they started to make choices which SEEMED strong … very VERY strong … but which then somehow … imploded. They brought back into play things we hadn’t heard about since Season 5: the cage. Michael. Lucifer. (Humorously: no mention of poor Adam.) So Sam’s been getting these visions. He thinks God is telling him something. Instead it’s been Lucifer. Which is all delightfully sick, with all kinds of consent issues (I love the “problematic” consent on Supernatural. The whole damn show is about people having other things inside of them without their consent.) The promise of this sequence, the look on Sam’s face when he realizes what has happened … is that much more upsetting when you realize how Sam was betrayed (by the showrunners/writers) in the last 3 episodes, where he’s in the presence of Lucifer and is like, “Ho hum, family therapy, why are planets round.”
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 10 “The Devil in the Details” (2015; d. Thomas J. Wright)
There’s been an angel smiting. Castiel offers to take Dean’s temperature. Lucifer takes Sam on a walk down memory lane, which reminds me of the “lessons” Zachariah gave Sam and Dean about playing their roles. It’s an interesting concept and brings up another “old issue” – how Sam chose to not look for Dean in Purgatory. These are the kinds of callbacks I love, because there’s always unfinished business.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 11 “Into the Mystic” (2016; d. John Badham)
This is a really good episode. It does everything it needs to do. It propels forward the various arcs, but it also deepens our understanding of where Sam and Dean are at. Retirement home pamphlet? Forming bonds with Dee Wallace and the Irish hunter? Women? Women in their world? It’s so rare. These are two lovely additions. It hurts me to watch this now. Considering.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 12 “Don’t You Forget About Me” (2016; d. Stefan Pleszczynski)
This episode is like mainlining some glorious drug directly into your veins. Even the LENGTHY monster monologue at the end can’t tarnish it. This was the last period where it was exciting to tune into Supernatural every week, because each episode was fantastic. And Jody? See my comments above in re: Donna. In the Wayward episode, something happened to the character of Jody: it was both pushed and also flattened out. Kim Rhodes was pushing. Which … she NEVER does. And because she pushed her emotions, subtlety was lost. There was no HUMOR – which was also a death knell. Again: these are amazing characters – Jody, Donna – even Claire and Alex – but they’re only interesting in conjunction with Sam and Dean. Once you remove them out into their own context, you see there’s not much “there there.” They serve a purpose in Supernatural, and an IMPORTANT purpose.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 13 “Love Hurts” (2016; d. Philip Sgriccia)
Another fascinating episode, with one of my favorite final scenes in recent memory. Their acting work, their scene work and character work … ACES. What was so exciting to me about this Amara thing was it was brand-new territory. And yes, she was a Big Bad, but she was also a woman in a flowing black dress with swelling cleavage, bringing into the picture all kinds of metaphors and associations. (This was the problem, one of the many problems with the BMOL. They brought with them nothing but their gear.) So Dean “succumbing” to Amara is, yes, “literal” – but literal on multiple levels. For example, “Into the Mystic” wouldn’t “fit” in any other season. But it fits in this season, because Dean’s dream-world and psyche is being dominated by this mysterious woman – who doesn’t THREATEN him – but offers him peace and bliss. This was all great stuff and Ackles played it brilliantly.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 14 “The Vessel” (2016; d. John Badham)
ANOTHER great episode. It’s a feature film, basically. Badham put so much care into every single detail: life on the submarine, the break-down of everyone’s duties, as WELL as the casting of that terrific ensemble. They didn’t look like modern men with a cell phone just off-screen. And as highly designed as the episode was, with all these elements, and explosions, and submarines … what’s great about it is that it was all for naught. The mission was a bust (on one level). Dean came back empty-handed. But he was changed by what he saw. Ackles’ line reading of “I was just a witness…” I have goosebumps as I type those words. Also, you get to see him in a sailor hat.
The Terminator (1984; d. James Cameron)
A re-watch for the Michael-Biehn factor.
Trial by Fire (2019; d. Ed Zwick)
I reviewed for Ebert.
Rolling Thunder Revue (2019; d. Martin Scorsese)
This one is under embargo until June 10, so I can’t say anything about it.
Charlie Says (2019; d. Mary Harron)
Allison and I went to go see this. I love Mary Harron’s work. I probably know far too much about the Manson girls. What this did really well was show the slow creep of brainwashing. The point where you reach the point of no return. I still don’t feel sorry for those girls.
1969 (2019; ABC News).
Allison and I watched two episodes in the ABC News series, on the Manson Girls and on Chappaquiddick. Thank goodness for my friendship with Allison. We are so much in sync, and we’ve been that way since the jump. I love her.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 15 “Beyond the Mat” (2016; d. Jerry Wanek)
I miss my show. To quote that song, “Look what they’ve done to my show, Ma.”
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 16 “Safe House” (2016; d. Stefan Pleszczynski)
This episode really really gets to me. I think it’s funny that the whole concept is so confusing they have to explain it to each other repeatedly. But I loved the structure of the episode, and the overall gloom of that “nest.” So good to see Rufus, too.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 17 “Red Meat” (2016; d. Nina Lopez-Corrado)
Jesus, God, this episode is a work-out. And I just want to point out: please notice how many episodes we’ve had in a row where it’s just Sam and Dean. I am now re-watching Season 13/14 and there are sometimes FOUR plots per episode. Like I give a shit about Asmodeus trying to gain control of Hell, or Nick trying to avenge his family, or … what the FUCK, Dabb. Side note: LOOK at how strong Season 11 is thus far. It’s amazing.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 18 “Hell’s Angel” (2016; d. Philip Sgriccia)
Let’s bring Cas back. Oh, right, because he said Yes to Lucifer. Add that to the list of Castiel’s poor choices. At what point do you say, “Hey, Cas. Stop ‘helping.'”
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 19 “The Chitters” (2016; d. Eduardo Sánchez)
This episode has a wild woolly atmosphere I really really love. The actor who plays the disgraced hermit sheriff has a freakin’ TOUR DE FORCE acting scene. His pain is palpable. I love the young hot sheriff. I love the “ganja girl.” I love the hot-to-trot lady lusting over Sam. And the “hunter couple” are a wonderful mirror of Sam and Dean – this is how you do it.
Fosse/Verdon, Season 1, episode 3 “Me and My Baby” (2019; d. Adam Bernstein)
This sequence killed me. I need to write about Michelle Williams’ performance in this. She’s a fine actress. But this has been a breakthrough for her. She’s on another level now.
Fosse/Verdon, Season 1, episode 4 “Glory” (2019; d. Jessica Yu)
There are definitely valid critiques to be made about the series, its approach, its direction, fact vs. fiction, etc. If you know a lot about this subject – as I do – it’s difficult to ignore some of that stuff. However: what the series DOES do, and it does it wonderfully well, is it gets inside this marriage – not just the conventional marriage aspect of it – but the ARTISTIC marriage aspect of it. Which is all that interests me, anyway. Fosse’s choreography is not about sex so much as it is about trauma and sex combined. There is no catharsis in his view of sex. Sex is pleasurable but it is also frightening. The series gets into this.
Fosse/Verdon, Season 1, episode 5 “Where Am I Going” (2019; d. Thomas Kail)
Ann Reinking enters the scene. And it’s fascinating. Again: Michelle Williams is killing it. Hers is one of the performances of the year for me.
Fosse/Verdon, Season 1, episode 6 “All I Care About Is Love” (2019; d. Minkie Spiro)
The approach towards Chicago … and suddenly their 10 year old daughter is 14. Overnight.
They Were Expendable (1945; d. John Ford)
Recently, someone on Twitter asked, “What is your favorite war movie?” Off the top of my head, I answered with They Were Expendable. Bleak. Realistic. Excellent.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 20 “Don’t Call Me Shurley” (2016; d. Robert Singer)
And here is where it all started to go wrong. After “Fan Fiction,” I felt like the amulet/Samulet had been “handled,” the arc closed out in the most perfect way possible. To quote Kim Manners: “Give them what they want but not in a way they expect.” And then this team had to go fuck it up. And then never fucking mention it. Dean never says, “Wait … you kept the amulet?” Sam: “Yeah, man, I knew you’d regret it” – SOMEthing. Nope. Ugh. And Chuck. No. I loved Chuck. I don’t like Chuck as God.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 21 “All in the Family” (2016; d. Thomas J. Wright)
This scene (in the Gif) with Amara in the forest shows how it still could have been salvaged. We could have avoided the DEBACLE that was episodes 22 and 23. The Amara arc is still present here, trembling in the air between them, in his temptation – for what? For peace, bliss, oblivion, but also … WOMAN. And what Woman represents in this archetypal male world. And what is fascinating is: ultimately he DOESN’T get to “have” Amara – but what he DOES get to “have” is his mother, returned from the dead. Woman as Interchangeable Symbols – which makes sense to someone like Dean, who grew up motherless, who watched his mother burn. This is what the show has explored – implicitly and explicitly – over 11 years – and it’s all here, in embryo: his yearning towards Boobalicious Amara – his ultimate choice to destroy himself – and then his reunion with Mum. God, there are so many “how great it might have been” missed opportunities in this rich material.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 22 “We Happy Few” (2016; d. John Badham)
Terrible. Even the blocking was bad. Everyone standing around like statues. Sam “taking on” the Mark? And we don’t get to see that scene where his decision is made? BAD. Dean being like “No, Sammy! Well, okay, Sammy”? NO. BAD. And please: I KNOW that the showrunner left, and everything was in chaos. I KNOW it and I don’t CARE.
Supernatural, Season 11, episode 23 “Alpha and Omega” (2016; d. Philip Sgriccia)
I’m going to say some mean things about Castiel. I know that this is a torched and toxic landscape in the fandom and I don’t mean to add to it. I am just talking about his PURPOSE in the STORY and how he has HAD no purpose in the story for about five years – EXCEPT to make poor choices, REALLY poor choices. Did I mention he broke Sam’s brain on purpose? This scene between Dean and Cas in the car … I felt like I was having an out-of-body experience as I watched it. It’s the first moment where the regular language of the show – “You’re like family” – suddenly sounded hollow. It made no sense. It’s an ominous harbinger.
Fleabag, Season 2
I was an absolute wreck at the end of this. I was kind of shocked at how much it got to me. I actually found myself in tears about my “hot priest” (although he wasn’t a priest), the man who loved me, whom I loved, but it didn’t work out. We had almost an identical conversation as the one they had at the bus station in the final episode. I was a wreck. I am so in awe of this show. Huge huge fan.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 1 “Keep Calm and Carry On” (2016; d. Philip Sgriccia)
I gritted my teeth and popped in Disc 1. I practically have PTSD from the first go-round. Almost everything made me sad. Because Mary’s return is also RICH with possibility, none of which they explored. Or, they DID but then they dropped it. And they ruined the character, and also torched the symbolic atmosphere in which “Mary” – the memory of Mom – lived. And it just drove home how much a part of the show that symbolic atmosphere really was. To see Jared’s wincing face as he talked to Samantha Smith – like, barely tolerating her … I’ll have more to say about this. Also: the BMOL. Terrible. Terrible choice. Nothing interesting about it. Sam and Dean had never heard of the BMOL? In this day and age of the Internet? Please. To make the Big Bad in Season 12 be human beings is a BREAK with the contract of the show, its reason for being, the “family business” itself. I’m appalled. However: Sam being tortured underneath a shower nozzle was erotic as hell.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 2 “Mamma Mia” (2016; d. Thomas J. Wright)
Unfortunately, the ridiculous fan flip-out about the “lack of consent” in this scene (which – IS THE POINT) – was so loud and so out of control I fear it reached the writers’ room and they backed off of anything even attempting to be ambiguous. But the show has been ambiguous about consent for 11 years. Honest to God. I don’t like to complain on Twitter or scream at writers, tagging them. Not only do I not like to do this, I find the behavior appalling and childish. Unfortunately, there are many who do not agree, and so they’re the ones who get the most attention.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 3 “The Foundry” (2016; d. Robert Singer)
I had almost blanked out Rick Springfield’s tenure on the show. I love Rick Springfield. I was very excited to see what they might do with evil masking as celebrity. It was a bust. There are too many damn characters in this show now. Also, and this is really granular: in one of the scenes between Cas and Crowley, Misha Collins gave a hugely sarcastic line reading. There are so many problems with this. First of all, it’s a problem with the writing: these new writers don’t seem to understand that Castiel doesn’t hear sarcasm, he’s literal. But this was an eyeroll line. And Collins, instead of … realizing the problem and either undercutting it or intervening (and he has intervened before at other times) … he sneered his line sarcastically and I remember my first reaction: WHAT was THAT. Everything felt “off.”
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 4 “American Nightmare” (2016; d. John F. Showalter)
This is where the bottom dropped out for me, although there are good aspects to this episode. First of all, that the issue of Mom leaving is “wrapped up” by the end of the episode, giving Supernatural a “what have we all learned from this” movie-of-the-week feeling – which MY GOD MAKE IT STOP – and also to deny SAM any emotions about Mom’s abandonment of them was disgusting. Sam is way too okay too fast. I mean, okay, maybe because he never knew his mother to begin with? But that is the LEAST interesting choice to take, dramatically. So frustrating.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 5 “The One You’ve Been Waiting For” (2016; d. Nina Lopez-Corrado)
This was the first episode that made me angry. Because I didn’t feel like anyone over there understood Dean. They were outside of him, looking in.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 6 “Celebrating the Life of Asa Fox” (2016; d. John Badham)
Appalling. I was sooooo turned off by this episode, and its view of hunters. There’s a reason Eric Kripke burned down the roadhouse in Season 2. Because he wanted to avoid presenting hunters like THIS. The montage that opens it – Asa Fox, killing things, loving the ladies in his car, one lady after the other, all with a smile on his face – it was so gross, just the VIEW of this guy was so one-dimensional, and again, it felt like the writers over there are outside the world of hunters, looking in. They think that this is what WE like about hunters. I don’t know. It was very very weird. And then ret-conning Mary – still hunting after the birth of Dean – which give me a BREAK. The witch twins were okay, but I don’t understand when witches morphed from “human beings doing creepy things with bodily fluids” to “supernatural beings with lightning bolts coming out of their eyeballs.” This episode really really bugged me and it still does.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 7 “Rock Never Dies” (2016; d. Eduardo Sánchez)
From bad to worse. Dean bitching about how shallow LA is. CLEARLY nobody over there remembers “Hollywood Babylon” or how much Dean LOVES movies and Los Angeles. Also, them pretending to be budding rock stars to get a meet and greet? NO. These characters are SMARTER than that.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 8 “LOTUS” (2016; d. Philip Sgriccia)
Oh, great. Just what I need. POLITICS in my Supernatural.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 9 “First Blood” (2017; d. Robert Singer)
And now I’m feeling insulted. Listen, Sam and Dean are tough, but tough enough to single-handedly take down an entire SWAT team? Member how they high-tailed it out of “Nightshifter”? Also, ENOUGH with Sam and Dean having shoot-outs with other humans. Fuck you, Dabb.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 10 “Lily Sunder Has Some Regrets” (2017; d. Thomas J. Wright)
No memory of this episode. Zero. Nada. Zilch. I watched it thinking, “Wow. DID I see this??” I can tell how burnt out I must have been the first time around from the parade of awful episodes leading up to this one.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 11 “Regarding Dean” (2017; d. John Badham)
This is a beautiful episode. Heartbreaking, funny. It would all work even BETTER if it had come in the middle of season 9. Just imagine how that “bull riding” sequence would look in season 9. But never mind. It’s still a good stand-alone episode and there are a lot of subtle things that make it fun. How the waitress gets upset with herself for messing around with a man who was “roofied up” and he smiles at her like “don’t worry I’m sure it was fun.” Hilarious. HOWEVER, let me point out one thing: Rowena’s presence in the show has ruptured the fabric of what is possible. As long as they have HER on speed-dial, and as long as she is powerful enough to literally return from the dead … then true tension can’t exist. ALSO, in the case of this episode: as long as Rowena is there, it deprives Sam of the opportunity to have to figure it out on his own. It’s like, What did they DO before Rowena was around? Go back and watch. Along with the bunker, I feel that it is Rowena who has truly “broken” the show. I’m sick of all these other people. As I’ve said many times: the main casualty with this new regime is the character of Sam.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 12 “Stuck in the Middle (With You)” (2017; d. Richard Speight Jr.)
No memory of this one. Zero. Nada. I enjoyed it! So that’s something!
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 13 “Family Feud” (2017; d. P.J. Pesce)
Now, apparently, instead of exploring the fact that Mary has moved out, we go into a family melodrama with the Crowleys, and Gavin, and are you kidding me? It’s almost like the writers are AFRAID of the trauma of the Winchesters, and they are acting Victorian about it, hoping it’ll just go away and manage itself. No, you gotta go in DEEPER to the trauma. Nobody cares about Gavin. Also: this is when they started flailing with Crowley. Poor Mark Sheppard.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 14 “The Raid” (2017; d. John MacCarthy)
I can’t remember which episode has the argument with Mary, when Mary tells them she’s been “working with” the BMOL. (Oh ffs). I think it’s this one. At any rate, I am SO glad I went back and watched Season 12, because this is an amazing scene, and Ackles and Padalecki kill it. When Dean calls her “Mary”?? It’s like the world explodes. (And all the dialogue in eps leading up to this: “We don’t have a mom who cooks us chicken soup” “I’m not JUST a mom”, etc., was ridiculous and self-congratulatory, but totally out of place, shoe-horned into a show where it flat out doesn’t belong. This show deals in ARCHETYPES. And Mary/Mother is an archetype. I mean, her name alone. If you want to MESS with that archetype, and have these grown men realize they basically “made up” their mother in her absence – okay, that would be very interesting: but you would have to do a better job than what they’ve done here. Like: dig INTO it, let it be ambivalent, let them have feelings about it, devote whole episodes to it … Making her a woman who abandons her children – BY CHOICE – choosing to hang out instead with her fuck-buddy (who is also a psychopath who okay-ed the torture of one of her sons) … correct me if I’m wrong, but I get the feeling that the people writing this feel that this is female empowerment, that the “feminists” in the audience will be like “You go, Mary Winchester. You TELL your entitled sons you’re not just a mom!” There are not enough eyeballs to roll in the world … Our future looks pretty bleak if THIS is supposed to be an empowerment message. A mother who chooses everything BUT her family. Yeah. I feel more empowered already. But when that “Mary” just flies out of Jensen’s mouth … there it all is, all the missed potential, and it’s such a dig even the stony Smith recoils.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 15 “Somewhere Between Heaven and Hell” (2017; d. Nina Lopez-Corrado)
And then this one made me angry because they basically just left that young girl to her fate. Without looking back, really. “We can’t save this one. Okay, so let’s lie to her and high-tail it out of here.” WHAT HAVE YOU DONE TO SAM AND DEAN.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 16 “Ladies Drink Free” (2017; d. Amyn Kaderali)
So you can tell that the Wayward idea is growing. Unfortunately. The focus is everywhere except where it should be. But this? This is a HELL of a shot.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 17 “The British Invasion” (2017; d. John F. Showalter)
Still angry.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 18 “The Memory Remains” (2017; d. Philip Sgriccia)
This had real potential. I don’t understand the fan love of Mick Davies. I get it. I’m a party-pooper. I was like, “Get these British people off American soil.” It was 1776 all over again. And okay, so Dean has a hookup with a pretty waitress. Finally, someone is getting laid. She works at a coffee shop in the town, where they hang out and re-group while they work the case. So the first time Sam and Dean are there, Dean sees her and instantly wants her. He gets her. Dean rolls in with her the next morning. In a later scene at the coffee shop, later in the episode, Sam and Dean sit at the counter – and this waitress is in the background of some of the shots – and Dean never acknowledges her. They don’t have a moment, acknowledging that they fucked the night before. It’s like it never happened. Again, this is not Dean’s style. This is not Dean. And I think it’s just sloppiness on the part of the people running the thing. All you would need is a tiny moment of eye contact, something, just to keep that little mini-arc afloat. They didn’t used to be sloppy like this. Think of “Monster Movie.” Or “Shadow,” where Dean’s “relationship” with the cop Amy goes on throughout the episode, while he’s in town. It’s just sloppiness – I didn’t feel that Dean “ignoring” her was deliberate, it’s just that they didn’t build in a moment and then forgot to catch it on the day, or caught it but didn’t have time to include it, and etc. and etc. Sloppiness like this is new.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 19 “The Future” (2017; d. Amanda Tapping)
And now THIS iconic moment has been ruined too. They ruin everything. Mary. The Colt. The amulet. Ugh.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 20 “Twigs & Twine & Tasha Banes” (2017; d. Richard Speight Jr.)
I had completely forgotten this one but I enjoyed it.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 21 “There’s Something About Mary” (2017; d. P.J. Pesce)
Rage at seeing a cold-blooded shoot-out with other human beings in the bunker. I don’t care that they’re BMOL. What is a shoot-out with other human beings doing in every episode of this show about killing monsters? This show where Sam and Dean used to have ethical arguments about who it was okay to kill? Who used to draw ethical lines? Now they’re hiding behind pillars and peeking out to pop off a shot at another human being. This is the best Dabb could come up with.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 22 “Who We Are” (2017; d. John F. Showalter)
Shoddy lighting. The main issue, in looking back on this now with some distance, is that she cannot act. And he plays the HELL out of this, like, my God, it’s some of the best work he’s done on the show, and yet … by the time it came around, my reaction was “Meh” and that’s what I can’t forgive.
Supernatural, Season 12, episode 23 “All Along the Watchtower” (2017; d. Robert Singer)
And now the AU comes into the story. Awesome. Even more appalling: now you can kill angels with bullets, which means now we have automatic weapons spraying “angel-killing bullets”. Disgusting.
The Perfection (2019; d. Richard Shepard)
I reviewed this new horror film – out on Netflix – for Ebert.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 1 “Lost and Found” (2017; d. Philip Sgriccia)
Mary and Lucifer wandering around in the “other world.” Asmodeus? Big Daddy accent? WHO CARES. This is the thing: in re-watching Season 12, I remembered why it was such a dismaying experience to watch it, but there was also a lot in it that I enjoyed. Episodes I had forgotten, scenes. And compared to Season 13, Season 12 is a masterpiece. But there’s stuff to enjoy in Season 13 too. Jack. I think young Calvert is wonderful. It’s just that he has now “taken the place” of Castiel – sort of – so now Castiel’s main role is to give Jack pep talks, which continues to this day. At this point, I don’t see how this can be fixed. It’s all too enmeshed, we’re too far gone.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 2 “The Rising Son” (2017; d. Thomas J. Wright)
The shedeem? What the hell? And we never hear about them again? Also: why is Sam like totally okay with Mom being dead and Cas being dead? He’s immediately trying to reassure Dean – which completely cuts off the character’s humanity.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 3 “Patience” (2017; d. Robert Singer)
Where do I even begin. First of all: good to see you, Missouri! Glad you’ve been brought back in order to be murdered. Also: Missouri was not a hunter. She was a psychic. Why is she suddenly a HUNTER? Off on hunts when she was raising her son? Honestly, these writers … They don’t know what they’re doing over there. I love how this high school girl is suddenly a Ninja when it comes time to defend herself. No hesitation! (Eyeroll.) Season 13 is interrupted by this parade towards Wayward and it’s really unfortunate.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 4 “The Big Empty” (2017; d. John Badham)
I am just not sure why this primeval black-ooze in The Big Empty speaks like Malcolm McDowell in Clockwork Orange.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 5 “Advanced Thanatology” (2017; d. John F. Showalter)
The CASE here was excellent, as was the incredible set for that maniac doctor’s lair. There were some truly spooky moments. Here’s where we learn Billie is now Death. Which, okay. I’m okay with Billie. But then I look back on the eccentricity of the first “Death” … and I see how much has been lost, and how this new team is incapable of coming up with anything that unique. Billie is scary and intimidating, but she’s also a flat-line. There’s a sameness in her affect. You never doubt she means business but still … think of the original Death. The other issue, yet again, has to do with Sam, and how Sam is presented. Suddenly, it seems almost out of nowhere, Sam is on a campaign to give Dean everything he wants, to “make him feel better.” Want to have a beer at breakfast? Go check out a strip club! Have fun! This is just evidence that nobody over there knows how to write Sam anymore: it’s VAGUE. Everything is him being “concerned about others.” Like, that’s his personality. Think about Sam’s journey over the series, think about everything he’s done and seen and been through … and this is the best these people can do for Sam? Final thing: Ackles plays hung over so well that I felt dehydrated just watching him.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 6 “Tombstone” (2017; d. Nina Lopez-Corrado)
This is entertaining. It’s entertaining to see Dean geek out. The production design was good, they went all out with the “motel room.” They put some thought into character development: rockabilly undertaker! Castiel works well here, as support staff, but you can see which way the wind is blowing: he is now totally Jack-focused, and there are many scenes of the two of them chatting, Castiel mentoring him. Maybe this flies well with a naive teenage audience (I say with no snark: I realize the audience is a diverse one. I’m bored with it, but it must work well for someone). I am vaguely frustrated by the fact that Sam clearly notices the awesome-ness of the rockabilly undertaker – and then nothing happens with it. It may sound like I’m wishing these guys would fall in love. That’s not it at all. But to be engaged with the reality they’re confronted with – in a subtle and real way – this is what the show used to be able to do in its sleep. Think of Dean and Melanie (my fave) in “The Mentalists” and how a little unrequited romance thing developed, giving that already entertaining episode another type of spark. This is what is lost here. This is what I felt in the way Jared looked at her: he was taken with her. Nobody over there is capable of sensing these subtleties now and running with it. Season 3 Dean would never “ignore” the coffee shop waitress he’d been banging for the whole episode. My “take” is that Sam “noticing” how pretty the undertaker was, and being drawn to her, was all just Jared being a good actor, filling in the blanks of a script that didn’t give him anything to do. And so, the potential just …. sits there.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 7 “War of the Worlds” (2017; d. Richard Speight Jr.)
Castiel and Lucifer … okay. Once again, though, Misha Collins was allowing a sarcastic line reading to come into play. He’s getting sloppy. And now … freakin’ Ketch is back too. I do enjoy his performance, even though I can’t stand the BMOL. Dean and Sam constantly have to compromise their ethics to “work with” people/monsters they find abhorrent (Crowley! Rowena!) … but Ketch is a horse of a different color. I don’t get the fan love of him, at all.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 8 “The Scorpion and the Frog” (2017; d. Robert Singer)
At this point, I have no idea what Season 13 is trying to do. I have no sense of any arc whatsoever. In my opinion, the focus of the “team” was in developing a spin-off so that they could have job security after Supernatural ended. So who cares about Season 13 and the show they’re actually writing for? This is what I sense. I sense these characters, this show, being taken for granted. That being said, there was a lot to like here, mainly Dean’s bonding with the safe-cracker. He was a cranky Gen-Xer, and I always appreciate it when Dean goes that route, because I relate.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 9 “The Bad Place” (2017; d. Philip Sgriccia)
Kaia. And Patience. And grrrl power. And dinosaurs. None of it feels real. To those who are like, “It’s a show about killing monsters, why do you want real?” – somehow they managed to make Dean and Sam feel like they live in an actual real place – i.e. our world – for 11 seasons, so ….
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 10 “Wayward Sisters” (2018; d. Philip Sgriccia)
“Biker Barbie” pretty much covers it. I’ve covered my issues with this. I have many many problems with the entire concept, and unfortunately those of us who did have problems with the concept were then called “misogynist” or “sexist” for not embracing the vision of Wayward. I watch plenty of stuff made by woman, about women. I don’t “go to” Supernatural for that. And I resented the whole vibe in the ad campaign and social media campaign, like, “Have you had enough of the DUDEBROS of Supernatural? HELL YEAH HERE’S SOME BADASS TEENAGE GIRLS THEN.” Nope. Hell to the nope. Gimme my dudebros back. And to those who are like, “Can’t we have both?” For sure. And we already have. Ellen. Jo. Charlie. Jody. Donna. The show has crawled with great female characters since Season 2. But they’re support staff, because the show is not about them and I am okay with that.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 11 “Breakdown” (2018; d. Amyn Kaderali)
A Donna-centric episode. Clearly they needed to dispatch her boyfriend just in case the pilot went. We can’t have any of these super strong women actually have intimate relationships, and certainly not with men. Claire can “fall in love” with Kaia (what?), but we can’t have flame-thrower Donna be just somebody’s GIRLFRIEND, so Doug has got to GO. There’s nothing EMPOWERING about being some man’s GIRLFRIEND. I am clearly not the demographic for this. And that’s fine. My criticism shouldn’t impact your enjoyment. Do you know how many things I love that are routinely – and widely – SHIT ON – by the majority of people online and offline? I’m a tough cookie. I still love what I love. Side note: the shots of all the monsters making online bids was embarrassing.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 12 “Various & Sundry Villains” (2018; d. Amanda Tapping)
Here’s an opportunity to talk about the systemic issues, because it’s all here in microcosm. There are too many characters, and the writers feel an obligation to give all of these side characters their own separate arcs – and so episodes are now split up into 2, sometimes 3 plots. Go back and watch Seasons 1 through 5. It’s like heaven, because you can just hang out with the main characters. “The Man Who Would Be King” REALLY stood out in that environment. And it was fine because what Castiel was doing DIRECTLY AFFECTED our two leads. But Rowena’s journey? Her fear of Lucifer? Who GIVES a shit? Why is an entire episode dedicated to HER? Meanwhile: the case, as it is, has all kinds of possibilities. Dean is in love? Wouldn’t it be fun to see that play out over an entire episode, a la Sam getting married to Becky? But no. He’s “cured”, mainly to leave room for an endless monologue by Rowena about her fears, and Sam … opening up to Rowena? I’m sorry. What? After everything he’s been through? Sam is SMARTER than this.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 13 “Devil’s Bargain” (2018; d. Eduardo Sánchez)
I listened to Jensen and Danneel’s commentary track for this episode, which was far more entertaining than the actual episode. How anyone got through even one single take without bursting into laughter is one of the world’s eternal mysteries. In their first group scene outside at the motel, Danneel said her first line, and Jared said, “Are you going to say it like that?” OH MY GOD. I really liked one thing Danneel said in her comments on the commentary track: She liked playing characters like this, she has an insight into what motivates Sister Jo: “She’s not a ‘bad girl’. She’s an opportunist.” That’s smart script analysis, and also gives an actor a “way in” to playing a character who is kind of a “nothing” on the page. I’m impressed. That’s kind of a smart and deep choice, it gives you something to work with. She’s not a bad girl, she’s an opportunist. It was hilarious when she said to Jensen on the track: “Dean is a little bit sexier than you are.” And his reaction!
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 14 “Good Intentions” (2018; d. P.J. Pesce)
The wartorn AU is KILLING ME.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 15 “A Most Holy Man” (2018; d. Amanda Tapping)
The “Godfather” element is somewhat enjoyable (that red room), and there were a couple of fun shots from out of a crime-noir in the 1940s (the shadows of the men running through the alley). There was an excellent scene between Sam and Dean to close out the episode. It stands out. Finally. The two of them by themselves.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 16 “ScoobyNatural” (2018; d. Robert Singer)
God forbid Castiel isn’t involved. Sorry, y’all. I’m annoyed. Season 13 is riding my last nerve. I’m in this thing for Sam and Dean. But I did enjoy this.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 17 “The Thing” (2018; d. John F. Showalter)
Asmodeus is just AWFUL. “That’s what you get for sassing me.” Don’t they realize that the momentum of the case – which is a pretty good one – comes to a shrieking halt every time they switch back to Ketch/Asmodeus? It’s so shoddily put together. And too bad, too, because the case itself is a really good one! Just let the guys work the case. Stay with them. Dean being strapped to a table in a dungeon, for “breeding” purposes, with actual tentacles coming at him to penetrate him … now, this is the Supernatural I know and love, but no, they think we want to see Asmodeus and Ketch too.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 18 “Bring ’em Back Alive” (2018; d. Amyn Kaderali)
This one is even worse: it has FOUR plots. Lucifer/Sister Jo in Heaven. Asmodeus in Hell. Dean and Ketch in the AU. Sam and Cas with Gabriel in the bunker. SERIOUSLY? I did like Ketch saying “Good lad.” But again: there are too many g-d characters in this damn thing.
The Mouthpiece (2019; d. Patricia Rozema)
This was a really lucky assignment from Ebert. I reviewed for the site. I highly recommend this film!
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 19 “Funeralia” (2018; d. Nina Lopez-Corrado)
It’s like they’ve forgotten how to write the show, they’ve forgotten the premise of the show, which is two brothers working cases. There is no need for this episode. Why not have a monster of the week then? They’re so in love with these peripheral characters like Rowena. Ugh. It’s so frustrating. Not one of these side characters – including Castiel – whose main job is to make poor choices – is even a quarter as interesting as Sam and Dean. I’m baffled by the popularity of Rowena.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 20 “Unfinished Business” (2018; d. Richard Speight Jr.)
And now we have an entire episode devoted to … Gabriel’s background. With Loki. Speight has become one of the better directors in the Supernatural bullpen (“Just My Imagination” is one of my all-time faves in the entire series), and I understand how beloved he is in the fandom and I love him too. But this episode is too much. What does it have to DO with anything? Why are Dean and Sam SIDE CHARACTERS in their own freakin’ SHOW? Look at Season 13. Meanwhile, Speight overdid it and has basically lost his voice, what with playing two roles AND directing, and when you lose your voice, you lose subtlety of expression … so there’s a flatness in his line delivery (out of character for him). Also, there’s a humor deficit – as though nobody over there remembers the HUMOR of the Trickster. Dean is so bored by what’s going on that it’s in the language. This is NOT a smart choice. You have put your lead character in a position where all he does is eye-roll from the background. This is the THIRD episode like this in a row. I don’t understand the choices made. Then there’s all the AU stuff, too, with Osric Chau over-acting – I don’t understand his choices – and Jack and Mary disagreeing and zzzzzzz.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 21 “Beat the Devil” (2018; d. Philip Sgriccia)
Welcome to the show Mollie or Maggie or whatever your name is. And, once again, Castiel is actually the VILLAIN in the episode – at least in the Winchester Belljar(TM) – where family and protecting Sam is everything – and yet it seems the Destiel people love it, so … the “toxic codependency” between the brothers is broken so that … Destiel can happen? I don’t know, I’m just guessing. Listen, the show has been a success for almost 15 years because of that “toxic codependency” (ugh, hate that lingo). When you REMOVE it, when you prioritize other characters, when you have Castiel say “Sam can’t be saved” and Dean DOESN’T punch Castiel out and charge forward ANYWAY? You’ve broken the contract of the show.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 22 “Exodus” (2018; d. Nina Lopez-Corrado)
Awesome: all the AU “warriors” in camo come back to the bunker. The LOOK on Dean’s face when Mary says she wants to stay in the AU. “These people need me,” she says. I am so DONE with this bullshit. I love how Ackles and Padalecki are so good and so connected that they can’t hold back their reactions to Mary, you can SEE it. They WINCE when they look at her. I had forgotten so much of this episode. Misha Collins’ performance as AU Castiel as a kind of Nazi commandant, with “evil” twitchy mouth is embarrassing.
Supernatural, Season 13, episode 23 “Let the Good Times Roll” (2018; d. Robert Singer)
Maggie is killed. And then she’s brought back. Awesome. Also the showdown between Michael and Lucifer … they’re dangling in the air? Think about the end of Season 5, and that graveyard, two guys in jeans standing there in the grass, and how EPIC it felt. That’s all you need if you actually trust what you’re doing and understand the show you’re creating.
Supernatural, Season 14, episode 1 “Stranger in a Strange Land” (2018; d. Thomas J. Wright)
Season 14 in a nutshell: Jack is useless, and the episode ends in a pep talk. Maggie is useless and yet she’s brought along on a hunt. Bobby and Mary clinking beer bottles: “You too sunshine” is so awkward it made me cringe. Putting what should be subtext into text, compulsively, in every episode: “We will find the solution together because that’s what we do.” I should keep a tally of how many times the exact same words are said throughout the season. I do enjoy Sam’s beard. But I question his judgment in re: Maggie. Maggie throws off any assumptions of Sam’s intelligence. It’s like Dabb et al just are DYING to write a show about plucky teenage kids. The Wayward hangover. They aren’t reconciled to the fact that the lead characters of the show they’re actually writing are men in their 30s/40s. The creation of Maggie is a huge “tell” and the fandom – as a whole – rejected her. I’m sorry for that actress, I’m sure she was excited, etc., but even just the CONCEPT of Maggie shows where “their” heads are at over there. Like, they all thought she was a good idea. The only really good scene in the episode, with some tension, was between Dean and Sister Jo.
Supernatural, Season 14, episode 2 “Gods and Monsters” (2018; d. Richard Speight Jr.)
Pep talk. Season 14 is allllll pep talks. At least it gives Castiel something to do. But it’s a problem. As I said earlier, way up there in the post, Castiel in “Baby” was the PERFECT “use” of the character. It also allowed for humor. All of this “buck up, kid, be yourself, accept yourself” stuff … over and over and over in every episode … again, I’m not the demographic for this shit. I hope the demographic it’s for is enjoying it!
Supernatural, Season 14, episode 3 “The Scar” (2018; d. Robert Singer)
Evil Kaia. Jumping and leaping and twirling. Her COSTUME. It’s all just too much. And the way she’s written … putting Dean in his place … in my opinion betrays some resentment on the part of the team who had put so much into creating Wayward and then seeing it not get picked up. It’s a Wayward hangover. I’m just reading the tea leaves, I could be wrong. Kaia’s little monologue is supposed to “up” the stakes for Dean, but then it also betrays part of the problem in how the whole thing went down – Dean pulling a gun on Kaia and ordering her into the car. Of course, both Sam and Dean have done TERRIBLE things over the years. But that crossed a LOT of lines. Again, I feel like they were outside Dean, looking in, and it shows they don’t get him. And meanwhile … back at the bunker, Castiel and some random AU hunter try to figure out a spell to cure this random girl. It’s not dramatic.
Late Night (2019; d. Nisha Ganatra)
I will be reviewing for Ebert. It comes out this week.
Sylvia (2003; d. Christine Jeffs)
Gwyneth Paltrow is really really good in this. I wonder what this movie would look like to people who don’t know every single detail of this story?
I’m happy to see Michelle Williams getting so much love (seems unanimous all around). I’ve been telling people out here in the sticks that she’s the best actress of her generation since Me Without You…and getting a lot of “Oh….who is she now?” (lol). Naturally I’m without TV or streaming right now, so who knows when I’ll get to see Fosse/Verdon. So it goes!
On a totally unrelated topic: Whenever somebody asks me what my favorite war movie is, I also tend to think of They Were Expendable first. Then, after I contemplate it for however long, I think of it last, too.
Always the best, Sheila!
I accidentally caught an episode of Fosse/Verdon and I didn’t even know that was Michelle Williams! She is truly a star.
Isn’t she just amazing?
It’s such a strong character – the voice, the laugh, the mannerisms – and yet it really feels organic. It’s such good work!
NJ – I’ve always liked MW’s work too but this performance is a real breakthrough (imo). She’s really created a character here – different voice, mannerisms, everything – and you believe she is the very well-known Gwen Verdon, who was so distinctive. She’s fantastic and I am so impressed. I still need to finish it up – I think I have two more eps. It’s excellent!
// I also tend to think of They Were Expendable first. Then, after I contemplate it for however long, I think of it last, too. //
Right? It’s so damn good.
I read this whole shebang, and I thank you for your SPN service. *salute* (It’s also wooing me into watching a bunch of movies I was wondering about, so thank you for that too!)
God, you hit so many nails on their respective heads re. SPN for me. The only thing I wanted of season 14 was some exploration of Sam’s comment in 14.1, effectively appointing himself regent of a monarch-less Hell, but of course that went absolutely nowhere because like you said many a time throughout the article, Sam isn’t even a lead character anymore, and Dabb is the king of missed opportunities. It’s so painful to watch Ackles and Padalecki still trying to make a silk purse out of this thing, but now that I know there’s a concrete end date, I’m going to enjoy it all I can. Kind of like when you finally turn in your 2-weeks notice, the rest of the job has a sort of weight-off-your-shoulders feel.
// Sam isn’t even a lead character anymore//
This is such a painful truth.
I wonder how this has even happened. Why won’t they write good stuff for Sam anymore? I have said this before in re-caps – Sam is the key to the whole thing, and when Sam goes off the rails – the whole world falls apart. And so … by having Sam just be this guy doing research and being concerned … you’ve completely cut off one of the major sources of tension in the Winchester Belljar(TM).
It’s so frustrating to watch.
How has this happened? Sam used to get his own storylines. What happened?
// but now that I know there’s a concrete end date, I’m going to enjoy it all I can. //
Yes, me too!
WELL. Since you (sort of) asked, I have a theory as to how Sam became a not-lead.
Seasons 1-5, the show decided (and rightfully so) that it was smart to have Dean be our primary POV character. Sam had a mystery, *was* the mystery, and it was far easier to maintain that mystery when we’re not so much in his noggin. So we got the mystery of Sam, as seen through the person closest to him. (Of course, Jensen Ackles is an incredible actor, chock full of nuance, so this worked splendidly!)
Then seasons 6 and 7 happened, wherein Sam was distinctly Not Himself … either soulless or trippin’ balls. By the time we got to 8, where the show decided they wanted to start having Dean shoulder the mytharc (starting with Purgatory, the Mark of Cain, his demonhood and finally, his Michael Possession), they *should have* segued into more of Sam’s POV, to help maintain the mystery of Dean. But by that point, no one knew who Sam was anymore, because no one had sat down and said “Okay, what is this guy all about now that he’s himself?” He’d become little more than a 2-dimensional straight man, their exposition machine there to worry and set up Dean’s zingers.
We know Dean’s favorite food and adult beverage, his preferences in porn and television and music, his childhood heroes, yadda … but we know relatively little about these things for Sam. (Except that now, apparently, he’s a Celine Dion fan?? I hate Dabb.)
And speaking of which, Dabb … with his love of ensemble casts, he’s trying to make one out of SPN, further removing motivation for the writers to explore our leads. This hurts both Sam and Dean, not just Sam, but Sam was already lagging in the characterization department, so.
Yeah, I’m a fan of Sam so I’m a little biased, but I absolutely dig Dean, so this isn’t about that; it’s about the writing on the show and why it’s failing both of our leads.
(Apologies for the word vomit, but I have feeeeeelings on the matter.)
Cris – sorry it took me a while to get back to this. Your take on the timeline is really interesting to me – I hadn’t seen it in this way before although I’ve perceived it. In my re-caps, I talk about Sam being “the key” – the focus – even though Dean is more often the scene-stealer – but yes, since Sam is the sole focus of Dean’s world – then it really is Dean’s POV – and once Sam has moved OUT of that realm, the writers were left somewhat adrift. Very true about us knowing every single thing about Dean, and not much about Sam. and yeah – Celine Dion? Gimme a freakin’ break. I choose to believe he loved Elvis because … of course. However: the only one who’s babbled about Elvis is Dean – because you KNOW I have clocked all the references of which there are many. “Mr. Presley?” and etc. They really need a database over there – the writers – which they can check when they’re throwing in a detail like that. Because why would Sam NEVER say anything about Elvis and Dean talk about him a lot? sigh. I know there is no answer for this – it’s just sloppy – and that makes it annoying.
// they *should have* segued into more of Sam’s POV, to help maintain the mystery of Dean. //
This is really interesting! This is what made some of Season 1 so fascinating – since the brothers don’t “know” each other all that well. Or, they’ve grown apart – and Sam’s perspective on Dean is hero-worship of big brother as well as resentment of big-brother’s power – so when that is destabilized it was often thrilling. Like when Sam realizes his ladies-man big brother had actually been in love with someone – that episode had a lot of Sam’s POV in it and it was great. This is also true when Sam returns from being soulless and has to “learn” about Dean – the way Jared would look at Jensen like he was some huge mystery – “wait, you were with Lisa and Ben? what?” – it provided all this great tension. Dean refusing to say what happened to him in Hell. all that.
It’s THERE – I mean look at “Bad Boys” !!! Yes, that was Dean’s POV and his memories but such a HUGE part of that episode was Sam learning more about his brother, staring at his brother in a kind of awe.
This is what we have lost.
I’m late to the party but there’s something I want to get off my chest about the show.
It’s always been very frustrating to watch the show as a sam fan, making dean the POV character and sam the “mystery” really limited tptb in what they can do with him and I think that’s the cause of sam’s undoing. This set up worked in early seasons but it doesn’t work in the long run especially since they’re not even utilizing it to its full potential I mean instead of learning things about sam through dean we get sam constantly learning new things about dean (I feel like he’s always surprised to learn something new about him which is like seriously? he’s known this man his whole life and it seems like he knows nothing about him but I digress)
If sam is the mystery they have to write him in a way that keeps up the perception of him as a mystery and that often meant denying him moments of character introspection. One scene that comes to mind is in season 9 when sam tells dean he’s been having nightmares about killing kevin I thought that was a really powerful scene but you can’t keep having this character not say anything the whole season then have a shocking reveal that quickly gets brushed aside cause it’s the end of the season and they have to wrap it up or people will lose interest in that character (or the show in my case). It would have been so much more compelling if we got a few scenes hinting at sam’s PTSD instead of just using it as a throwaway line only meant to create tension between the brothers. The whole possession storyline had so much potential both in terms of what it did to sam and what it did to sam and dean’s relationship but they dropped the ball on it and I digress again
Sam’s storyline has always been “there is something weird going on with him” and when that ended they didn’t know what to do with him because they never really developed him beyond that (this is why I loved the amelia storyline even though most people hated it and it was badly executed, it revealed something about sam that didn’t have anything to do with supernatural forces)
The show has always left me thinking well what about sam and with these writers that seem more interested in the side characters than sam and dean (dean’s been getting the short end of the stick too I mean the way they handled the michael storyline was atrocious and they made lots of characterization mistakes lately) and the set up for the last season I doubt I’ll get a satisfactory answer. I’ll tune in to watch an episode here and there but that’s as far as my interest goes. The early seasons were so iconic but it seems like these writers just want to write yet another forgettable fantasy show in a sea of forgettable fantasy shows (lol remember when it used to be a horror show?) and it’s a shame imo.
Wow this got very long oops but I wanted to add that I really appreciate your commentaries I’ve been skimming through them and you actually have insightful opinions instead of just saying “wow this is the best thing eveeeeerrr” like some do and I really don’t like forced positivity so I appreciate your honesty
Andy – thank you so much for weighing in. There’s a lot here to discuss – I really appreciate your perspective.
// This set up worked in early seasons but it doesn’t work in the long run especially since they’re not even utilizing it to its full potential I mean instead of learning things about sam through dean we get sam constantly learning new things about dean //
Really good point.
There was a glimmer of it being interesting again in Season 10 – when Sam started getting visions – their whole long conversation in the car in “Baby” – but yeah … one of the things that just pissed me off so much was how Sam was “okay” WAY too quick when Mary bailed on them.
The writers had so little interest in him – so little understanding of him – that all they could do was have him try to talk Dean off the ledge, instead of having his own complex feelings. He never knew her in the first place. for God’s sake. He never HAD a mother. Wouldn’t his devastation potentially be MORE potent than Dean’s?
Ugh, they botched Mary so bad I’m still not over it. But Sam was definitely the main casualty – although Dean playing Words with Friends was a low moment and I almost stopped watching the show when that happened.
// It would have been so much more compelling if we got a few scenes hinting at sam’s PTSD instead of just using it as a throwaway line only meant to create tension between the brothers. //
So true! They’ve forgotten how to do a good season-wide arc over there. They are all over the damn place, chasing stories of side characters and trying to develop spinoffs. and boy does it show.
// this is why I loved the amelia storyline even though most people hated it and it was badly executed, it revealed something about sam that didn’t have anything to do with supernatural forces) //
I 100% agree with you. I’ve received a lot of pushback when I say this – but I totally agree with you. I found it fascinating – and made me curious about Sam – (which I always am – but even more so) – because he was the one who was ready to get married while he was still in college, to a girl who baked him cookies. i.e. conventional. When he “picks” someone again – i.e. Amelia – she could not be more opposite. And that showed character development – how far he had come – also how lost he was – and all the rest. Loved it.
By the way, while I have you here:
You know how in the first episode of Season 8 – he drives away from Amelia’s house to go meet up with Dean – and there’s a dark figure standing there? who is that supposed to be? Dean? Sometimes I get messed up on the Amelia timeline.
So: her husband comes back and she asks for a couple days to get her head straight. And then … what happens next? She clearly picks her husband but IIRC we never see her make the choice.
And if she picks her husband – then was Sam in bed with ANOTHER woman in that first scene? (No judgment – I just always assumed it was Amelia).
Okay this is getting long. Will post now with follow-up.
Andy:
// seem more interested in the side characters than sam and dean //
Yes. and you mention “character mistakes” – yes. It is just so so frustrating. Why do they think we all are watching? Who the hell is on tenterhooks about ROWENA’S journey? I am sure there IS such a person – but that person should NOT be catered to. You have to remember what this show IS.
It’s just so starkly clear when you go back and watch earlier seasons. Even as recent as Season 9. The show stays with Sam and Dean – that is the main Arc. Always. Even after the angels arrive. Sam and Dean are central – it ANCHORS the show.
Now we have … Nick? Are you freakin kidding me?
Okay. Sorry. It’s just so maddening.
// it seems like these writers just want to write yet another forgettable fantasy show in a sea of forgettable fantasy shows (lol remember when it used to be a horror show?) //
This is SUCH a good point – I never really put it into these words before, but that’s so true. It’s been my frustration with how “magic” has changed in the show. Now it’s people with glowing eyes shouting abra cadabra – when it used to be Meg slitting open the throat of a guy in a van and then swirling the blood to “make a phone call.” It used to always ALWAYS be “ad hoc.” Even their weapons were ad hoc. Sawed-off customized shotguns. Now they’ve got automatic weapons with angel-killing bullets. It makes me want to cry. It’s a betrayal of Kripke’s entire aesthetic.
Thank you so much for your comment!!
I love your snark for Brie Larson and Captain Marvel! I felt the same way after I saw the new Wonder Woman. It seemed like every women was losing their mind, weeping in the theater because a woman was the lead in a superhero movie, and I just did not get it. I have not seen Captain Marvel, but I thought Wonder Woman was very disappointing as a movie, and as a story about a woman in general. Had several conversations with friends about how Alien was far superior, and that action movies with women saving the day were not actually that hard to find, The Fifth Element, Mad Max: Fury Road, all the other Alien movies, all the Resident Evil movies…
Jenna – Right?? and Lara Croft! Hell, Princess Leia. Sarah Connor. The genre is FILLED with kick-ass women.
Brie Larson has been (in my opinion) self-destructing on her press junkets – behaving like a prissy snot to Chris Hemsworth – who seems like one of the nicest most humble guys in Hollywood – and even alienating Don freakin’ Cheadle? In that wretchedly awkward interview. Normally I don’t criticize actors for stuff like this – but her behavior has been appalling and I’m shocked that some people are thinking it’s great, like she’s somehow symbolic of a “strong woman.” Strong women aren’t that defensive. Strong women don’t have to belittle others or erase the past to be strong. She’s been driving me crazy. Lol. And I haven’t even seen Captain Marvel!
Sheila,
Can I just move in with you temporarily when you do these viewing diaries? It would me so much more efficient because I so much to say and think about when I read these and I just don’t have that kind of time. So I’m resorting to bullet points which I hate but there are only so many hours in the day.
Re SPN. You are so right. Which is why I been recording the last three seasons and fast forward past the stupid parts.
1. I’ve said it before and I will say it again. Dabb is bad show runner. He’s too young or inexperienced or something. Under his “leadership “, SPN is starting to look like every other teen angst show on CW. SPN is for thinking adults who have lived and done shit, none of which seems to apply to Dabb. Bring back Sera Gamble
2. The show is about two brothers. Period. Everything else, including Dad, a woefully inadequate Mom (in every sense of the word), Bobby, etc must supports that and, imho, if the story is not about the brothers together, I don’t care.
Re women in action movies saving the day, TV was way ahead of the movies. Xena, Buffy. Hell, you want to see female power, watch the last episode of Buffy.
And have you seen Good Omens on Amazon Video with characters named Crowley – a demon, Gabriel – an angel, Benedict Cumberbach as Satan and Frances McDorman as God and Metatron played by Derek Jacobi. I haven’t seen it yet, but for the characters and the cast alone, it’s probably worth a visit.
Carolyn – You put the nail on the head here:
// Dabb is bad show runner. He’s too young or inexperienced or something. Under his “leadership “, SPN is starting to look like every other teen angst show on CW. //
That’s totally it. He doesn’t understand the show. He wants to be doing some OTHER show.
// SPN is for thinking adults who have lived and done shit, none of which seems to apply to Dabb. Bring back Sera Gamble //
Oh God, I wish!!
// if the story is not about the brothers together, I don’t care. //
Yup!
// Re women in action movies saving the day, TV was way ahead of the movies. Xena, Buffy. Hell, you want to see female power, watch the last episode of Buffy. //
So true!!
I have not seen Good Omens but I keep meaning to check it out – incredible cast!
Oh, God. I haven’t even watched past the first half of season 13, and I’m having flashbacks of how awful it’s all been. I really thought I loved Dabb when he wrote the Bugs Bunny/Say Anything episode, but that goodwill has been squandered. And just how amazing most of season 11 was and then to have it turn into… this. Sadface.
On a brighter note – Dead to Me was amazing! Christina Applegate being unapologetically angry and prickly is just everything to me right now.
Natalie –
// I really thought I loved Dabb when he wrote the Bugs Bunny/Say Anything episode, but that goodwill has been squandered. //
Right? It really shows you the difference between being a good staff writer and then a showrunner – which is a whole different job. You need to have a vision for the show as a whole. Now, the problem is, Dabb DOES have a vision – it’s just that I can’t STAND his vision. So I will cop to that.
I remember feeling “weird” about Season 7 – I felt like the show had somehow changed in some way that I didn’t like – I have since changed my mind on that. But, you know, it was Sera putting her stamp on the show. She had things she wanted to do and say. (I now love Season 7.)
But Dabb’s sensibility is so far away from my own that I can’t see I’ll ever have a turn-around. He gave us the BMOL, he brought in a SWAT-team aesthetic, he’s into GEAR. I am remembering Kripke’s comments on the commentary track of episode 1, season 1: how he wanted the show to be blue-collar, sawed-off shotguns and chainsaws and grease.
I get that the show has changed, and things need to change. But … not so far away from the original vision that we now have automatic gleaming weapons and guys in camo running around. Ugh. DABB. Even worse is his view of women. His so-called “woke” view of women. Spare me from men who think they are allies, men like Dabb. “I’m not just a mom,” says Mary – and Dabb thinks it’s great – but he’s shattered the mythology of the show with this bullshit.
In happier news:
Dead to Me!! Yes! I need to finish it – I was totally sucked into it in that first episode.
I’m always here for your SPN binges, but this one seems especially fortuitous. I started watching SPN in real time at the beginning of season 10, and I remember the show feeling different once I was portioning it out week to week. Some time last month, I realized that if I watch five episodes a week, I can rewatch all of seasons 10-14 in time for the final season in October, which seemed like an intriguing experiment because 1) I’ve never rewatched those seasons, and 2) I’ve always wondered if watching more episodes more quickly would help me focus on the brother moments and blow past all of the angel/demon/witch/BMOL nonsense. Your macro observations are very interesting to me in light of that, and I think that I’ll probably feel the same in the course of rewatching.
I’ve always considered season 12 the worst because of the squandering of Mary’s potential as a character, and the absolute nadir of LOTUS/First Blood, which replaced Man’s Best Friend With Benefits as my Worst Episode(s) of SPN immediately after I watched them. Season 13 was pretty terrible, but it also brought Jack, who introduced a different dynamic and some familiar but resonant themes about free will and what makes a monster. Some of those plot lines sputtered and died under the weight of Constant Pep Talks, but I’ve been surprised by what Alexander Calvert has been able to eke out of the dialogue written for him. But who knows what will come out on rewatch! Maybe I’ll feel differently.
Always love your choice of gifs, especially the one of Sam and Dean being sports fans in Beyond the Mat. I will never be over Jensen rolling under the ropes into the ring in that episode…and sprawling all over them as he struggles to get out. No bearing on the plot whatsoever, but what a moment.
What scene are you referring to in Season 11 episode 6? It’s been so long since I’ve watched, I’ve forgotten so much of the Amara plotlines.
Bethany –
// Season 13 was pretty terrible, but it also brought Jack, who introduced a different dynamic and some familiar but resonant themes about free will and what makes a monster. Some of those plot lines sputtered and died under the weight of Constant Pep Talks, but I’ve been surprised by what Alexander Calvert has been able to eke out of the dialogue written for him. But who knows what will come out on rewatch! //
I completely agree with this! Alexander Calvert has been an amazing addition to the show. He also brings with him a kind of humor that Castiel USED to bring – that literal child-like attitude – which works so well in connection w/Sam and Dean.
// I will never be over Jensen rolling under the ropes into the ring in that episode…and sprawling all over them as he struggles to get out. No bearing on the plot whatsoever, but what a moment. //
His physical work!! When he flops out of the ring? I have watched that moment so many times and I still can’t figure out how he pulls it off without injuring himself.
// What scene are you referring to in Season 11 episode 6? //
The one in the Gif. When Dean breaks into Crowley’s dungeon – and she’s this nubile 14 year old – and they basically have a “love” scene – or at least a Lolita-ish “seduction” scene, where this child-woman attempts to seduce him. They actually went there. And it’s explicit. She’s not playing it like “let us be one” – she’s playing it like “I want you to be my first. You ARE my first.” It made me SO uncomfortable. It’s a great scene – not a great episode – but a great scene.
And thanks for reading and commenting.
I’m still working out how I feel about all of this – I’ve now moved into the last season – which also has so many issues. It’s been a disheartening experience, for sure. There are people who love the most recent seasons, love what’s been happening with Mary, and all the peripheral characters. I can’t understand it.
and it’s interesting – I just watched the “family reunion” 300th episode and … after all of this, it’s amazing to me that I would want JOHN to stick around and MARY to go away.
Yep, it would have been so much more interesting to have John instead of Mary.
Oh that’s right, I had forgotten that Amara actually encounters Dean in her teenage form! It’s always fascinating when the show is willing to take risks with those very charged, uncomfortable moments. Annie Alexis Alex Anne was another one.
I completely agree with you about John and Mary. When JDM first came on the scene in “Shadow” back in season 1, the strength of his performance and his surprising warmth toward both his sons actually made me doubt Sam and Dean – their perceptions of him, their recollections of him. It was destabilizing and compelling. Not every actor can do that. I wish we had more of that here in the later seasons.
// Annie Alexis Alex Anne was another one.
//
For sure. And the best part was it went totally unacknowledged – yet another example of Dean not realizing he’s looking at a mirror. The show is so GOOD when it operates on that level.
// and his surprising warmth toward both his sons actually made me doubt Sam and Dean – their perceptions of him, their recollections of him. It was destabilizing and compelling. //
That was such a great aspect of it.
Sheila, this is almost like a report from the front, a veritable Sherman’s march through seasons 12 and 13. I love and appreciate that you always find good moments amid all the whatever it is that’s going on in S12 and 13! Agree completely about the benefits of binge-watching effect, how it makes a season feel more cohesive – it worked its magic on a recent rewatch of Season 11 (such a strong collection of episodes I was a bit ho-hum about on first watch). And yet … To me at least it brought home that some of the seeds of later problems are in already present in S11, even before the debacle of the last three episodes – there’s the handing of primary story lines to Rowena and Crowley in the form of tedious Game of Thrones palace intrigue, the flip-flopping between heaven and hell just to give Cas something to do (the extent to which that character is indulged – I.can’t.even.) Even Amara, a secondary character, seems to have her own, independent storyline with all these other secondary and tertiary characters – so again, there are these degrees of separation from the central relationship of the show which seem to occupy more and more time. But at least in S11 it’s balanced by so many excellent Sam and Dean episodes.
//I do enjoy Sam’s beard.//
Thank god some things survive amid the wreckage.
Helena – Sherman’s march!! Ha!
// there’s the handing of primary story lines to Rowena and Crowley in the form of tedious Game of Thrones palace intrigue, the flip-flopping between heaven and hell just to give Cas something to do (the extent to which that character is indulged – I.can’t.even.) //
This is very true. For me, in the binge-watch, the palace intrigue – which was so DEADLY to the vibrant presence of Crowley – became inconsequential in a binge-watch format – it just feels like it goes by quicker but you are totally right. I was thinking about this – it would be like if Season 2 was broken up into separate storylines, where we follow Jo’s attempts to be a hunter – or we follow Gordon around in his time away from the Winchesters.
Of COURSE we didn’t because … the show is so clearly about Sam and Dean.
I may be paranoid but I feel like the Destiel fanbase is such a juggernaut – even though they represent a small minority of fans – that … it seeped into the mindset “at the top” – like: Oh, Sam and Dean AREN’T that central. Maybe we can create another character like Castiel to become ANOTHER fan favorite. and … some people are buying it. Some people love Ketch and fawn all over him on Twitter. Do not get it. and yeah – the indulging of Castiel … it’s been catastrophic. What on EARTH is the appeal. I get it, in Seasons 4 and 5, but after that? and that he’s always there – and now – even though you don’t watch anymore – with Jack, they have a young Castiel type – who is now taking up the storylines that Cas would have had – making Cas even MORE irrelevant. and yet the fans are eating it up. To say I don’t understand that fanbase is an understatement. Although I will always give them the props for getting me to start watching in the first place.
// so again, there are these degrees of separation from the central relationship of the show which seem to occupy more and more time. //
and it’s so much worse now than it was even in S11. Now they aren’t even TRYING. The character of Maggie … the “new hunter girl” – whose main personality trait is total raving incompetence – they put no thought into her and yet gave her all this stuff to do. This is what is so curious to me – Back in the day, they’d try stuff out – if fans rejected, then okay, the character receded. But I always felt like the writers were human beings – who knew about people – like, okay, people may not have liked Amelia – but that was an actual CHARACTER that had been created, a “real” person, they were going for something there – she wasn’t just generated out of some “bot” that ticked off all these boxes – they thought about her in terms of story, and what she would reveal about Sam.
They aren’t even trying to do that anymore.
And it has occurred to me that Sam has not had a storyline since the “sort of” storyline of Season 11 where he got visions and thought they were from God. Since then? Sam has had no storylines.
WHY.
Can someone explain this to me??
My only way of accounting for any of this is that having failed to create actual spin off series, SPN has expanded to contain its own spin-off universe. Nothing against spin-offs, which can sometimes be better than the original. But not the case here – for me, anyway.
I am just here for the henleys now. If there are no henleys in Season 15 I will be writing letters. (Shuffles off to shake fist at clouds.)
Oh, and Fleabag is fantastic.
Isn’t it? I’ve watched it twice now and I absolutely love it, I love what she’s doing, I love her take on things, I love her randi-ness.
Russian Doll is another one I’ve fallen in love with – a similar complex female character – a mess – and randy – and smart. Have you seen?
I love how economical, how trim, the writing is … and her physicality. Fleabag is a randy Cinderella in the body of Lady Ottaline Morell.
And I loved Russian Doll. Her voice! I could listen to Lyonne pronounce ‘Cahk-er-roach’ all day.
Oh, and I get a strong Sam-and-Amelia vibe from the whole Hot Priest thing, because he is also a huge Hot Mess.
Helena – good call on Sam and Amelia. Yes! I mean, Hot Priest is an alcoholic, let’s just be honest. I love how that’s there in the very first scene where he’s ordering tequila and Fleabag is like “Hmmm I love him.”
Randy Cinderella!! Ha!
// SPN has expanded to contain its own spin-off universe. //
Yes. Rowena basically has her own series within SPN. So does Castiel. So does Nick/Lucifer. Who the hell cares about these characters outside of Sam and Dean? I mean, clearly many do – but I can’t help it, I question their motives. I don’t like to question people’s motives, but with destiel I admit I do. I think the love of secondary characters often comes out of a resentment of the centrality of Sam and Dean’s relationship – because they want Castiel to be in every scene (they were pissed about the 300th episode when Castiel wasn’t included in the Winchester family reunion – but … why on earth WOULD he be? They are watching a different show). So these secondary characters give them a “break” from being dissatisfied with the “codependency” of Sam and Dean – which refuses to allow Castiel an equal spot. It’s all so convoluted. Surely there are other shows that would be more satisfying? I don’t know. and so someone like Ketch – or Rowena – getting a lot of screen time somehow validates their perception that Sam and Dean are not the “stars” of the show.
Is there any other show where fans of the stars of the show are seen as … not “getting it”??
I can’t explain any of it but, particularly in the light of Jenna’s thoughts below about the show trying to be ‘healthier’ (thank you Jenna) it reminds me of that line in The Good Place about frozen yoghurt – ‘there’s something so human about taking something great and ruining it slightly so you can have more of it’ and that for me is seasons 12-14 in a nutshell.
Yes – Jenna’s comment was very good. I had sensed all of this but hadn’t really put it into words. The “wayward sisters” pilot was especially egregious – I’ve read some commentary too about it which was pretty illuminating – basically thus:
They cast two women of color. Great news. Then: they kill one of them and have her come back evil. And the other one, they didn’t develop a character at ALL, except a girl with a terribly dominant father who tells her to leave home and never come back.
Meanwhile, the white girls in the group are triumphant, with jobs and a home.
I mean, come on. The optics of this are very very bad.
I have also wondered if the influence of Destiel fans is part of what has kept Castiel around for so long – but if that’s the case, then why is Cas so frequently being thrown out into random side quests? In and out of heaven, randomly reconnecting with his daughter, cruising around with Kelly Kline – but none of those things are connected to Dean. They don’t even require him to be in scenes with Dean. Does that really appease the Destiel fans?
The lack of Sam storylines has to be one of the most egregious missteps of the later seasons – made worse by the fact that I think the writing team does believe that they’re giving him storylines. To me one of the most offensive things S12 did was the heinously random “Sam Is Stepping Up To Be A Leader Now” pivot at the end of the season. Sam has never shied away from leadership. He leads effortlessly! He’s been walking into rooms and taking command of the situation, calming civilians, figuring out the best plan of action, since season 2! Those are the moments that make me wonder if I’m even watching the same show anymore. Especially when Sam’s “new” leadership capabilities empower him to…lead a SWAT team of hunters against the British Men of Letters for a big random shoot out.
// but if that’s the case, then why is Cas so frequently being thrown out into random side quests? //
I KNOW. This is what mystifies me. Being a fan only of Castiel must be a very upsetting experience. And every single second of his screen time has to be mined for subtext … which means the text is ignored … and of course SPN has been great on subtext … but … half the time there IS no subtext with him. It’s very strange.
Re-watching Season 13 made me realize why Destiel people love it so much – which BAFFLED me, when I would see people raving positively about it on Twitter. There’s that entire couple of episodes where Dean and Cas are in an out-and-out fight. Meanwhile, nothing else on the show is working. I had even forgotten about that mini arc – which actually got Jensen heated up in a way that was missing from Season 12 on. It was definitely one of the more entertaining bits in that dreadful season – mainly because the characters were actually engaged with each other personally. The fact that that is a rare thing recently should tell you something. Or … is it Season 12 that they have that fight that stretches out over a couple episodes? It all blends together.
// made worse by the fact that I think the writing team does believe that they’re giving him storylines. To me one of the most offensive things S12 did was the heinously random “Sam Is Stepping Up To Be A Leader Now” pivot at the end of the season. //
Oh GOD that was awful. Dean with the busted leg: “Sam, you got this.”
I felt like I was in an alternate reality.
No shit he’s “got this.” Since when does he doubt his leadership ability?
It was so frustrating. and – worse – it was dumb.
Full disclosure, I’m a fan of Destiel, and I love the show discourse on your blog Sheila, it’s so much better than anywhere else I’ve snooped on! Even though I’m into the whole Destiel thing, I completely agree with the above re: how Cas is being used (or really not used) and the dilution of the show into weird side stories about Rowena and Nick. It’s been terrible and I am constantly perplexed as to why any Destiel fans are enjoying the show now.
Part of what pulled me SO deeply into the show and the online discussions was the relationship btwn Dean and Cas, and the strange way they handled Dean as a character in those early seasons. As you have pointed out in your episode recaps Dean is treated in very feminine ways, I will never be over that pan up his sleeping body as Sam walks ominously in the room, so good! So part of the Destiel draw was just the strangeness of the character and the relationship, like what WERE they doing?! But, as with everything else these days, the nuance and the ambiguity that I used to really love has been lost to too many story lines and pep talks and a focus on healthy communication and family hugs. GIVE ME A BREAK. I do not watch SPN for family hugs!
I think you are correct in thinking the Destiel juggernaut is partially to blame for some of this loss, but also I think about the blow back from when they killed Charlie, or when Cas “lost his virginity” to that reaper, which was a HUGE DEAL in the fandom, as you know, but not just b/c of Destiel but b/c according to some fans Cas was essentially raped in that scene. So ultimately I wonder if some of the stuff is just about trying to appease the young, noisy audience who wants to see the current ideas about political correctness reflected in the show; a more diverse cast (not just two white men, but women, POC, LGBTQ characters etc.) and healthier relationships. *insert exasperated eye roll here*
There’s no longer any specificity in Sam and Dean, because the show is so busy with all the other characters now, but even so there isn’t time to properly delve into these other characters so even those “politically correct” stories are not done well, looking at you Mary! And as a Destiel fan I honestly thought Cas was not Cas in season 13 and that Dean was not Dean in season 14 because they had no relationship in those seasons. Cas is Dean’s only friend, but as Bethany noted, most of what Cas does now doesn’t require him to be anywhere near Dean, so yeah what is the point of keeping this bumbling angel around when it doesn’t really seem as though they have a relationship. I get the feeling they want to be everything to everyone and the show is the worse for it.
Jenna – I am sorry it took me this long to get back to you, but I wanted to thank you for weighing in – and I appreciate your thoughts very much. I am glad my thoughts on Castiel haven’t driven you away. I really loved him in those first 2-3 seasons – and it’s STARTLING to go back and watch them and see what has happened to the character ever since.
I was also VERY interested to hear from you WHY he was so effective – highlighting Dean’s strangeness. So insightful! I really can see this! The ambiguity of him – which JA is clearly playing on purpose – but it was also better writing back then – and how Castiel’s saving him sort of highlights how he isn’t like anyone else. And how much he dislikes that. He thought it was SAM who was unlike other hunters.
Those first couple of eps with Castiel were phenomenal – the “dream” in Bobby’s kitchen, especially. and Misha – who is not a very versatile actor – found himself with the perfect character to play. He knew who this character was, and he did not break. Now I just don’t know. The laughing and drinking whiskey in the bunker kitchen felt like something from the gag reel of a con.
// trying to appease the young, noisy audience who wants to see the current ideas about political correctness reflected in the show; //
Interesting, especially in re: Castiel and the reaper. I had only thought of it in terms of Castiel’s “first time” should be with Dean – at least that was what the Destiel Tumblrs I was following were upset about – but I hadn’t thought of it in terms of lack of consent. (This also came into play with the eruption of anger about Sam and whats-her-name British lady.) I was upset about people being upset – because, as I said, the entire premise of the show – or, at least, the main threat – is penetration against your will (to be blunt about it) – and having something inside you you don’t want. I mean, I watch some of those earlier episodes and I’m like – this is so sick, I can’t believe they are getting away with this, and I can’t believe some people DON’T see that this whole damn show is about squickly lack of consent.
The entirety of Season 5 is about Dean and Sam trying to either avoid penetration or accept it. LOL. I mean, it’s not funny at all – but still!
So fans who seem to not GET that part of the show – and how crucial it is – … they’re the loudest. and so the writers have shied away from one of the things that make the show the show.
// even so there isn’t time to properly delve into these other characters so even those “politically correct” stories are not done well, looking at you Mary! //
So true! Ugh. I’ll never quite get over it. And I really get the sense that “they” – i.e. the writers/Dabb – feel like they NAILED Mary, and that they’re proud of what they did. That they messed with the mythology and “created” a strong complex character. No. You didn’t. You ruined the show.
// I get the feeling they want to be everything to everyone and the show is the worse for it. //
I agree. They’re … afraid? … of the fans. LOL. But you can’t create a show like that. You have to do what you want to do. And course-correct if it’s not working (like the roadhouse. Or like Maggie.) But they’re so far off track now … I don’t trust anyone to get us back. And I am fine with change. I LOVE change. I LOVED it when Sam lost his soul – I LOVED it when Cas ate the Leviathans and transformed and all that that caused – I LOVED Dean in Purgatory and Sam not looking for him – and Dean and Lisa – that wasn’t wrapped up in an episode – it took 2 whole seasons. these were all hugely dramatic events, and they weren’t afraid to delve into these things from every angle. The show wasn’t in a RUSH. The entirety of Season 8 was Sam and Dean “dating” other people/vampires, and “cheating” on each other. There wasn’t even really a Big Bad. Just demon tablets and Sam going on a Quest to save the world. One of the last times Sam actually had a story line (grrrrr).
At any rate, you have given me a lot to think about and I very much appreciate your perspective as a Destiel fan. We need to be able to talk to each other and ship what we ship. As a person who ships Dean and Melanie from The Mentalists (which, seriously, is the loneliest ship in the world) … I think this show is (or has been) wonderful in creating an ambiguous space where we all can project things onto it.
Now? It’s just plot. And Sam and Dean are not the main characters anymore. There ARE no main characters. WTF Dabb.
Your viewing Diaries always inspire me Sheila.
Non Supernatural comments first:
Female action movie heroes: One of my favs, Kathleen Turner as Joan Wilder in Romancing the Stone and Jewel of the Nile. I know it’s a romcom action spoof, but I could identify with the bumbling, incurably romantic, heroine who always found her way out of an exciting, tight spot. We had some great female action role models with nary a comic book in sight!
EWSE&V: Before watching this I was a little concerned about the potential glorification of a serial killer. This was mostly due to my image of Zac Efron as a gorgeous hunk, musical & comedy star. My husband and I watched this after I read your review and were both blown away. Efron was perfect. He oozed the freakishly charming charisma that Bundy used to such a frightening effect. We discussed the fact that even though we were entering college that year the Bundy phenomenon had seemed unreal and detached from our lives. Watching this made it feel uncomfortably close as if he could easily have been someone we might have encountered. Chilling! Even certainly took on a new depth in my opinion.
Fleabag!!!
While my husband was out of town this past week I binged Dead to Me season 1. I really enjoyed the 2 actresses especially Christina Applegate who has certainly come a long way since Married with Children! What is it? Tragic comedy? Heart breaking and funny? I can’t look away.
Speaking of the Manson girls, did you ever watch Aquarius with David Duchovny? I was fascinated by the different perspective of the cop and I love DD as a longtime X-phile. Curious what you thought?
*Efron
// One of my favs, Kathleen Turner as Joan Wilder in Romancing the Stone and Jewel of the Nile. //
Oh God, Melanie – YES. I love this movie so much.
// Watching this made it feel uncomfortably close as if he could easily have been someone we might have encountered. Chilling! Even certainly took on a new depth in my opinion. //
I so agree. And this is the thing that I – as a longtime Efron supporter – have been waiting for. I’ve loved him in pretty much everything I’ve seen him in – from High School Musical to Neighbors to Greatest Showman. He’s dazzling. But I’ve been hoping for something like this – a real opportunity to show his insane acting chops – which I’ve always felt were there. I am very excited about it. I thought he was so good!
In re: Dead to Me – my friend Allison and I were talking about Married with Children – and how great she was in that – and how amazing her journey has been as an actress, if you really think about it.
I haven’t seen Aquarius – it sounds really interesting!
Supernatural seasons 11 – 13: For the most part I agree with all the good the bad and the ugly. Like the game we played once before redeeming moments can usually be found in even the worst episodes mostly thanks to JA & JP. I agree with you about not liking the shootouts with military style tactics, but I don’t consider the BMOL to be humans. When they showed their evil Hogwarts where boys were trained to kill each other they became 100% monster on my book. Add to that the fact that they are using magic for power and evil purposes. They are no better or more human than witches, sorcerers, and necromancers and less human than the Benders. I don’t like how much Sam & Dean have come to rely on the spells from the supremely evil Book of the Dead, not to mention Rowena seems to be the only one who can use it! I long for the good old days when Winchesters didn’t stoop to using evil magic or consort with witches.
// When they showed their evil Hogwarts where boys were trained to kill each other they became 100% monster on my book. //
Yes, this is a good point.
But I never BELIEVED in it. I believed in The Woman in White. I believed in the vampire nests and their biker-bar sensibilities. I just never believed that that Hogwarts place was an actual place. It was such a cliche.
// I don’t like how much Sam & Dean have come to rely on the spells from the supremely evil Book of the Dead, not to mention Rowena seems to be the only one who can use it! I long for the good old days when Winchesters didn’t stoop to using evil magic or consort with witches. //
Absolutely.
Get rid of Rowena, get rid of the Book. Enough already.
Ahaha evil Hogwarts. If I didn’t laugh I’d cry. It’s so…..frivolous. This is of course a deeply silly show at times but all of Dabb’s attempts to expand the world — from Bloodlines to BMoL to President Lucifer to the altverse and evil Kaia to the Monster Darkweb (NEVER FORGET!) to Michael’s be-fanged nu-monsters — are so lightweight and shallow and sideways to all the best and most heartful strengths of the show. It really salts my coffee that these adjustments to the underlying structure of the show’s universe have been done so cavalierly and with great lack of craft.
You are so right, Jessie and Sheila. We briefly talked a few weeks ago about the fact that they used to wrestle with this idea of Man vs. Monster. You asked which episode they had a very not subtle ‘argument’ about it. I think the one you mean is 4.4 “Metamorphosis”. Dean had just learned that Sam was ‘infected’ with Demon blood and Sam had known this and not told him. The MoW was a changing rugaru who Sam hoped could be saved, because it meant perhaps he could be saved too. Their differing feelings on the subject have from the beginning created some of the most interesting tension of the entire show. “Faith” – Roy is a man, Dean, we can’t kill Roy! In that episode the monster (Reaper) ended up turning on the human ‘monster’ who sought to use and control it. It seems the most appropriate justice. Think how many times – Hollywood Babylon, the 3 housewife witches, Swap Meat, etc. “Heart” is the most gut-wrenching example of the need to maintain humanity vs sinking into monstrosity even to the point of death. Even in this Sam was arguing for a grey area solution. Sam shooting Madison was a culmination of the scene in Croatian where Dean promised that he would end them both before letting Sam become un-human. This was also the fear that John lived with and the burden he passed on to Dean. It’s so integral to the entire story, but where is it now?
This tension is the source of their rift over the kitsune, Amy Pond. Dean sees it as very black and white – she killed people, she has to die. Oddly Sam’s grey area doesn’t extend to Benny. This tension between them on this subject has thankfully not been resolved, but also hasn’t really been seriously revisited in recent seasons except briefly in reference to Jack. This brings us back around to the recent scattered focus of the show which failed to mine the delicious potential of that conflict between Sam and Dean!
Melanie – yes!! This has been an ongoing argument. Or, it was. The witch book club! They’re like, “Huh. They’re human. What do we do?”
Does anyone have an answer about when witches turned from just regular people carrying hex bags to supernatural beings Sam and Dean feel it’s okay to kill?
And when did witch-killing bullets come into play? Was that Charlie making “poppy bullets”?
// It really salts my coffee that these adjustments to the underlying structure of the show’s universe have been done so cavalierly and with great lack of craft. //
Yes. Cavalier. They have no idea what they have and why it is valuable. It’s been … honestly it’s been a little heartbreaking.
Especially when you go back and watch the earlier seasons – like Seasons 1-5. Wow. I basically have to wipe my memory clean (sorry Lisa and Ben) to enjoy them – and I’m really pissed about that.
and wow – listing Dabb’s attempts all at once like that … Jeez. He sucks.
A repeat from a comment up above, buried in a thread –
Here’s a question I have kept meaning to ask:
You know how in the first episode of Season 8 – Sam drives away from Amelia’s house to go meet up with Dean – and there’s a dark figure standing there? who is that supposed to be? Dean? Sometimes I get messed up on the Amelia timeline.
So: her husband comes back and she asks Sam for a couple days to get her head straight. And then … what happens next? She clearly picks her husband but IIRC we never see her make the choice.
And if she picks her husband – then was Sam in bed with ANOTHER woman in that first scene? (No judgment – I just always assumed it was Amelia).
I probably should re watch this episode, but I always assumed that the “dark figure” was her husband when the husband and Sam meet in the bar, it appears that he knows about Amelia and Sam, and in typical Andrew Rabb fashion, the men decide who gets Amelia. I would have preferred a scene where the three adults in the room talk it out, but that violates my first rule about SPN which is that I care about the relationship between Sam and Dean and anything else is boring.
And I agree with you. I also assumed that the woman in bed with Sam was Amelia. Now I’ll have to re watch all of the Sam/Amelia episodes to make sure.
Carolyn – I actually wrote out a timeline in a notebook I got so confused. I should upload it to Instagram – it’s hilariously nerdy.
and for me there was a gap – between the conversation between husband and Sam at the bar and … Sam walking out on Amelia (?) – like they make such a big deal about her husband being alive – there’s a whole episode where Sam keeps going into a fugue state of flashback-ing – and it’s not resolved.
Then, of course, Dean sends that fake text and Sam races back and there she is happy w/hubby.
There’s also a dog – if I recall – in the bedroom when Sam gets up and walks out. which I assumed was the dog he hit (and then she … forced him to keep? Because that makes sense? Oh Amelia, you’re such a wreck).
Now that we are discussing it – it seems definitely like the husband is the one outside. and it’s post him meeting with Sam at the bar – and that the scene missing in this whole thing is when Amelia “chooses” Sam again. and clearly, in the brief space of time when Sam and Amelia get back together – Dean calls and Sam walks out on her.
which … again … is kind of weird, though, because when she and Sam meet up again she never mentions it. she never says, “Hey dude – you vanished months ago without a word and that was really hurtful. I picked you AGAIN and then you just leave??”
There’s something missing here.
We just finished Dead To Me. It was excellent! How Christina Applegate gets her eyes to be those unreflective pools of anger and hatred… she was just scary. And Valerie Mahaffey as her mother-in-law, scary in a completely different way. Linda Cardellini was also excellent.
I definitely have Season 2 on the radar.
Damn!! I gotta catch up!
Has anybody watched Good Omens? I really only watched because of the social media hooha, misdirected petitions, and other twitterpations. Really people, I’m a Christian too, but it’s FICTION! It was totally worth 6 hours of my life to see David Tennant with his serpent eyes screaming down the motorway in that flaming Bentley blasting Queen at full volume!
I put this question to my Supernatural friends: I understand that many of the angel and demon names are taken from the Bible and literature, but why was the main demon character named Crowley? Which came first, the chicken or the egg. I understand the book was written by Terry Pratchett & Neil Gaiman back in 1990. Is it possible that Kripke stole the character/plot from him? (It reminded me of Jesse the forgotten antichrist…)
The humor was very British and very sophisticated. Tennant & Sheen were perfect. I would be curious to know what y’all think.
Melanie – I’ve been meaning to check it out! I’ve missed some of the brou-haha but I love David Tennant!
Oh and Crowley is a nod to Alesister Crowley, a famous weirdo, maybe the father of 20th century occultism: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleister_Crowley
and it’s so weird – Jesse the antichrist has been on my mind, especially with this whole Jack nephilim plot. It could be seen as its mirror opposite and … you know … they coulda really done something with it. Sadly, nobody seems to remember Jesse – even though his journey was left open-ended. That child actor was amazing!
Well I guess I wasn’t the only one to see the similarity…
//Eric Kripke
✔
@therealKripke
YES. Now you know the origin of our Crowley. Also the boy from “I Believe the Children Are Our Future.” #SPN.
Gaiman
✔
@neilhimself
One of the many reasons I’ve always liked @therealKripke… https://twitter.com/therealKripke//
Even without it your Wikipedia link lists a number of pop culture references to the occultist Crowley, Beatles, Led Zeppelin, Bowie, and Ozzie’s Mr. Crowley.
Honestly Supernatural told roughly the same story of Jessie in a one hour episode. A 6 hour mini series of massive scope, scale, and cast felt more like a personal tribute to Terry Pratchett. Like everybody really wanted it to be awesome for his sake, but it just wasn’t. There I said it! As much as I love David Tennant and quirky Brit humor, sorry! There is much that will feel familiar to SPN fans besides Crowley and Jessie: the forbidden fraternization throughout history between Naomi and Crowley, white corporate heaven led by Jon Hamm, et al, the 4 horsemen of the apocalypse, and the Great Plan that all of heaven and hell are feverishly working to bring about. There are a lot more similarities, but I don’t want to spoil anymore than I already have. As I said above it is worth watching just to see Tennent (flaming ginger) staggering around like Johnny Depp doing his best Keith Richards impersonation. I still very much want to know what you think after you’ve seen it.
I think I had some of the same reservations as you about Good Omens, Melanie! Aziraphale was probably my favourite part of it and while I was thrown by Crowley at the start (lol at your description of his walk! my own attempt was “Bill Nighy drunkenly impersonating Nathan Lane impersonating John Wayne”) I came around on him pretty quick. It could have been stronger in a lot of ways, but I did enjoy the lively interpretations of book A&C.
OH my god the Nighy vibes were sooooo strong – I thought this was basically Tennant’s homage to him.
I’m not a big fan of Tennant but I loved him in this, a bit to my surprise – particularly some of the quieter inflections he brought to his line readings were delicious. That joke about changing his name from Crowley to … Crowley. That old quirky Brit humour, I guess. But yes, it was team Aziraphale-Crowley that sold it for me, (Aziraphale’s outfits were particularly adorable), the rest of it seemed rather laborious and keen to stop and explain every damn thing. I know Gaiman wanted to keep it true to the book in tribute to Pratchett, but I couldn’t help feeling that, for a tale of the apocalypse, it felt curiously outdated.
//Tennant’s Crowley is Bill Nighy by way of Keith Richards — a louche, lanky figure who never walks when he could drunkenly saunter.// – NPR
Hahaha! I love Bill Nighy, too, and thought for a hot minute he was the horseman Death.
//That joke about changing his name from Crowley to … Crowley.// so subtle.
I totally agree that Aziraphale and Crowley made a great “buddy” combo.
//it felt curiously outdated//
Ending on the Nightengale bit was a mistake imho. I mean, I get it (just barely) and I’m pushing 60 years old. It also just kept going with the narrator and the song and finished the whole thing on that weird, outdated note.
Still worth a watch.
Aziraphale insisting on the “Ineffable Plan” vs the Great Plan was very reminiscent of Supernatural Team Free Will.
Yes I had that dated feeling too – it felt…staid. I think a combination of the gender roles/types, the office humour, and the vague treatment of Taddfield and what the town symbolises, and Adam’s rather empty characterisation. Despite a couple of attempts to update it was rather trapped in its late 80s/early 90s/young-Gaiman provenance. Still, enjoyable enough!
I honestly don’t remember that scene with the dark figure maybe it was meant to parallel season 5 with sam standing outside watching dean and lisa? idk season 8 had a weird back and forth with the timelines it got a little confusing for me. Iirc amelia told sam to show up at the house and they’ll know if they chose each other and there’s this scene of her alone in the doorway juxtaposed with sam walking up to dean so she chose him but he chose dean I might totally misremember this though it’s been a long time since i watched it lol.
And you are so right about mary they totally botched her character she came back completely different to how she was in earlier seasons. I was anxious about her return from the beginning but i thought there was a lot of potential to that storyline and she was so underutilized, sam says “having you here fills in the biggest blank” and there’s no follow up he’s totally ok with her leaving? Oh writers, how you tease me. I loved that scene in episode 22 though when dean says i need you to see me and he looks so broken, jensen was brilliant. It was so cathartic to hear him say everything bad that happened to sam was because of her and how unfair it was that dean had to take care of his brother and keep him safe since he was a little kid, it was a beautiful scene
Andy – yes, the image does parallel both that one with Sam outside Dean and Lisa and also “Dead Man’s Blood” in Season 1, with the dark figure outside the cabin who turns out to be John. But it’s just not clear who it is in Season 8 – and we ARE clear who it is in the other examples.
and yes, that moment, with Amelia showing up at the motel and Sam eating dinner with Dean – is clear to me. It’s the one gap in the action – after Sam and her husband talk at the bar, and they both decide to wait for Amelia to make her choice. We never see her make that choice.
and if she DOES choose Don … then who is the woman in the bed when Sam gets up and walks out in the first scene of Season 8?
// It was so cathartic to hear him say everything bad that happened to sam was because of her and how unfair it was that dean had to take care of his brother and keep him safe since he was a little kid, it was a beautiful scene //
While I agree his acting was brilliant, I really did not care for that scene at all. It looked ugly and it felt cheap, since they had completely squandered all the possibilities to explore through the whole season. They were like “Oh fine we’ll just give him a monologue at the end of the season.” Like I said above – what I can’t forgive is that I watched that scene between him and Mary and felt nothing. Too little too late.
The people “in charge” now do not understand these characters and how to write them. And so they focus on Rowena or Nick or Jack – less complex characters with less HISTORY.
I just finished Fleabag, and then topped it off with Tina Fey’s interview of PWB in GQ. I was bummed to read that season 2 was it.
What an insane show! I loved that the hot priest was able to perceive her asides to the camera. “Where did you go just now?” He truly got her. I loved her inventive thoughtless id. And that her predictions to the camera were right about 85% of the time (must confess that I didn’t count and divide, as is apparently the proper way to experience Quentin Tarantino films). Olivia Colman was her usual crazy/great self.
And a very interesting choice to make the loan officer a person with an actual conscience, true regret, with an honest (and possibly successful) long term effort to do right.
The whole series really took my breath away. Just zigging and zagging from empathy to judgement to heartbreak, all earned.
Wish we got to hear the entire “Where’s Claire?” composition on bassoon. ;-)
I hope its viewable, here’s the GQ interview , it’s great.
Mutecypher – glad to hear your thoughts!! It’s so good, isn’t it?
On a re-watch, I noticed so much more about the so-called hot priest, mainly that he is even more of a mess than she is, and a raving alcoholic. Of course I noticed him drinking but the second time I noticed it even more. As heartbreaking as it all was, I think Fleabag dodged a major bullet, because that guy is headed for a major crash collision. Or who knows, maybe his love affair with Fleabag will “snap” him out of it – but I doubt it.
I absolutely LOVE her sister and I love their relationship so much. It’s so prickly, but also so intimate – films/TV rarely get siblings right. This one feels so authentic!
and oh gosh, that creepy kid and his bassoon! so funny and weird.
Claire and Fleabag had a seriously intense relationship, everything was so raw and operatic. They rarely had quiet moments of just being together. That made the silent retreat such ridiculous fun.
I loved their dad sending them to feminist seminars (“raise your hands if you’d trade 5 years of your life for the so-called perfect body”). Along with him paying for the breast exams. Was it for the benefit of his daughters, or the exercising of his grief? Embrace the “yes and” with that. Him feeling so much love and fear. That was some weird family dynamics like a J.D. Salinger story. I loved Dad saying that Fleabag knew how to love better than any of them, and that’s why it caused her so much pain. And her denial that it cause her pain (but implying that she did know how to love better than the rest of them).
And Claire having a affair (on the way) with a guy named Clare. The only male Clare I can think of is Humbert’s antagonist in Lolita – not sure if that was part of the fun.
I think both the priest and Fleabag dodged a bullet. He was definitely an alcoholic. Like your analysis of Notorious and Ingrid and Cary, I don’t think either of them have a happy ending in their future.
It was just so deeply well done.
Claire and Clare. lol. and her awful haircut!
I disagree – I think Fleabag will be fine. She’ll always have a rocky road in life, but she’s nowhere near as lost and damaged as hot priest. She’s actually living her life, in all its mess and craziness. He, on the other hand, is avoiding it, and literally hiding bottles all over the rectory. I feel for the guy. She’ll be able to grieve it and move on – he won’t. And he’s just going to get worse.
I literally gasped the first time the hot priest noticed her asides to the camera. I couldn’t believe it. such a bold choice!
//She’s actually living her life, in all its mess and craziness. He, on the other hand, is avoiding it, and literally hiding bottles all over the rectory.//
I see your point. Back to her denial of her dad’s comment about loving (or life, really) causing her pain.
Oh god, and Claire’s haircut. And leaving the ponytail on the chair at the wedding to run off for Clare. Not quite The Graduate, but a similar ballpark.
I saw The Farewell last weekend. Very good! There was a snippy exchange between the sisters-in-law, ostensibly about the relative merits of the US versus China, but mostly just status-marking. A different dynamic than the love/hate/competition of real sisters – who might also engage in status-marking. Shallow, in a way, but appropriate for the relationship. The scene was funny, and I don’t say this to denigrate the interaction or the script – just that it highlighted for me the different dynamic that sisters with fraught relationships can have. There’s just more there than would be between sisters-in-law. I had watched all of Fleabag at that point, so “sisters” were in my mind. Just a more fertile field to plow.
It was thought-provoking to see after Fleabag.
Soooo, I’ve found your season 12 re-watch thread – haven’t read much, but I’ll read as I’m re-watching. Is it cool if I hijack those posts, 2 years late? :) (your analytics are going to show some interesting searches like “supernatural season 12 hitler” – totally normal – although I’m sure that’s far from the worst searches)
I can’t even remember when I stopped watching – I saw you describe stuff from season 13 that seem familiar, but I could swear I stopped during season 12? Show me any picture from the first 9 seasons and I can tell immediately which episode it is based on their clothes, expressions, motel wallpaper, etc. because everything was so specific. But later on… it’s all a blur. It makes me so sad.
I’m still going to try and finish watching the show, so that I’ve seen everything at least once. I’m scared! I hope there will be good LEGS moments to make up for… everything else.
I’m at S12E05, The One You’ve Been Waiting For, and I: 1/ hate Mary. 2/ Find so much of the writing so clunky and obvious it makes me physically uncomfortable (“you’re cranky about Mom, if you wan to talk…” JUST FUCKING KILL ME) 3/I just fast forward through the B plot every episode because I couldn’t care less about Castiel, Crowley and Rowena, especially when they need a cute little music to tell me I should find their scenes funny.
God, I’m so sorry, it makes me so cranky.
// I couldn’t care less about Castiel, Crowley and Rowena, //
Oh God I know. once Jack comes along – there are often THREE plots happening – less and less Sam and Dean. and WAIT until you get to the whole “wayward sisters” nonsense. Did that reach your radar? I can’t even remember what season it was. Dabb was determined to create a Girl Power spinoff called Wayward Sisters (eyeroll) – and so one of the seasons you have all of these random episodes where they’re setting up each of these “superpower girls” – all of whom, of course, have trauma(TM) – even though none of them can act … and it’s all SUCH A BORE. and a time waster. meaningless episodes. for a spinoff that didn’t fly.
I remember vaguely some super ridiculous teenage stuff, with actors way too clean and pretty, and everything on screen being green? Or was it just a nightmare?
Something shifted in season 11 and I hated it but there were still tons of good stuff. Is it all going downhill from now on? Is there nothing to save until the very end? Sheila! Help!!
There are actually some fun one-offs – but none come to mind. They don’t STICK the way the old SPN eps did. and for the life of me I don’t remember the final season – except for the last three episodes, which, to be fair, are good. If we hadn’t had seasons 12-15 – the finale might have landed harder than it did. But I was okay with it. they just lost so much emotional momentum in the ridiculous 3 years leading up to it.
// some interesting searches like “supernatural season 12 hitler” //
hahaha Oh man that “I killed Hitler” one. Yuk.
Cringe. I had to mute. And I was literally hiding my face – so so ashamed. I’m putting that other one to be sent into oblivion with the Black woman dog one. Never watching that again.
Oh but WAIT isn’t there a plotline where POTUS is the devil? And they spend the whole episode in jail literally doing NOTHING, like NOTHING happens on screen?
It just sounds like a fever induced nightmare.
Make it stop!!
Yes, the super max prison where they just pace and pace and pace … and these two talented escape artists just sit around – and then Billie somehow gets them both out. Oh God its awful. The whole pOTUS thing was dreadful. DREADFUL.
//Supernatural, Season 12, episode 6 “Celebrating the Life of Asa Fox” (2016; d. John Badham)
Appalling. I was sooooo turned off by this episode, and its view of hunters.//
Soooo…. how did it all become so bad so quickly? It’s funny, I found your original post for the premier of season 12, and I was SO critical – so mean! And immediately hostile when I came to Mary. In retrospect I have no regrets but I was wondering why I was so harsh. And I think it all really comes down to Smith – I mean, the writing isn’t great, but still, there are so many layers that ARE in the script (regret, grief, feeling weirded out by her ADULT sons, etc.) that are just not on her face. And so I think that’s why I hated Mary immediately – she’s so flat, it made her so incredibly unsympathetic, and I felt defensive of Sam and Dean. Because on her side, there was nothing to empathize with. What a waste! And it’s painful to watch all the other actors do all the heavy lifting they can – the scene when Jody meets her, so many feelings – and… nothing.
And so to come back to that specific episode, I am halfway through and I had to stop because I couldn’t take it anymore. Who ARE those people and how did they survive this long? They are utterly incompetent. One of them goes “what’s that smell?” My dude, I smelled sulfur downtown today and I was ready to exorcise the shit out of anyone coming my way. But there they are, in a circle (wow, blocking), arguing over who MIGHT be possessed? I am more competent than them! Cristo! Exorcisamuste, omnis immundus spiritus, omni satanica potestasCOME ONE PEOPLE, IT’S NOT THAT HARD
It’s only episode 6. It’s going to be hard, ha ha
//There are actually some fun one-offs – but none come to mind. //
It makes me so mad.
Dean is playing scrabble or whatever the fuck with his mother on an app? That has to be the LEAST interesting to ever be filmed in a fiction.
what the fuck
OK, I guess I need to pace myself with the bitching or I won’t make it to the end.
//she’s so flat, it made her so incredibly unsympathetic, and I felt defensive of Sam and Dean.//
Which is wild, because, I WANT them to suffer – that’s kind of the appeal! It just seems all so… pointless. And I think I’m also pissed at Mary because I wanted to FEEL MORE! Her situation was so interesting. I wanted to feel for her. I ended up not caring at all.
She’s just a terrible actress. Smug.
Smug? If you don’t mind I’d love to hear more about that, I’m intrigued.
She’s such a limited actress – she has no emotional reserves and/or depth and no natural talent beyond the simplest reading of dialogue – and yet here she is, acting, in a MAJOR role – after being on the show off and on for YEARS – now suddenly she actually has to act – and so in order to survive it she falls back on an attitude – the attitude is what we see, and it’s why it feels so shallow and like nothing is going on. Nothing IS going on. And in her playing are all kinds of tells. Let’s say that Mary’s return was written in a better way – the way we would want it – with Mary expressing maybe anguish at all she missed, at what has happened to her sons – all that good stuff – well, sorry to say, Samantha Smith flat out would not be able to play that. She would fail. And so It’s almost like she is happy that the character of Mary is being ruined – because it’s what she can play and she gets to be a “badass” and nobody will ever call her out on being a bad actress. It’s weird – it’s just SUCH low stakes. Her acting is the epitome of what low stakes acting looks like. and it’s in such contrast to JA and JP – who make “what are we having for lunch” into a high stakes convo. Any good actor knows that EVERYTHING has to be high stakes. If you resist high stakes, find another profession. Total speculation – I’m just going off what I perceive in her non-performance. Samantha Smith cannot act and someone who can’t act has no reserves when they are actually called upon TO ACT. JA and JP have all kinds of skills and technique on how to survive a scene, how to play an objective, deepen the character, make choices. Samantha Smith literally cannot do that. Asking her to do that would be like asking someone who put on ice skates for the first time to go out and do a triple sow cow. You literally would not be able to do it. To me, what I see in her is: she knows she can’t act and the smugness comes because she’s getting away with it. on network television. and no one’s calling her out on it because no one really cares.
I am not saying that any of this is conscious. It’s all totally unconscious.
Haaaa, I see, thanks so much for expanding on that. I agree, she barely touches the text, nothing behind AT ALL. But I couldn’t see where the smugness you saw was – I get it now. I didn’t interpret it that way – I figured maybe she’s one of those people who are so bad they’re not equipped to realize it – kinda Dunning-Kruger effect.
//Let’s say that Mary’s return was written in a better way – the way we would want it – with Mary expressing maybe anguish at all she missed, at what has happened to her sons – all that good stuff – well, sorry to say, Samantha Smith flat out would not be able to play that.//
And season 12 is overall so poorly written, but what kills me is that in the first episodes, some of that ACTUALLY is in the script (“I miss my boys, I miss John”), and she can’t pull it off. Meanwhile, thanks god for the two leads, who create depth based on their knowledge of the characters, because… well, it’s not IN THE FUCKING SCRIPT.
But honestly, even the supposed badassery is meh – no humour, no sexiness, no oomph, no NOTHING. Ok, there’s one scene where she runs and slides on her knees – reminiscent of Dean in Children Shouldn’t Play with Dead Things – and I thought that it looked cool, I couldn’t have done that 10 years ago and I’m younger than her, ha ha. But even in the episode where she almost SHOOTS HERSELF IN THE HEAD IN FRONT OF HER KIDS, I was like “yawn, nothing happening, whatever”.
Then it’s not her fault but that take on badass women – “I don’t cook” – doesn’t help either. It’s so fucking dumb and uninteresting, and anything but feminist or whatever the fuck they thought they were doing. Listen, even Dean cooks, and if he’s not badass, I don’t know who is! One-dimensional women. Blagh. I’m sorry but it looks like it was written by some teenager in a basement – do those people KNOW any women?
Lyrie you are entering some dark night of the soul territory and I wish you luck! There are bright spots, fairly rare but I cling to them — if you can stick with it the finale is a moving and fitting end, which was NOT guaranteed!
It’s been a long time since I’ve watched any season 12 but as atrocious as Mary is in the particular I think you can wrench your brain around to her working out, in general, and by accident; that is to say, it turns out the idealised mother is a dull and distant person whose platitudes mean little, whose judgement is awful, and who ultimately seems to have little interest in her children as men (except for the times when she looks at Sam like she wants to climb him, which while a bizarre choice from Smith & Dabb and co is probably the most relatable she gets). In the end everything in that relationship is shallow lip service and what remains is Sam and Dean’s stymied desire for a parent that turns them back towards each other.
There are so many missed opportunities for depth or insight though — it is so *empty* in the experience of it and Smith is such a dead air performer — it definitely sends you crazy. My thoughts and prayers are with you.
(and thank you for your kind words on a different thread from several weeks ago xx)
Jessie! You’re right, it doesn’t work on the screen but it work in the story. It’s just terrible to watch, so uninteresting, when it should have been THE most dramatic thing of those 12 years. Blagh, I’ll never re-watch.
//except for the times when she looks at Sam like she wants to climb him, which while a bizarre choice from Smith & Dabb and co is probably the most relatable she gets//
HA HA HAAAA my GOD! I remember feeling weird about some interactions, and I couldn’t quite put my finger on it…
// except for the times when she looks at Sam like she wants to climb him, which while a bizarre choice from Smith & Dabb and co is probably the most relatable she gets //
hahaha I’m trying to remember this moment. I’ve blocked so much out. It’s amazing how un-memorable so many of the episodes are. Like, what was Season 13? what even happened?
Lyrie –
// people who are so bad they’re not equipped to realize it //
I think that’s definitely a part of it! The smugness is related to that, I think. She honestly believes she’s really really good.
// Meanwhile, thanks god for the two leads, who create depth based on their knowledge of the characters, because… well, it’s not IN THE FUCKING SCRIPT. //
Yeah – in my mind the Mary thing is the biggest botch, the main error from which they could not recover. And talk about smug – Dabb was SMUG about it. He was really proud of “deconstructing” Mary – “she’s not just a woman and a mother” (paraphrasing) – but … but …. in THIS story her meaning and relevance is as a woman (the only feminine figure in Sam and Dean’s mythology that really matters) and a mother most of all. If Samantha Smith were a good actress – then her rejection of that role would have been way more devastating than it was – and would have called into question Sam and Dean’s whole entire life, spent mourning her and missing her. I remember Dean bouncing back so quickly – the Words with Friends moment was appalling – and Sam also bouncing back – like, two episodes after she “left” and I was like …. That’s IT? You’re done with exploration now??
It was so shoddy, so shameful. 12 years of exploration just … dispatched in two episodes. Yuk.
// One-dimensional women. // Yes! (This is happening across the board in “entertainment” right now. The industry is flailing to “conceive” of woman as … human. There’s a lot of pressure right now to make women 1. strong and 2. victims. It’s a very confusing moment. And everyone is afraid of #MeToo so sex has vanished from the screen too. It will correct itself – and those things – complexity and sexuality and women who are flawed humans – still exists – mostly in foreign films and/or indies. and sometimes on TV too.
I mentioned in the piece above how Donna was flattened out – as was Jody – in the post #MeToo world – I’m not saying MeToo is to blame, not really – it was necessary, yadda yadda, but the “hangover” has been detrimental to storytelling. Suddenly Jody is weeping about her “girls” (yawn) and suddenly Donna is ALSO crying about her past – AND getting rid of the very nice man who was so charming in that old episode where he and Donna first met … now suddenly he’s a Bad Man(TM) who wants to hold her back -and it’s all just so cliched – AND counter to Donna’s function in the story – which was to be a chipper positive counterpoint to Sam and Dean’s overall fatalistic gloom.
Wayward Sisters was an embarrassment. Have you gotten to that yet? I’ve blocked out what season it’s in – maybe 14? All of the “wayward sisters” were terrible – with Kaia – whirling and twirling through a prehistoric world – a particular embarrassment. Ugh.
It’s the kind of corporate-driven feminism that … we all must fight against, lol. Marvel wanting to be congratulated for creating a feminist hero – or including a bisexual in the Marvel universe – or whatever it is. It’s “diversity” as a checklist. It’s gross. The CW has fallen prey to it – and … they’re well-meaning, I suppose – but … I hesitate to call a corporation “well-meaning”. A good friend of mine – Jessica Ritchey – has written about this – very well – better than I am writing about it now – and one of her mantras is “Pop culture is not a replacement for social activism.” We saw this in the Destiel flame-wars – AND in the Wayward Sisters Twitter wars. If you thought Wayward Sisters was bad – it meant you were a tool of the patriarchy, male-identified, a “pick me girl” -etc. And these were all WOMEN throwing these insults around. listen, bitches, I’ve been fighting for women’s rights – REAL rights – since you all were in day care. If Wayward Sisters was “picked up” for a season … you think that’s a triumph for women’s rights? And then there was the whole “If you do not buy into Destiel, you are a homophobe.” Again, I’ve been involved in fighting for gay rights since marching in high school with Act Up. I came of age in the AIDS era. Destiel? You think Destiel – with two STRAIGHT middle-aged actors – is a triumph for LGBT representation? It was all so silly.
// do those people KNOW any women?//
It’s yet another failure to be able to CONCEIVE of women as three-dimensional beings with interiority. I mean, when will this freakin end. aren’t we PAST this now?
It was such a disappointment – since women, historically, WERE three-dimensional on SPN. Wayward Sisters whiners seem to forget the existence of Ellen and Jo. And Pamela. And even the one-offs – the women doing guest spots – they were complex.
It was wild to watch it all flatten out – AND to morph from a horror show into a YA fantasy. It’s gonna get worse, Lyrie, sorry to say.
But I look forward to your reactions!
//I remember Dean bouncing back so quickly – the Words with Friends moment was appalling – and Sam also bouncing back – like, two episodes after she “left” and I was like …. That’s IT?//
And again, would have been interesting if it had been attempts at accepting things – after all, that’s also being an adult. But it would be an ebb and flow kind of thing – so I think I wasn’t too worried the first time – watching everything at once, not every week, makes it all very different. It’s hard to accept. So close yet so far.
I was convinced I had stopped watching during season 12, but apparently I started again, because I’ve seen most of season 13, I think? I’m retracing my steps in your comment sections, it’s so weird, ha ha. And so sad that I have ZERO memory of it – a show I was (am) completely obsessed with!
I’m almost mid-season 13 now. Season 12 went by so fast because… I fast-forwarded every scene that was the B or C or Zzzz plot – listen, I’ve seen it before, and I know I don’t care. Even S&D, everything was so painful to watch, it was so poorly written, the BMOL shipping container sets are so fucking ugly, ugh, I hate it all so much. I was harsh on season 11 but I missed it almost immediately.
What’s wild is that by doing that, I realized how little the leads were in their own show – like, I knew it, but seeing that there could be 20 minutes straight WITHOUT them (Rowena, angels, MOL, blah blah), WHAT THE ACTUAL FUCK.
There’s the whole Wayward Sisters debacle, but overall season 13 is not so bad so far – I guess season 12 has lowered my standards. But still, something happened, because all of a sudden, at the very least it LOOKS like Supernatural – the episode with the plague masks, the gorgeous sets of the episode where Donna’s niece is abducted, the Impala gleaming, fog, ghosts, some weirdo side characters… And I haven’t had to fast-forward stuff – I’m not fascinated with the B plots but Pellegrino makes everything FUN. And Calvert is just lovely, and so many of us felt so done with anything having to do with him even before he was born – poor guy!
//Wayward Sisters was an embarrassment. Have you gotten to that yet? //
Yup. Everything green. The leads appearing in the episode for the first time at the 18 minute mark. Wow. Wowowow. What happened. I don’t care.
Interesting to think of it as related to #MeToo. I guess when things become wide, or mainstream, there’s a sort of a pendulum effect, and things become simplified to the point of absurdity. Maybe it’s an unavoidable step and it will rectify itself. We’re living such strange times – when you think of what’s happening with women’s rights, trans rights, etc. Maybe now is not the time to be fucking polite?
//Donna is ALSO crying about her past – AND getting rid of the very nice man who was so charming in that old episode where he and Donna first met … now suddenly he’s a Bad Man(TM) who wants to hold her back -and it’s all just so cliched//
I am so PISSED at that!
First, Doug is absolutely adorable. He is kind and tender, and open. That first episode – he is clearly love-stricken, but he’s a smart middle aged man, he sees what’s happening, and how brave is it of him to still be there and accept and love her, and just go “we all have baggage.” I thought it was so beautiful that that man existed in the same world as Sam and Dean. Talk about a complex character in just a few lines and an actor who knows what he’s doing. So season 13 gives us a conversation between Dean and him about FEELINGS?! Yes PLEASE.
What kills me is that yes, it’s ridiculous to get rid of the guy to make room for women, or whatever the fuck they thought they were doing?! But also in terms of story, they get rid of the conflict? Him having trouble accepting that, and their struggle with that, that’s what makes things interesting, so sure, let’s get rid of it! Who are those writers?
Imagine season 1: “Sam isn’t into hunting and doesn’t like dad. Let’s just kill him.”
Ha ha what a bunch of dumbasses.
//“Pop culture is not a replacement for social activism.” //
Amen
//If you thought Wayward Sisters was bad – it meant you were a tool of the patriarchy, male-identified, a “pick me girl” -etc. //
And again, I am absolutely baffled. I mean, even if you just stay on a very uninteresting surface level… Even just a checklist and very broad strokes… what they did was cast a bunch of cute looking, conventionally attractive young women. OK, two of them aren’t white. But, uhhh. You killed Missouri Moseley and Eileen for that? A Black woman and a deaf woman? What’s next, killing the gaysOH WAIT YOU ALREADY KILLED CHARLIE AND CROWLEY — I hate it so much.
It’s bad enough, but what kills me is that those characters actually had depth, complexity, weirdness. But hey, let’s steer clear of that, wouldn’t want something interesting to watch!
// it would be an ebb and flow kind of thing //
Exactly. Dabb was incapable of ebb and flow. He wanted things to be wrapped up neatly as quickly as possible – preferably with a “what have we learned from this” final moment – as opposed to long-drawn-out seasons-wide agony which played out in so many different ways. Think of Season 8!! Yes, a lot happened plot-wise but what was REALLY going on was Sam and Dean breaking up with their significant others to marry one another. I mean … But it took the whole SEASON. Season 6 too – the whole Lisa thing – which also dragged out in time. Maybe some people hated it but I thought it was great – because … that’s how it would go. They really took the time to develop that relationship – so that when it was destroyed, we’d get SOME impact. There are so many other examples of Kripke et al having the patience of drawing out a subject matter – so it could be explored from multiple angles. I mean, Dean’s relationship to John … that was fodder for YEARS. And the conflict with Sam about it still existed by Season 9, 10 – the exchange outside the Boys Home in Season 9 – it’s one of the reasons why John returning was … disappointing. I wanted more AMBIVALENCE and less RESOLUTION. Dabb loved resolution.
// And so sad that I have ZERO memory of it //
I just said the same thing above about Season 13. I have no memory of it. Is Season 13 the POTUS one? are the BMOL their own season? Yeah, that’s awesome – let’s make HUMANS the “big bad”. which actually could have been interesting but not how they did it.
// but seeing that there could be 20 minutes straight WITHOUT them (Rowena, angels, MOL, blah blah), //
Ugh. I know.
// And Calvert is just lovely, and so many of us felt so done with anything having to do with him even before he was born – poor guy! //
hahaha I know. Yes, he was wonderful! He sort of took over the Castiel role – since Misha was incapable of keeping his character consistent (lol). Calvert played that ultra-literal naive quality really well. Very funny too.
// Maybe it’s an unavoidable step and it will rectify itself. //
I hope so. These types of movements usually do even out. It’s a bore in the meantime.
// I thought it was so beautiful that that man existed in the same world as Sam and Dean. //
I know!! And that Sam and Dean saw exactly what was happening, they cared about Donna, they cared about this random guy suddenly in their world, and … it was all very sweet and tender. But now? a couple years later? Nope. Badass Donna must not be “held back” by a man. Ugh. It’s so stupid.
// Him having trouble accepting that, and their struggle with that, that’s what makes things interesting, so sure, let’s get rid of it! Who are those writers? //
Such a good point!! Even if Donna DID say “okay I actually need to be single for a while” or “I need to devote myself to the cause single-mindedly” or whatever – at least let’s see the exploration. But nope. It’s akin to bringing Mary back only to have her say “I am more than just a mother.”
It’s a bunch of writers in a room scared of the raving “feminists” on Twitter – trying to create something that will “pass muster” with their new audience who can kick up a loud loud stink with their brand-new power. So I can almost see the writers being like “Oooh the women will LOVE what we do with THIS beloved female character.” and maybe some did – so okay, we disagree.
What I don’t like is the idea that if you DON’T like what happened to the women on the show then you are suffering from internalized misogyny.
// You killed Missouri Moseley and Eileen for that? A Black woman and a deaf woman? What’s next, killing the gaysOH WAIT YOU ALREADY KILLED CHARLIE AND CROWLEY — I hate it so much.
It’s bad enough, but what kills me is that those characters actually had depth, complexity, weirdness. //
This!!
//Lyrie you are entering some dark night of the soul territory and I wish you luck! //
Folks, I’m starting season 15 now. I really need support, ha ha
Season 14… what a shitshow. It makes me so sad. I’m so glad it’s so forgettable, because I will forget it – all of it. Like I already had, because apparently I had seen all of season 13 and could not remember a single thing? I had also watched just 2 episodes of season 14 – the 300tht, and the one with Pamela, because I cannot resist Pamela Barnes. Forgotten. All of it. I’m watching it like it’s bad fanfic. But I feel so bad for the actors.
//There are bright spots, fairly rare but I cling to them //
– Sam’s beard.
– I hate the whole Nick thing (because who cares) but Mark Pellegrino is never not interesting to watch.
– I got so SO excited when I thought – OH MY GOD I HOPE HE KILLED HER! and he HAD! Which is super sad because the reasons were 1/ I cannot fucking stand her 2/ Finally something interesting might be happening?
– Sam’s pure annoyance at his mother’s empty words when Dean is missing
– Dean crying alone.
– Zachariah in the 300th
– I could not watch the speech after Mary’s death (literally, I was hiding behind a pillow, cringing so fucking hard) but I have to say, when i die, I hope someone will say that I could handle a machete. I’ll get right on that.
I’ve been yelling at my TV a lot. There is so much about the writing that is so bad – plots going nowhere, missed opportunities that were RIGHT THERE, the characters don’t sound like themselves to the point that I was begging SOMEONE to make is stop and was feeling so bad for the actors. I was really sad to miss out on all the fantastic conversations here every week back then, but I ‘m glad I didn’t stick with it, because at least binge watching makes it more bearable by having control over the pace of the disappointment.
Sheila, Jessie, Jenna, and others: thanks for playing with me. At this point, it feels like you’re my support group, ha ha
Lyrie –
// I’m so glad it’s so forgettable, because I will forget it – all of it. //
I totally do not remember Season 14. It’s all a blur after Season 12 and even that’s getting shaky. What’s the overall story in Season 14? Who’s the big bad?
Have you met Asmodeus yet? That is one of the most embarrassing things I’ve ever seen in my life – I resented being made to watch it. Because of course I couldn’t turn it off, lol
I totally forgot the whole Nick thing. God, they just drew that out. It was like they wanted any excuse to NOT centralize Sam and Dean.
// Sam’s pure annoyance at his mother’s empty words when Dean is missing
– Dean crying alone.
– Zachariah in the 300th //
oh God I remember that Sam moment. lol
//oh God I remember that Sam moment. lol//
It was such an unusual tone for Sam, honestly – he’s very rarely harsh. So I might be projecting but I was a little shocked at that choice, and couldn’t help but wonder if the actor was just frustrated. Because, well, the whole thing was horrible. Honestly I am SO pained for the actors, now watching season 15 – but even more for Padalecki who was completely let down from season 12 and on.
// I could not watch the speech after Mary’s death (literally, I was hiding behind a pillow, cringing so fucking hard) //
Oh God I had successfully blocked that out and now I am cringing all over again. SO EMBARRASSING.
// characters don’t sound like themselves to the point that I was begging SOMEONE to make is stop and was feeling so bad for the actors. //
It was just so upsetting. You’re so right – they didn’t SOUND right.
It really REALLY makes you appreciate just how good those early writing teams were – how GOOD the show was.
Listen, I’m at season 15, episode 12 now, and… I didn’t expect it to get that bad. I know I’m a dramatic bitch (rhymes with -itch? ffs) but I LITERALLY cried with anger. Physically sick.
There is so much contempt it what Dabb writes, I couldn’t believe it. It’s full of spite, it looks down on the mythology, what previous writers and showrunners have done, on the incredible work the two leads have done, and it shows such a lack of understanding of what the show is. And he also shits on the audience. Fuck him. Seriously.
The MC of the Monster fight club (and I swear, I have a fucking allergic reaction to the word “monster” now – can you be ANY MORE GENERIC) that opens with “You know them. You hate them. The Winchesters” – it really felt like “Gee, Dabb, tell us how you really feel.” It’s so destructive.
What really strikes me is how there is no love. Whatever emotional threads there are are shallow. I loved what Castiel and Dean had, but that’s been gone for years. Jack was great but then he died and no one needed to grieve him for more than 5 minutes? In a show that’s about how grief follows you for DECADES. Sam is bff with Rowena? And I actually LOVE the trope of the former enemy turned kind-of-friend, but for Crowley it took years and he was never trusted – I don’t have anything against that happening with Rowena (although I DO have a beef with what Rowena brought to the show, same as you), but I felt like there was nothing building up to it, so Sam’s grief seemed unearned. And Chuck used to be loving too. Crowley was horrible and snarky but there was a fondness.
Kripke loves gore and bitch and cunt and boys and cars and fist fights, but he’s also obsessed with deep wounds, and has a lovely deranged sense of humour. There was so much tenderness in what Kripke created. Sera Gamble was in love with them. Kim Manners too. Adam Glass – super tender writer – not sappy, just really interested in those guys and the actual boys there were before they were men. Robbie Thompson gave us Fanfiction and Baby, in season 10 and 11!! With all that had been created, there was more than enough room to keep going deep for a few more years. It stopped so abruptly. Instead we have more WEAPONS. Like, really? Oh we have witch-killing bullets, and angel bullets, and archangel blades, and a gun that looks like it’s from Doctor Who.
WHAT. THE. EVERLOVING. FUCK.
This year for me is all about grief so it makes sense that I chose now to get back in to Supernatural. And it’s weird to grieve the show in different ways. To grieve it way before it’s dead. It’s heartbreaking.
Thanks for letting me rant, Sheila!
That’s a major difference between Death and Billie-Death too – Death was scarier (in my opinion) and more alien – really not human – but there was some… fondness, some sort of weird kindness. It’s not there anymore, at all – Billie is kinda cool but very one-note and cold.
I wonder if that’s why it’s so humourless too. I can’t articulate it right now but I feel like love and humour are linked. Would Mystery Spot be funny if we didn’t love those two guys deeply and instead thought they were just lucky-heroes-who-save-the-world? Not to me, at least.