It’s his birthday today. I’ve written so much about him. My Supernatural re-caps are filled with tributes/explorations to his talent. He has no flaws as an actor. This is so rare. He can do anything. And he is lucky to have found a role where he could express ALL of himself, not just one or two aspects. He could include everything.
I wrote a piece praising his old-school brand of acting – the persona-essence movie star stuff – in all its subtletities and broad strokes. Not everyone can do it.
Jensen Ackles: The Beauty, the Burlesque, the Schtick, and the Erotic-Muse Reality Distortion Field
YES! Happy Birthday to The Most Precise Actor.
So, where do you prefer we comment? There’s a millisecond bit of acting I saw this past year that gave me even more respect for his craft that I want to talk about – of course, it’s way personal, and of course, even if it’s in the The Boys, we’ll end up talking about SPN.
Where should I start rambling about eyelashes, masculinity and microexpressions, please?
Let’s do it here! you’re a doll (in a good colloquial way) for asking.
Oh I didn’t know I could take it any other way. <3
You know, librarian brain, I like to organize information, ha!
// rambling about eyelashes, masculinity and microexpressions, //
lol
So much fun going down memory lane with you and those recaps! I remember reading each one in excruciating detail whether I agreed with you or not, but I usually did. I am so curious as to what kind of actor JA is evolving into. He could so easily be the leading man type but he seems to be exploring and stretching to see what he can do. It’s fascinating also to see how he and JP have chosen different paths. Whoever compared JP and JA (them, not their characters) to Luke Skywalker and Hans Solo seems to have gotten it right. Is JP playing it safe with something that he knows how to do or is he waiting for the perfect vehicle which might never come. JA seems to be more willing to step out on the edge but so far never quite over it.
// I am so curious as to what kind of actor JA is evolving into. //
Me too! I’m assuming you’ve been watching The Boys? It’s interesting to see the shadings he brought to that character – and I also love he gets to use his humor. JA without the humor is just not the same actor! I love to see him stretching. I haven’t watched Big Sky – have you? I have some catching up to do.
// Is JP playing it safe with something that he knows how to do or is he waiting for the perfect vehicle which might never come. //
Interesting. I hadn’t thought of that. He may just want to stay close to home – Walker is filmed in Texas, yes?
I’d love to see JA go real dark. Be on a show like Justified, or something like that. Move out of the fantasy realm. We shall see. I like the choices he’s been making so far!
Carolyn, hi!
Interesting! JP jumped into producing right away, though, and it might have kept him busier right after SPN. I agree that it’s really nice to see where they’re going.
OMG, Jensen on Justified Primeval – the dream!!
The eyelashes will destabilize whatever JA does and that’s a huge plus!
Justified Primeval … How can we make this happen??
Sheila, Justified Primeval is happening, it’s in the works! Should be for sometime later in 2023, I think. We just need Jensen in the cast!
Yes I was just poring over the info about it -so psyched!
maybe we can create a “Put jensen on Justified Primeval” tulpa?
Ha ha YES!
Sheila, my comment to the main thread is stuck in moderation purgatory: is it because I inserted links, or is it because I wrote dick? We can still say dick, here, right? (testing, testing)
hahahahah oh is it?? dammit – I do not censor people’s language. it’s probably becuase there’s a link in the comment – let me go find it.
The good thing about purgatory is …. BENNY.
Dick, Benny… We got there fast, eh? :)
Season 8: Purgatory > Benny > Dick.
also Season 8: Motel > Limes in sink drain > Dog > Hot dogs and spaghetti > Orange makeup
Make it make sense.
//Season 8: Purgatory > Benny > Dick.//
HA HA HAAAA Welcome to my brain!
Season 7: The Mentalists > Melanie > we ship it.
It’s just how it is. *shrug*
ah Melanie. I still dream of Melanie.
Alright, so, Soldier Boy “Who Approved This Script?” Promo: https://youtu.be/iR1-p_E2UCU
This is a video I saw once and never re-watched until now, because it terrified me – and I mean: literal feeling of cold in guts, stopped breathing for a second, feeling of dread, brain taken over by “I’m in danger” – nice PTSD shit.
Unfortunately I can’t really explain why it’s so masterful without oversharing, so for context, I grew up with a very violent father. A guy, I came to understand as an adult, who is very insecure, particularly when it comes to masculinty. Prone to violent outbursts, verbally, or physically. Entitled but from a place of deep insecurity, of feeling like people never give him the respect he is OWED.
We’ve seen Jensen Ackles play violence in SPN, and different kinds too: Dean not dealing with the guilt of his father’s deal is not the same as Demon Dean, who’s not the same as First Blade Dean, who’s not the same as Leviathan Dean, etc. But whatever version of Dean Winchester we were seeing, it was specific AND still that guy. And oh boy, it went really dark, sometimes.
But what he does in that very short clip triggers literal PTSD reactions in my body – which honestly, rarely happens. I’m an adult. It usually takes very specific, thankfully very rare, real life stuff for me to physically feel “I’m four years old and I might die.” That specific moment in particular, that second of his gaze floating,… https://youtu.be/iR1-p_E2UCU?t=26 … And the strain on his voice – you can hear in his yell he could very easily lose control completely… I RECOGNIZED it.
Anyway, I could go on about more details but I ain’t no Sheila. I loved his whole performance as Soldier Boy but to me that moment really stands out. When I see people online lusting over Soldier Boy, even before I saw that clip, I couldn’t really get it – sure he’s handsome, but girl, Soldier Boy would date rape you, and maybe kill you with his dick just to see if he can feel something. To each their own I guess, but… That moment really sealed it for me. And how that man, who seems like a genuinely nice, healthy guy, can summon that kind of things, and with such precision! WITCHCRAFT!
So glad I got to air out my daddy issues, thank you Sheila, thank you Jensen, happy birthday!
(Next year we’ll do Mommy Never Loved Me. Just kidding. Or am I)
ooooh I had never seen that clip, Lyrie. WOW. let me watch it again.
Blown away. (also – I felt like he could just keep riffing, improvising -he’s so creative. He’s a character actor who looks ……. like that.).
Okay I’ll be back. thank you so much for sharing. Need to watch again.
You’re right – he’s very scary in that. I don’t have the same triggered response but I very much appreciate your thoughts on what it brings up , and what he is doing that’s different, that stands out. That floating gaze!!!
he is sooooo good at the floating gaze. with Dean it was always tragic – but here? it just looks blank. scary.
// but girl, Soldier Boy would date rape you, and maybe kill you with his dick just to see if he can feel something. //
really good point. it’s one of the ways Dean could have turned out, let’s say. If he hadn’t had Sam to take care of. or a sense of humor.
// how that man, who seems like a genuinely nice, healthy guy, can summon that kind of things, and with such precision! WITCHCRAFT! //
I totally 100% agree with this. He’s like a nice happy dude who grew up in the suburbs. I mean, maybe there’s some torture we don’t know about … but either way it’s irrelevant. He is able to call up all this DARK STUFF – and yes: PRECISION. soooo important. He is never a “general” actor. It’s always specific. – it’s interesting because Dean channeled his rage – into hunting. Without hunting? Where would all that rage go?
also … maybe because I am just so damn used to him on Supernatural – with no swears beyond “bitch” and “dick” and … “douchebag” (lol) – it’s really startling to hear him swear like he does in the clip. I swear a lot too – so I’m not squeamish about language – it’s just … hearing him seethe “motherfucker” – is … it’s almost upsetting?
I’m happy for him, though – that he can let loose in that way whereas in SPN there were more language parameters.
//with Dean it was always tragic – but here? it just looks blank. scary.//
And when he tries to jokes after his outburst, as if to say to the people around him “let’s keep pretending I’m cool and nothing happened” – again, SO precise, and SO true! He’s not funny, and there’s also actually no humour in him. (again, I recognize it. it’s wild.)
// it’s one of the ways Dean could have turned out, let’s say. If he hadn’t had Sam to take care of. or a sense of humor.//
Yeah, it really makes you wonder, what makes people turn out the way they do. How it’s sometimes seemingly small things that make a difference. How much is free will? I feel like it’s in part the sort of fluidity we’ve often talked about that saves Dean from becoming like Soldier Boy: he’s been too often in a typically female position to become a typical male predator. Maybe that’s an oversimplification, though. And that does go along with what you mentioned, too, mothering Sam.
//and yes: PRECISION. soooo important. He is never a “general” actor. It’s always specific. //
I really love the things he does with his voice. You could miss it, like many things he does it’s so subtle. In Big Sky, he doesn’t overdo it, but his voice is like velvet – close to Demon Dean, sometimes, but not quite. And it makes sense – I can’t wait for you to chatch up – it’s fascinating to see him play a guy who is so secure in who he is, who is open. And not open like “Here are all my wounds that I’m trying to hide but it’s actually what I lead with” Dean Winchester. Just, comfortable, even if he has his own shit, Beau Arlen’s sense of identity is never threatened. And so he’s relaxed, and so is his voice. In The Boys, there’s something really tense in his vocal cords.
// it’s really startling to hear him swear like he does in the clip.//
Yeah, he went from 15 years of “asshat” to “cum guzzler,” that’s a change, for sure! The power of language is always fascinating. It is definitely fun to hear him say that. Also because he’s always so proper in interviews.
// He’s not funny, and there’s also actually no humour in him. //
and this is always so interesting to me – or things LIKE this. This goes along with my view of talented actors being like conductors of themSELVES. It’s like THEY are an orchestra – a full orchestra – with every possible instrument present – but depending on the role, they can mute or draw forward this or that different instrument. Like: okay, not gonna need a flute for this role. It’s all percussion. Or, I need to have a tiny bit of cymbals here, and a little bit of harpsichord, but mostly I will use the cello.
lol Like it gets that specific.
so here is JA – a very warm man – although proper, as you say – at least publicly – and aslo funny – like we all know how funny he is – and yet he is able to completely SUBDUE that part of himself, the natural part of himself – for a role. Or his self-deprecation. Like Soldier Boy is often amusing but he has no idea he’s being funny. He has no self-deprecation. It’s a total lack. and so Jensen doesn’t use that very natural impulse in himself because it doesn’t fit.
I am sure too that all of this is complicated by the fact that JA is so used to “playing Dean” that he won’t want to repeat himself. He’ll want to make sure the “pipes are clean” so to speak – and there isn’t any accidental spillover.
//This goes along with my view of talented actors being like conductors of themSELVES. It’s like THEY are an orchestra//
Right! And when they don’t just go broadly with the quatuor, no they make decisions about the alto, and that it’ll pizzicato. I like that metaphor a lot!
Yes – for sure – when to quiet down, when to burst forth –
my friend Dan Callahan – who’s writtenall these wonderful books about acting – said in one of our interviews that good acting is so much about “proportion”. If the proportions are off, you get a generalized performance – but if the proportions are perfect, you get a masterpiece. And that’s up to the actor to do. Nobody can really do that but the actor – each thing is a choice, a little bit of this, a lot of that, sprinkle in this, hold back that …
In acting classes you’d get criticisms about how something was “one note”. all yelling. all crying. or all attitude – like being sarcastic on every line. whatever.
I feel like JA was pretty fully formed in all this by the time he got to SPN – I didn’t notice too much amateurish generalizing in the stuff he did before. SPN is what challenged him though – and gave him enough ROOM.
// he’s been too often in a typically female position to become a typical male predator. //
I think this is really true. and of course SPN made so explict that Dean was damaged goods because of being so dominated by his dad. So here’s this tough guy – legit tough – not a put-on – but in certain situations he’s totally passive. or submissive. It’s required of him. Kind of a mind-fuck but I think it made him sensitive to … kids, of course, but also anyone who feels dominated and controlled.
//Kind of a mind-fuck //
Isn’t that just what we love?
//it made him sensitive to … kids, of course, but also anyone who feels dominated and controlled.//
Yes, whereas these are like catnip for Soldier Boy, but, to hurt them. Look at that shit, that shit, he scares me!
//Kim Manners directed many Supernatural episodes and was partially responsible for creating the almost-insane murderously-beautiful dark shadowy look of those early seasons//
Did I tell you about one of the most awesome dream I ever had? My dream was: My dream was being directed by Kim Manners. So all I could see was elegant circular camera movements, and extreme close ups of Mulder (it was the summer I binge watched The X Files). And in my dream I was thinking, “how lucky am I that Kim Manners is directing this.”
wow yeah, that gif. that’s some scary shit.
// And in my dream I was thinking, “how lucky am I that Kim Manners is directing this.” //
oh my God that is the best dream
I am so intrigued with what you say about Big Sky. I honestly don’t know anything about it. I’ll check it out!
“asshat” to “cumguzzler” omg
I did love the Ghost Facers episode where it became clear just how much those two actually swore “in real life”.
I’d love to hear your thoughts about Big Sky. I really enjoyed season 1. I ended up skipping parts of season 2 after a while, until the last episode, when sheriff Beau Arlen arrives in town. :)
I miss our SPN friends, but it was nice to celebrate JA’s birthday our way. Thanks for hosting the party, Sheila!
when does JA come on the scene? end of season 2?
I for sure miss SPN. I’m afraid to watch The Winchesters. I got a glimpse on Twitter of someone bitching (and rightfully so) about how Rowena shows up and is all BFFs with John and Mary which ….. in allllll the time she was on the show (and she broke the damn show) – hanging out with the Winchester brothers – not ONCE did she say “Back in the day, I hung out with your parents…”
stuff like that REALLY bugs me so I guess I’d rather not be subjected to it.
Last episode of season 2.
And The Winchesters… It pains me to say, because Robbie Thompson has written some of my favourite episodes of TV, but it’s really not a very good show, even without comparing to SPN. And not Rowena, but the writing in general, directing, acting… In the same way that when everyone is good it elevates everyone’s work, when it’s not great, it sometimes becomes hard to pinpoint how it ended up the way it did. Last week even directing… it looked so amateurish. When you can’t help but notice the blocking and editing because it’s so bad, it’s REALLY bad. It makes me really sad, I really wanted to like it, and sometimes it takes a while for first seasons to find their pace. But yeah, no, don’t watch. It’s sad. Pretty sure Dean will make an appearance at some point and I just don’t want him to.
Ugh. Yeah. I don’t think I can watch.
I’m hoping for an SPN reunion along the lines of what X-files has done – 6 episodes – get the old team together -Kripke – Sera G and Raelle please – Ben Edlund – I loved how X-Files definitely included their overall arc in SOME episodes, but then others were just basically one-offs – and the one-offs sometimes were the best most entertaining ones.
I’d so love that. It’d have to be GOOD though. I’m so burnt by seasons 12-15.
Yeah, I’d love that too IF it were good, otherwise it just makes things much worse – and I have to be honest, I don’t trust them anymore. It seems like they talk about that sometimes at conventions and it just makes me scared.
Even though I also miss them. Like, I’ll see pictures on Twitter and I’ll say out loud “Sammy, I miss you,” like a totally normal adult human person.
hahahaha
and yeah I totally don’t trust them. They didn’t even seem to know why so many of us loved the show at the end. It was so alienating.
It is just so fucking WEIRD to me to read on Twitter people say that the show is so much better after season 12. I understand that not everyone enjoys the same things, but… BUT!?
do not get that at all.
I think some people had what amounts to an abusive relationship with the show. like they so badly wanted to see their ship – or themSELVES – and they waited years and years in agony – and like … why put yourself through that?
And so then they embrace a character like …… Ketch? Fucking KETCH? as though he’s an awesome addition and everything they’ve been waiting for? It’s like they resented the whole Sam-Dean thing – and enjoyed anything that distracted from it.
Not everyone who liked Season 12 – but a LOT I suspect had a very troubled relationship with the show as it stood – and wanted it to be something else basically.
But … season 12? you wanted it to be season 12? or 13? (shudders) Really???
What a strange thing – I don’t watch The L Word waiting for it to become about the guys from Sons of Anarchy. If you think it’s so wrong, watch something else?
I’ve actually started writing an episode. It starts with Dean as a vegan gay barista. I’m sure I’d make lots of friends if I published it on Tumblr or Twitter. (and by friends I mean people who would want to physically hurt me)
I misse Ben Edlund.
And yeah Ketch, the whole thing with Mary, The BMOL… I hate it all SO MUCH.
The stories are NOT GOOD
NOT GOOD.
so high-tech. SPN is not supposed to be hi-tech. I can’t believe this – but I so missed people making “phone calls” by slitting some random person’s throat and murmuring incomprehensible words into the swirling blood.
Like … don’t set up your show like that, and then give the actual Devil a cell phone.
Cell phones existed when the show started. Sam and Dean had them. But Meg had to slit that guy’s throat to talk to the devil. This is GOOD. It’s CREATIVE. It’s GROSS. and it keeps the supernatural … supernatural.
I think what we really saw in those later scenes were – people who were just not imaginative or creative were running things. It was baffling.
So, I’m watching the latest epsiode of TW right now. And one thing that I think started in those latest seasons of SPN is that they make everything EXPLICIT, and it’s like, have you guys not heard of story and its function? That genres like horror, fantasy, etc exist to talk about those things WITHOUT talking about those things? Not only does it mean you can look at things under many different angles when you do that, but it’s also more entertaining, otherwise you leave nothing for the audience to DO? And also when you make the characters state stuff like “I need to solve my anger that comes from the trauma of my childhood and my attachement issues” it just sounds FUCKING DUMB? (I’m exaggerating, but barely)
Ugh, yeah. Putting everything into the language also means that nothing can stretch out and fester. I think people are really uncomfortable with festering – which, of course, is appropriate. Nobody likes festering. But festering is GOOD for building long story-arcs, building tension, allowing a show to LAST. also, yeah, to allow the characters to seem like real people, not just emotional attitudes perfectly fine with saying everything out loud.
I mean think about the long long fight Sam and Dean had in Season 9. Or even their “breakup” in Season 8 – or maybe it was 7? I get confused. I think it was 8. When Dean went and killed that creature whom Sam had a connection with from childhood? whenever that was.
That fight was TOXIC and it felt like it went on FOREVER and it was AGONY and it was also good shit! they let it FESTER. They prolonged the agony.
This makes an audience involved. Yes, some might be turned off and people will have strong feelings about it – but again, all of that is GOOD for good storytelling. It gets people involved, it gets people talking.
I LOVED that. I know so many people almost rejected the show when the brothers fought – or when things came between them. and that’s fine, that’s how they engaged with the show. But I LOVED when they were at odds. I LOVED when they looked outside their little belljar for company – companions – Benny! – whoever! it always brought out their relationship – their characters – so much more.
It was about EXPLORATION not EXPLANATION.
Yes, every time they got separated, it was so good! And every time they had to face themselves, too – and that was only good because it was several episodes in the making, so it was really paying off. How long did Sam remain soulless? They could have decided to solve that quickly because it made him unlikeable, but they milked that shit. It also gave both leads some really good stuff to play – instead of solving all the issues before they become really interesting, and then keep throwing very superficial external threats instead – that we don’t care about if it doesn’t affect them deeply!
I saw a screencap of Clap Your Hands yesterday, and I keep laughing just thinking about it. They’re both so funny in that episode. I think I know it by heart, and I have a terrible memory.
“Okay, so let’s go with you see it and I don’t. ”
“They were grabby incandescent douchebags, goodnight.”
Yes! soulless sam!! It was SO upsetting – I’ll never forget watching the season the first time (binging) – I just was SO UPSET, I almost laughed at myself. I couldn’t wait for Sam to come back. and poor Dean! Jesus. Wandering around the suburban house and having missionary sex with Lisa, with holy water under the bed. Like, someone save BOTH Winchester brothers!
“They were grabby incandescent douchebags, goodnight.”
I just can’t. I’m laughing out loud as I type. Your punctuation there captures it – just the WAY he says “goodnight” – and how imperious he is with that sweet sexy hippie girl – and I love how she’s like “Too soon?” lol
also yeah – Soulless Sam allows for tour de force acting – which I think JP was clearly doing. His soulless Sam was SO good – talk about being a conductor. He had to remove everything that makes him HIM – humor, listening, compassion – all those things that we recognize as JP. He had to get rid of all that. He had so much fun with it – and it seemed totally real.
When he puts his hand on Dean’s leg in the motel room – trying to be comforting – and Dean gets all weirded out.
Dying!!!
The show was so FREE to pull something like that off. It was so CONFIDENT in itself to allow for that kind of humor.
“Nipples?”
“You sit in the dark and you GRIEVE.”
“Can’t I have sex with the hippie chick too?”
“NO.”
Oh Dean.
“It was a little … hot … naked lady … and she hit me.”
//“You sit in the dark and you GRIEVE.”//
SHEILA, I am CRYING with laughter!!
I am weeping. all by myself. dying!!!
Also, the number of times I feel like something is sketchy and I mutter to myself “those tacos taste funny to you?” (another one of my favourites)
No wonder people think I’m bonkers
“Do you have bigger cups?”
Under his breath: “It’s like Sedona Arizona crapped in here”
“Pewterrific.” [the hand gesture, the half smile]
“Did you service Oberon?”
The thing JP does with his brow – as he tries to comprehend the information – it’s like his brow straightens out with surprise – he looks almost deadpan. (I love that JP brow thing.) But he does this without a soul and it makes it different. Sam would have teased Dean. He would have known the story was not true, but still teased. But soulless Sam really is wondering – “did Dean go off and sexually service a fairy king? what is happening?”
Yeah, really wondering about the facts, and trying hard to act appropriately but… how do you react appropriately to THAT?
Also, I have to say, I absolutely LOVE what that actress does. OK, so she was introduced as a cray-cray lady in the beginning, and it turns out she was right all along so now she does a bit of exposition. And she pretty much delivers straight info BUT, every time she says “yes”, and JUST the yesses, she sounds like she’s completely lost touch with reality. It’s brilliant!
Oh she is perfect. I love the whole cast of that episode – when they used to cast for character and not just a hot new person. Not everyone is hot, Supernatural. Even the hippie chick – who was gorgeous – had her own personality. and … the leprechaun? so ridiculous.
the watchmaker. excellent.
the guy at the UFO camper-trailer camp.
all the townspeople talking direct to camera.
all real people. caricatures – but real.
//Wandering around the suburban house and having missionary sex with Lisa, with holy water under the bed. //
That show was so ridiculous, in the best way. I don’t know if I’ll ever love a show that much ever again. Maybe it’s over for me.
I’ll just sit in the dark and GRIEVE. (I’m still wiping tears)
hahahahahahaha
//“It was a little … hot … naked lady … and she hit me.”//
DEAD. And how with each word, he puts a different commentary on what he saw!!
and JP’s reaction!! when “naked … lady” comes out his face is like ” ……What?”
Dean is totally traumatized. dying.
This is so much f’kn fun reliving 15 seasons of SPN in this AMAZING thread/stream of consciousness! Then you throw in “The Winchesters” (don’t waste your time, Sheila, you have better things to do), Justified Primeval, The Boys, and Big Sky! Thank you.
hahaha yesterday was so fun!!
I’m pretty booked for the next week with no room for anything outside a couple deadlines – but after that I’m gonna check out Big Sky!
Carolyn, I’m so glad it was fun for you to read! i think we celebrated Jensen’s birthday in the best way.
Now that I think of it, Oliphant and Ackles in the same show would just be too much. I’d need time off work to recover!
Thanks again, Sheila, I fell asleep giggling, it was amazing. Let’s do this again next year, ha!
“They were grabby incandescent douchebags, goodnight.”
I will never be over it. lol
Ha ha ha I know!! I kid you not, again because I am a very normal human, I regularly say it out loud, and giggle.
Another one I say out loud from time to time, and it makes me laugh out loud every time, from the Frecnh Mistake, and might be my very favourite line ever “Dean, grimly.”
There, I’m laughing again.
//Not everyone is hot, Supernatural.//
Found my next tattoo. On my wrist, in delicate cursive, like an inspirational quote.
hahahaha. Have you read the piece Everyone is Beautiful and No One is Horny?
I somehow missed it when it came out last year – and it’s practically an instant classic. She totally lays out this problem – she diagnoses it, and she doesn’t mention Supernatural but I kept thinking of those later seasons where even small one-offs were gleaming generic “beautiful” people.
I absolutely love this piece and I wish I had written it, lol. But I’m glad someone expressed it so perfectly.
actually I’m not sure if the writer is a man or a woman. I said “she” but it could be “he”.
Aaaaaaah, thanks I hadn’t hear of it, will definitely read! I don’t want to keep shitting on TW, and sadly I wish it were their main problem and it isn’t BUT it’s still one of my main qualms with it, when I yell at my screen, so I’m glad to know I’m not the only one who is PISSED about it. All those pretty, pretty people, two of them being John and Mary, who will become the parents of Hi-wanna-fuck-and-cuddle-a-little Dean and I’ll-take-you-standing-up-in-the-nearest-restroom Sam, in their 20s, facing (supposed) mortal danger, in the 70s, no less, AND NO ONE EVER FUCKS?!?!
And I mean, maybe John and Mary are sleeping together behind the scenes, or they just kiss like when I was 13? But come on, without showing it, there are MANY ways to suggest sex – sex, horror, etc, which the parent show did masterfully – so it’s even more painful.
I was wondering if it’s a CW thing, and a recent convo on Twitter made me realize that it might be a more generalized trend? And some of the arguments in that convo were absolutely WILD, by the way. I’m an old millenial, and the youths really made me feel how much closer I actually am to y’all grumpy Gen Xers.
It makes me even more glad for shows like You, or for the reboot of lesbian soft porn The L Word. It makes me sound like a horn dog, and maybe I am, but come ON!
and yeah I saw a couple of things lately that were frankly very sexy – the Hungarian film Preparations to Be Together for an Unknown Period of Time – is all about longing and yearning – and there’s an incredibly hot and tormented sex scene – a love scene really – it’s very full emotionally. I was like “ahhhh finally.” Not exactly in a horndog way – but because this was a story about two adults who were trying to connect – and …. that’s one of the oldest stories in the book, and if we are going to tell stories about adults we have to tell them in adult ways. The kids can just turn it off if they don’t like it.
This also reminds me of some of the huge fandom wars. Younger fans calling the older fanfic writers pervs for writing sick twisted sexy fanfic … it’s just ridiculous.
// y’all grumpy Gen Xers. //
lol
Oh the whole “sex scene discourse” has been raging for weeks now and I’ve finally muted people who can’t let it go. The kids are so anti-sex-scene I find it alienating and weird – they seem OLD – you’re supposed to get conservative and prudish when you’re OLD (even though …. I won’t, lol) – but it’s very weird to hear these kids who aren’t just anti sex scene but anti sex. all sex is assault, any TINY age gap is problematic, and … the worst argument and when I checked out of the conversation – was that if you’re watching a movie and suddenly there’s a sex scene, you haven’t “consented” to it and so that’s a problem.
I mean, WHAT. Turn the damn thing off if you don’t want sex scenes.
So that has definitely filtered down into a general anxiety about sex scenes or even suggestions of sex. This isn’t true of European films, really, thank God.
Supernatural was very messed up sexually – initially – and it was one of the draws, especially since none of it was actually SPOKEN. But even subtext is now frowned upon.
There was a total UPROAR in the SPN fandom after the opening scene of one of the later seasons – where Sam is drugged – in a basement? – and the British-lady Woman of Letters has sex with him – or maybe it’s just in his mind? Whatever: this was sex WITHOUT CONSENT and it SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED.
Meanwhile though – the whole SHOW in the early seasons was about things happening to them without their consent. Like, that’s the point? You open your mouth and a gigantic dick-shaped column of smoke pours into you without your consent. You have a demon living inside of you for MONTHS. You know.
So yeah. It’s an industry-wide thing right now – and it’s just going to get worse as the anti-sex brigade – (who all consider themselves progressives – and yet they all sound like right-wing Christians) – grow up and start being the adults in charge of things. Maybe they’ll calm down? I don’t know.
// all about longing and yearning//
My favourite! (that’s the gay part of me, ha ha)
And what you describe, yes: because sex can be just sex, and there’s nothing wrong with that, but it’s also about so many other things, because we’re PEOPLE. Connection, intimacy, feeling alive, …
// if we are going to tell stories about adults we have to tell them in adult ways. The kids can just turn it off if they don’t like it.//
See what I mean by grumpy? Ha ha, no but I’m with you. I discovered this morning that monster romance is a genre? And I was surprised for all of 2 seconds, imagined all the weird sexual stuff I had never thought about before in my life that must exist in that genre, laughed at myself for never have realized that before, shrugged, and moved on, because it’s not my thing (don’t tell me Benny is a monster) but I’m glad other people enjoy themselves. End of story.
People are weird.
I think I got to the whole sex scene discourse late, and by accident, and when I read “I did not CONSENT to watching it so it’s assault” I tuned it off because, wow. Woooww. And that’s what I meant by absolutely wild arguments. Yeah, the pendulum really swung waaaaay too far in the other direction.
//Supernatural was very messed up sexually – initially – and it was one of the draws, especially since none of it was actually SPOKEN. //
Absolutely! And it was half the fun! Those guys were sexy as fuck, and getting the girls, and constantly being threatened and assaulted, and poor Sam had some angel cum left in him – sorry, angel grace.
//There was a total UPROAR in the SPN fandom after the opening scene of one of the later seasons – where Sam is drugged – in a basement? – and the British-lady Woman of Letters has sex with him//
Which was maybe the only thing in that whole season that was actually both inventive and true to the show’s essence.
//You have a demon living inside of you for MONTHS. You know.//
That was even an actual joke in season 2, in Born Under a Bad Sign, when after being SO worried for his brother, who was violated by Meg, Dean jokes “you had a girl inside you for weeks.”
I hate that the current climate is turning me into “you can’t say anything anymore” because I really don’t think that’s what I stand for either.
//you’re supposed to get conservative and prudish when you’re OLD (even though …. I won’t, lol)//
No, I suspect in a few decades they’ll have brain implants zapping them when they have impure thoughts, meanwhile you and I will be illegally breaking into server rooms to chat on your blog – by then impossible to find via normal ways to access the internet – so we can laugh our wrinkled faces off and lust over Jensen Ackles and his Impossible Crows Feet.
And thank you for that piece (it is written by a woman), it was really excellent! I love how she put it in context, including historically, and it was delightful to read too. “inoffensively bland” is SUCH a perfect dsecription of what we’re seeing.
And the picture of Wolverine reminded me of a comment I read on Twitter a few months ago, and now it’s all I can think about when I see those kinds of bodies: who finds men with basically dick veins on their arms attractive? Who decided that?
// “I did not CONSENT to watching it so it’s assault” //
Yeah. This attitude is prevalent enough that it really must be fought against. It can’t gain any more sway. I actually consider it dangerous. Even though it might be just a dumb angsty teenager or 20something who’s never had sex and spent too much time on Tumblr.
Agreed, I don’t think it’s a coincidence that we see this renewed rigid belief in purity at the same time as the rise of fascism. And it’s not entirely surprising but super bizarre when it comes from crowds who seem otherwise progressive.
Yes – when progressives join hands with fundamentalists in their desire to censor/suppress – even if they want to suppress different things – it’s very dangerous. It’s groupthink and control. and neither side can seem to see that they’re doing the same thing as the hated other side. It’s very hard to maintain equilibrium. writing helps! but it’s hard to resist these two very powerful sides.
Fascinating as always, but I blame it all on the fact that when these movies were made that are based on super humans based on comic books, no one noticed that neither Batman, Superman, Thor, etc., etc., were anatomically correct.
lol
Sheila, it was the season finale of TW, and I am so upset! And I know it’s a little ridiculous to be upset about a tv show, but… whatever. I’m so sad about where the whole mythology thing went. I knew the episode was written by Robbie Thompson before his name appeared because it felt like it was written by a professional – which sounds mean, but I’m not looking for things to criticize, it was just so THERE.
Anyway, I’m a dumbass, and I’m all upsetti spaghettti when most people seem to be happy about it? Maybe because the people who loved the first seasons of SPN are long gone. I’ll keep coming here to revisit those glorious episodes until the end of time.
what did they do with the mythology? I haven’t watched one episode.
Jensen was on it last night, right? I think I saw a trailer on Insta
// Maybe because the people who loved the first seasons of SPN are long gone. //
Ugh, yeah. that’s kind of heartbreaking but it makes sense.
In the end, these John and Mary are from a different universe. They’re different people? What kind of lazy ass writing is that? And if it’s not them why should we even care? Why would Dean care? What the fuck is that alternate universe bullshit? If it’s an alternate universe why did we need Rowena, still? And Dean showed up up with Bobby and Jack for WHAT – apart to try and get some cheap nostalgia points, because their presence actually served NOTHING in the story.
God, Sheila, I am a n g e r
lol
JACK was there?
where’s SAM?
He was there to say HELLO. Like, LITERALLY.
Sam is alive in HIS universe, which is not the same universe.
// Sam is alive in HIS universe, which is not the same universe. //
oh for fuck’s sake
I don’t think I can watch. although I admit I’m curious.
thanks for taking one for the team.
again with the whole AU thing – it’s so STUPID.
It’s like they forgot the origins of the show. it would be like X-Files totally morphing into a whole other genre by the end of the series.
who DOES that?
and why didn’t anyone NOTICE?
so … they’re alien beings masquerading as John and Mary?
I can’t.
So they’re John and Mary, except it’s not our reality. But everything else is pretty much the same. And their big bad? Some insect-dudes Chuck left there as a failsafe to destroy his universes. Buy hey thanks to Dean from another universe (ours, or his), they’re saved! Hurrah! Who gives a shit!? They can now have another Dean and Sam? What!?!
I can’t even believe what I just read.
these people read way too much sci-fi and need to read more Stephen King.
// Who gives a shit!? They can now have another Dean and Sam? What!?! // lol
still my favorite exchange that you and I ever had:
Me: What IS Castiel now?
You: Don’t know. Don’t care.
Listen, I know I’m a drama queen bitch, but I had to take breaks to cry a little, and I was like “please someone make it stop. Kripke, DO SOMETHING.” lol
I fucking hate Chuck. and I hate saying that because I loved Chuck in his initial incarnation. they ruined it by making him God. Ugh.
Insects? Leave it to Chuck. He’s the WORST.
//Me: What IS Castiel now?
You: Don’t know. Don’t care.//
Ha ha ha haaaa, sure sounds like me!
I love Ackles, his wife, Robbie Thompson, Beaver, Calvert – John F. Showalter directed! All of them. I say that with love in my heart: they’re smart people, surely they see it’s not very good? I hope it stops here. Please.
yes these are good creative people! it makes no sense!
it’s got to have its fans – I wonder if anyone who is NOT a supernatural fan is tuning in?
I wonder what it all seems like if you’ve never seen the show.
why are they so committed to ruining this perfect show (in the early seasons). it’s like they strayed so far from the original idea they couldn’t “get back” to it if they tried – they went way too far off the path, did irreversible damage.
Sheila, I think your site is pissed that I’m criticizing TW in a post dedicated to JA, because since WEdnesday night I can’t post, I keep getting a 403 error message (I just managed to get that ONE reply yesterday before getting blocked again). At least I know the limits: I can write “dick” but not talk about TW, ha!
Oh for fuck’s was my reaction too, to pretty much the whole thing, honestly.
//these people read way too much sci-fi and need to read more Stephen King.//
Yeah, pretty sure there was a Doctor Who reference, unless Thompson was drunk when he wrote that they have to “reverse the polarity” of the thing. Listen, I love Doctor Who. It’s just not the vibe!
I don’t know, imagine Sorkin deciding after X season of the West Wing that it needs dudes on Harleys (don’t know why I keep referencing Sons of Anarchy lately, I guess I’m due for a re-watch). It’s just fucking bizarre!
//thanks for taking one for the team.//
Yeah, I bailed during season 13 (i think) but with this I wanted to hope. But recognizing after just a few sentences that the showrunner wrote the episode because it didn’t sound clunky all of a sudden kind of tells you what my experience has been like. And to be clear, I bought the season pass after the pilot aired. I don’t spend money on things to hate on them. I really, really wanted to like the show.
The final straw: they finally got the right for a Led Zeppelin song. Now? For THIS!? It makes me so sad.
//I wonder what it all seems like if you’ve never seen the show.//
I suppose the expectations aren’t the same, so it must not be as much of a let down. But frankly, even if it weren’t in the SPN universe I’d be bummed if that was that showrunner’s show, because I’ve loved his work so much. I realize I might be too old to be the target audience, and tastes change (a little) but I’m pretty sure that at 20 I could tell when something wasn’t very good.
I’m sorry Jensen! I love you! (as if he’d care lol). But I know occasionaly Jim Beaver stops by, so I’m really hoping he sticks to posts about movies. Although – I love him too, since Deadwood!
I’m re-watching it every few years, and every time I’m awed by different things. There’s one scene where Jim Beaver delivers a monlogue, talking to a dog, while being busy doing gold-digging stuff, and holy shit, that takes some fucking mastery.
I really prefer talking about things I love. (let’s see if your site blocks that, I guess, ha ha)
// imagine Sorkin deciding after X season of the West Wing that it needs dudes on Harleys //
I know! they just didn’t care. and I don’t think the CW ever really knew what SPN was trying to do anyway – and had no understanding of the genre. (Hollywood Babylon lampooning the disconnect.). Like, horror is a very specific thing – it has its own fans – and there are almost no horror genre shows – like, maybe corner the market in this smaller genre – as opposed to being just another boring YA-fantasy show, like every other damn show?
some people love fantasy, that’s fine. I’m not one of them. I like sci-fi sometimes – but even early on, with the “special children” in Season 2 – and the sort of X-men way things were going … it was just a tiiiiiiiny bit corny, and I wasn’t really into it. You could feel the pull of the whole fantasy genre – it’s a fine line, I guess. Supernatural/horror and Supernatural/sci-fi-fantasy – but we sure could feel the difference. I mean, by the end, were there ANY scary episodes? Like … Roadkill? God, I loved Roadkill. Fantasy isn’t scary, horror IS. it was all just a mess.
and it speaks to the actors – Jared, Jensen, Jim – the core group – that I didn’t drop away. I couldn’t. I was WAY too invested in all of them.
//some people love fantasy, that’s fine. I’m not one of them. I like sci-fi sometimes//
I don’t love all of it, but I do like fantasy. And sometimes sci-fi, when the focus is on the characters (Severance is my favourite show of the past year, I love it SO MUCH) – hell, I even love Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. even though it’s sci-fi AND superheroes, which, if there’s a genre I’m not into, that would be it.
And yeah, when the horror is supernatural in nature, I guess it overlaps a little with fantasy – Buffy did it too. And fantasy can be scary with a bit of horror in it – Sera Gamble did it beautifully in The Magicians, I think. The last scene of the pilot still haunts me, it SO GOOD, literal goosebumps, it scared the shit out of me. And once the show progresses and you understand what the monster stood for? Equally horrifying – excellent, 10/10. But Sera Gamble IS a horror writer.
But the thing is, those latest seasons were not horror anymore, but it was also shitty fantasy? Low stakes, incompetent characters (I can’t forgive them for that, and it’s also an issue in TW: those young hunters are not very bright, sorry), nothing has a COST – magic should have a cost, even in fantasy, otherwise what is the point?
And yeah, not only is not horror anymore, but I can’t tell if they tried and failed or if they voluntarily destroyed what the early seasons had established. The last season opening with the monsters from season 1, lightly jogging in a suburban street, in broad daylight, cheesy makeup and all? Why don’t you just open the brothers’ mouths AND TAKE A DUMP IN THEIR FACES WHILE YOU’RE AT IT
I guess I’m still angry about it.
//and it speaks to the actors – Jared, Jensen, Jim – the core group – that I didn’t drop away. I couldn’t. I was WAY too invested in all of them.//
Definitely. But it’s also why sometimes I couldn’t watch – maybe I’m an idiot but I felt angry and embarrased for them? There strings of episodes where NOTHING HAPPENS WITH SAM, who is one of the leads, and I was just fuming for Padalecki, who gave 15 years for that show with crazy hours, his family in Texas, etc‧, and he has to play “why do ears?” and “look I am breathing hard.” I can’t. Anger.
The actors, and also what the writers in the early seasons had established – the inner lives of those characters – Dean’s off screen hookups, Sam’s life in college, Bobby’s past (thank you Sera Gamble for Death’s Door), Bobby and Rufus, etc. All those things that were so rich that they managed to carry over in later seasons when they were written in the most boring ways – we KNEW all of that about them, so did the actors, and so they were still – most of the time – three dimensional characters.
//even early on, with the “special children” in Season 2 – and the sort of X-men way things were going … it was just a tiiiiiiiny bit corny, and I wasn’t really into it. //
Yeah, I didn’t mind – binge-watching probably helped – but I also think they stopped it before it completely derailed everything. Same with the roadhouse, which I loved (And Ash! I will miss Ash forever!), but in the long run it would have created something that would have changed the structure of the show too much – so, of course, they ended up doing that whole “network of hunters” and Hunter Central in the bunker anyway. Hey guys, maybe if the original showrunner decided to literally burn that shit to the ground after one season, that should have told you something? No?
But I think I also didn’t hate it because even if there were kind of superpowers, they came at a price – that’s what I mean, that isn’t there in the latest seasons with whoosh-purple-smoke-Rowena type of magic. Ava lost her fiancé, and herself. Andy had an evil twin – and although I’m laughing just typing that, the episode was actually really sad. He could have had a brother, he had a friend who could have been a girlfriend, but he lost all of that before it even began. Those powers came at a huge cost. And those characters didn’t look like models, they looked like real people (again, great casting, I love all of them). There was still something… earthy? grimy? You know, that whole look the show had in the beginning that had so much texture you could SMELL it. Everything was sweat and blood, and dirty and complicated.
Nothing was sanitized, nondescript, tv land. AND the episode introducing Andy was Ben Edlund’s first episode on the show and it was so good. Even with that thing that they ended up scraping, season 2 is near perfection, and my favourite.
Dick, dick, dick.
Guess I’m un-blocked.
I think the blocking happens if you try to comment too many times in succession. that happened to me a couple of times during our more fast and furious group SPN discussions. Basically my site probably thought you were spam.
I don’t have any language parameters set up!!
I know, I was joking!
I thought it might be something like that but yesterday was odd, because I was able to post one message, it took some time to compose the longer one, and then I couldn’t post it. Also I feel like it should have blocked me more often, maybe? Ha!
Funny it happened to you on your own site. The intensity of SPN posts!
that’s really weird. It might have just been a server glitch or something? I don’t understand technology!
and yeah – I’ve been locked out of my own site before because it thinks I’m a spammer. I was like “No, it’s just that we’re talking about Route 666 and I’m making 10 comments every 10 minutes, it’s all perfectly normal.”
Ha ha ha, just PERFECTLY NORMAL – maybe THAT’S my next tattoo, on my forehead.
Nothing to say except that this thread cracked me up. I miss reading these conversations!
<3
Hey!! It’s so good to hear from you – love following along with your life on Insta (hope that doesn’t sound creepy – lol – I just mean that the original group of SPN commenters here are dear to my heart!).
I miss these conversations too – the show was just so damn fun to talk about! Especially with THIS group of commenters.
No, glad you remember me! I still check your blog pretty much every day (and often discover something super interesting).
I’m so glad that these conversations are still happening here– I’ve had to shut my eyes to the SPN discourse everywhere else. But you guys get it.
Justified Promivale, this summer! https://variety.com/2023/tv/news/justified-city-primeval-premiere-dawsons-creek-25th-anniversary-panel-atx-tv-festival-1235570843/
Has it really been that long? What?!?
WOW. what a great panel and festival. 25 years??
my only beef with your blog sheila is that I can’t give little love heart reactions and thumbs up to all the comments as I scroll down! It was lovely to be re-immersed in the old vibes and Lyrie – frankly I love your TW vitriol because I am still grossed out about the whole thing not in like a “haha she’s big mad about the tv” way but a “yikes, she’s big bad about the TV” way……and I didn’t even watch it :S
Was just thinking this same thing. Would also give a heart to lots of the commenters’ contributions, including this one from Jessie
(Just for instance, I finally watched Tar, and there is a lot of good back-and-forth on the Tar-adjacent threads)
My blog’s design is sooooo 2008. I just can’t bear to change it. and honestly I’m afraid if I update I will lose comments (it happened the last time). I scroll way back sometimes and see comments from my dad – and just seeing it knocks me flat. i want to know they’re still there!
Thanks Mike – always good to have people show up and leave their thoughts, whatever they might be!
I never watched it either but even hearing a tiny bit about it was quite enough.
Thank goodness for people like Lyrie who took one for the team and watched in order to report back on the insect beings and Dean breaking the space-time continuum.
Praise Lyrie! although I was sorry for those who lost their jobs, when it didn’t get picked up for season 2 truly I was grateful, for fear that the game of ‘but why did they do this particular thing? and if they had to do it, why did they do it in this particular way?’ would never end.
I don’t mind your 2008 style blog really Sheila, I’ve just gotten used to relying on emoji reactions for 90% of my communication. It’s good to be forced back on the keys!
Mike — thanks for the tip on the Tar threads, I’ll have to jump in once I cross it off the list.
Praise me! ha ha ha
Happy to be of service. I was literally ranting about TW to a friend yesterday, because I can’t let go and my friend is very patient. JA tweeting to “save TW” without a word of support for the writers’ strike was so tone deaf too. At some point, I’ll manage to pretend the whole thing never happened, like the sequel of Dead Like Me.
Someday.
(Happy 4th)
// JA tweeting to “save TW” without a word of support for the writers’ strike was so tone deaf too. //
ugh
Oh it’s that time of the year again? LET THE ACKLESFEST BEGIN!!
ha ha I’m not sure we can top last year — or should even attempt.
Leaving me hanging, ha!
Hopefully next year there will be more Ackles news to dig into. :)
busy day! not much to report except the usual shared appreciation.
Same! I was hoping maybe some hidden reader would have jumped in during the day. Those strikes have put so many things on hold. It’s just starting to pick up again, in tv land. I’m looking forward to having more to discuss.
take care!
Is Rust back in action? I’ve been peeking in on the trial going on right now. I was wondering if JA would be called to testify since he was there on that day, and gave an interview to the police. :(
Yay for Acklemania! I’ve just been going through last year’s thread, which had me laughing and nostalgic at once – and you pretty much said what I was going to comment, about JA using facets of himself in his characters. Beau Arlen on Big Sky is a fascinating contrast to Dean. I kept thinking that he is sort of how Dean might be without the trauma and parentification. Lyrie said he’s relaxed and confident, and I think that nails it. I also think, of all his characters, he’s the closest to the Jensen we see at conventions and in interviews. And even with Beau there are moments of vulnerability, in scenes with his daughter or with his ex-wife. There’s one scene I remember in particular where he confesses to his ex that he still loves her, and he crumbles almost into tears. Almost.
As for Rust, I know they finished filming, because that happened over south of Livingston in the Emigrant Valley late last year. It was in the local news quite a bit. But I don’t know if JA was there, he was never mentioned. (Still, I have never been so sorely tempted to go stalk a movie set …)
Keep up the good work, Sheila! SPN folks, I miss you.
Barb – I still need to catch up with Big Sky!
I do remember seeing snippets of news here and there about Rust starting up again – it makes sense that the production company would not want it to be publicized. “yay, starting up the shoot!” Uhm, no.
Such a tragedy.
Barb, heyyy! Yeah, I’m just cruising on that nostalgia, I just can’t let go! Those entire days spent reading recaps and commenting, and laughing my head off at reading everyone! And just getting to spend more time in those stories in a way I couldn’t find anywhere else – I’m not a con person. I remember once realizing there was a new recap while I was in class for my master’s and getting so annoyed – I needed to get OUT of there STAT. I just sat on the grass outside the building with my lunch and my laptop, reading that long as post… Another time one was posted when I was waiting for a Metallica concert to start. The BEST way to wait!
I don’t long for my teenage years, those were horrible, but man, the era of Sheila’s SPN Recaps…. those were the days!
I wasn’t bummed out when Big Sky wasn’t renewed, it was fine but it was nice to see him in something different, more gentle, character-wise. I’m curious about what he’ll do next!
Same here – I may or may not have spent some evening desk hours poring over the recaps and talking to you all. Shhhhhhhh –
I respect the not being into cons, but if you ever wanted to, I might try to be there- a Sheila’s SPN recappers’ reunion?
We don’t need to give money to some company to do that, though. But yes, that would be weird and fun, I like that idea, Barb!
The shooting of “Rust” is completed. Jensen did not return there, his role was given to another actor.
Claire – thanks for the update!
Thanks for the update, Claire – yes, they have removed his credit on it on IMDb. What a bummer for him, professionally, because it was such a perfect project for him, but of course, it’s nothing in comparison to the heartbreaking tragedy of Halyna Hutchins’ death.
He’s well out of it! The whole thing has a nasty STINK around it now. I don’t envy the people who couldn’t get out of it and had to go back. I mean, they left Midnight Rider unfinished, which I think is the proper thing to do. You all deserve to lose that money.
I haven’t been following closely, just seeing a few headlines here and there, and it seems like it’s a complete shitshow where no one is taking responsibility? I might be wrong, but it’s how it comes off seen from afar. It must be son hard on her family.
I think at this point they just want to make back their money which I think is gross, and also maybe make some $ to give to her family. I get all of this but I still think it’s gross. Someone died. You don’t deserve to make a movie if you run such a horrible set that someone died. see: Midnight Rider. I get why people took their jobs back – it’s not their fault. the money people are to blame. I can’t believe they even got clearance – and insurance! – to resume shooting.
Yeah, gross. There’s a reason people went on strike and more professions got unionized.
Yeah, I saw that on IMDB last night, too – thank you, Claire, for the update.
It seemed like they only shot up here for a very short amount of time, like a week or two. They must have completely reshot the part in very short order.
How on earth are they going to release this movie? I know Hutchins’ family will receive the profits, but still, they’re in the middle of trials and Baldwin being indicted, and it feels like shadow of the tragedy will loom over it no matter what.
Back on JA, I admit that, while I didn’t go looking for it, I did watch footage of his police interview when it popped up on my YouTube feed. He impressed me all over again there. Very clear and articulate – I felt like I learned something about how guns are handled on set from him or at least, how they should be. Towards the end, he asked if there were any live rounds in his own gun, which was a chilling thought.
Barb – yes, I watched that interview too and think he came across well and you could tell he was still traumatized. I think he was a little too diplomatic. You’re not giving an interview to Entertainment Weekly where you have to measure your words and maybe think before spouting off. You’re with the police. “Safety protocols were a little loose” he said. Yeah, I’ll say. By the end when he said “I want to know how the hell a live round got on my set” – I think he said “my set” – I felt his sense of responsibility and his professionalism, and also how upset he was. I think he should have had a lawyer with him.
I can’t even imagine how terrifying it must be for him and the people who love him to think that the bullet would have been in that gun pointing at him for the next scene.
with all of the trial shit going on – we still don’t have an answer to how the hell it happened. I think it was chaos on that set and I wish JA had been a bit more forthcoming about that. He also sounded irritated at the camera crew walking off when they did, last minute, so there was no time to organize replacements. of COURSE they walked off at the last minute BECAUSE they wanted to inconvenience everyone – this is how you make an impact. I guess I’m not surprised – JA never made any statement in solidarity with the writers/actors strike – instead was Tweeting about The Winchesters – I was disappointed. I don’t think it was a good look to seem irritated at the one group of people on that set who were smart enough to be like, “You know what? Fuck this chaos. Bye.”
JA didn’t do anything wrong. He just happened to be there. It’s a terrible story all around.
“JA never made any statement in solidarity with the writers/actors strike – instead was Tweeting about The Winchesters – I was disappointed.”
I’m sorry, but this is wrong
_https://twitter.com/JensenAckles/status/1696666637032730886_
I also want to thank you, Sheila, for this amazing blog and, most especially, for brilliant reviews of SPN (and sorry for poor English, this is an automatic translation)))
He did the bare minimum – not even . Half of my family and friend group are in those unions and suffered real financial hardship – not to mention still having not recovered from loss of work during the pandemic – so a Tweet is not enough, particularly for a big star like himself. I was very disappointed. People who make no money put themselves on the line for months on end. On the picket line every day. Including big stars. He’s loaded and he didn’t. These things really matter. Those unions are nothing without active solidarity, and the fortunate “haves” backing up the “have nots”. I mean he’s not a terrible person but – like Drew Barrymore – whom I also love – I won’t forget.
I come from a long line of union members stretching back to my immigrant grandfather. I’m a member of Actors Equity myself. Unions need solidarity, especially now – looking around the media world where I work, which is actively sinisterly anti-Union. This fight is bigger than JA and he’s really irrelevant to the larger point. Im proud of the people who really put themselves at risk, who fought for really important rights in an industry so changed right now they want to replace humans with AI. So JA can do whatever he wants, my support is with the people who really showed up. And the fight is not over. The wrong people in charge and there is still work to be done to CHECK them.
all of this being said – I appreciate the kind words, Claire – and I have a lot of nostalgia for the couple of years where I was writing those SPN re-caps. It was soooo fun.
I’m super late to this convo, whoops, but I wanted to agree that JA was pretty “bare minimum” in his support of the strike. I wouldn’t be surprised if his upbringing in Texas colored his politics on that. My experience in more conservative parts of the country, particularly, was that unions got a bad rap for protecting lazy workers at the expense of more conscientious ones. And, as someone who was always a bit of a go-getter, I totally bought the conservative line on that when I was younger. It’s a great way to pit workers against each other, unfortunately, and I suspect JA identifies strongly with the conscientious camp (so he’s probably pretty susceptible to that messaging, too).
Also, if you don’t have a great grasp of labor history, it’s easy to be vaguely “pro-union” but not really understand or support **actually striking.** (Which is where I suspect Stephen Amell, for example, was coming from with his whole “Of course I support my union, I just don’t think they should strike” bit. I know he’s friends with JA, so I kind of wondered if JA’s silence was because his thoughts were along the same vein.)
Anyway… I’m actually a big believer in the power of educating people about things like labor history — IMO, eradicating ignorance & combating propaganda goes a long way towards changing people’s attitudes & actions — but political discourse in the U.S. is so polarized & poisonous these days that I’ve kind of lost the heart to tackle these conversations anymore. :/ I hope somebody close to him at least **tried** to plant a few seeds that might grow in the right direction.
(And I hope I can find the energy/strength to go back to trying to plant these seeds myself! It’s so much easier to have a DEBATE than a conversation, but you get a lot farther with a conversation… and we really do need all the converts we can get.)
Ginny – I agree with everything you said.
Some of the “commentary” during this latest strike was so ignorant I didn’t even know where to begin. There’s this totally ignorant “belief” that actors are rich – or that the strike was about Matt Damon wanting to get paid better. Millionaires wanting more. No matter how many times you would say – that is not what this strike is about – the belief was unshakable. The idea that most actors are hand to mouth – IF that – just … doesn’t compute for these people. I don’t know, I grew up in a family of actors – so I never needed the learning curve that the majority of actors are working class.
Underneath this ignorance is also a hostility towards art and artists in general – even from the people who “consume” (gross) movies/TV shows. It’s kind of a “they should be lucky they get to to do it at ALL” kind of thing. almost HAPPY that the annoying Drama Club kids are struggling – like really vicious. and this attitude is not just from the conservative side of the fence. It is deeply engrained in American culture.
So much learning has to happen for people to even understand about the important of residuals and how streaming has completely destroyed that – how the industry is now run by companies who operate with ZERO transparency. Like netflix and all the others – never releasing their numbers or their algorithms or their operating plan – but this is across the board. So nobody even KNOWS what’s going on there – at least in the old studio system, these were public companies that had to be transparent so we could at least SEE what they were doing.
It’s really disheartening – I mean, the strike is over but nothing has been resolved. The wrong people are in charge. People who are actively hostile to art and artists. Who literally want to replace humans because it’s cheaper. Sinister.
There’s still so much work to be done in education, as you say. You gotta watch these corporate big-wigs like a hawk. They are up to no good!
There’s always SOMETHING to pit workers against each other. Teachers and nurses should work out in terrible conditions just out of vocation, migrant farm workers are lucky to work at all, and artists – the glamour! LOL Which is infuriating when you know what the working conditions actually look like for most artists. It’s true there’s a special kind of jealousy for them.
That’s also why it’s important for people who have a platform to be in solidarity and acknowledge what it’s like for the majority of their coworkers. Colin Farrell for instance was on the picket lines and doing a good job talking about those things to the media.
And yeah, the situation is dire. The writers have made historical gains, but… that only counts for something if there are actual jobs, the number of which are dwindling right now. I wonder how the situation will evolve – are we going to see a new age of indie productions, maybe? It can’t stay that way forever – not just because artists need to work but because the audience needs art and entertainment — made by… actual people.
// How on earth are they going to release this movie? I know Hutchins’ family will receive the profits, but still, they’re in the middle of trials and Baldwin being indicted, and it feels like shadow of the tragedy will loom over it no matter what. //
I know! I feel like they should just … stop. Maybe yes they feel some obligation to make some money as restitution, which I respect, but still, it’s pretty grim!
I can’t remember the timeline. I know it was a short shoot – but they can’t have had too much with JA in it, if they completely re-cast it!
// He also sounded irritated at the camera crew walking off when they did, last minute, so there was no time to organize replacements. of COURSE they walked off at the last minute BECAUSE they wanted to inconvenience everyone – this is how you make an impact. I guess I’m not surprised – JA never made any statement in solidarity with the writers/actors strike //
I had no idea his police interview was out there so I googled it, but I just can’t watch it, it makes me feel like a vulture (not a comment on other people’s choice, I just have an issue with real life stuff – I can’t watch reality tv because of second embarrassment, true crime scares me to death… there’s a reason why I mostly stick to fiction!)
Anyway, I clicked at random and ended up exactly on that moment, when talks about the crew walking out and had the exact same thoughts, Sheila – I too, thought it was consistent with his silence during the strikes. Oh well, it’s not like he’s a terrible person, it’s just always a little disappointing.
// I just can’t watch it, it makes me feel like a vulture //
I totally know what you mean. This one interested me not just because of JA but because it was a movie situation – and one of my cousins is married to a professional armorer. And my cousin’s husband is more along the lines of what JA was describing as the “typical” armorer – either ex-cops or ex-military, intimidating guys who put the fear of God into you about gun safety. JA is VERY well trained but he said he preferred guys like that – but he was also trying to be supportive of this young woman in a male-dominated field. blah blah. So it was just like baffling how this happened – I remember when Jon Erik Hexum died – but that was more understandable, as terrible as it was. He was goofing around – so that was on him – and it was a blank, and blanks are dangerous. so clearly there was some disconnect between gun training and behavior. and then there was the horrible situation with Brandon Lee. There is precedent for being extra careful of these blanks / dummy rounds. But either way you slice it : there should never EVER be live ammunition anywhere near a movie set.
// I clicked at random and ended up exactly on that moment, when talks about the crew walking out and had the exact same thoughts, Sheila //
Hahaha Random click and there the moment is! It’s jarring, his irritated tone, and one of the reasons why I think he should have had a lawyer with him. Never talk to the cops without a lawyer, JA!!
Well- nobody’s perfect. :-)
(I agree, that threw me, too)
Jensen brings all the girls back to the yard! hee hee. I’m selfishly grateful to hear that he’s no longer in Rust so that I don’t have to engage my feelings in that unfortunate project any more. But what’s next?! I suppose I’m looking forward to S4 of The Boys. Did anyone watch GenV? He was in an episode for a scene and engaging to watch as always but it was SUCH a bummer of a missed opportunity because his “appearance” was the manifestation of a teen girl’s idea of Soldier Boy and they just wrote him as straight SB. They could have made him do some real goofy stuff. Boooooooooooooooooooooooo!
Yesssssss! For sure, the joke was a fun commentary on Ackles but… it could have been more than just the cringe joke? I like Gen V more than The Boys overall – there’s a tiny bit more tenderness, maybe? And I wish we could that would have been reflected in Soldier Boy’s cameo. We get it, he makes the girls wet, they’re so stupid, ha ha… I’m not taking it personally, or anything, I swear… but – whatever.
Me too, very curious to see what’s next.
I have to confess although I enjoyed gen v fine and think they did some fun literalisation of teen issues with the powers, I actually never finished it after Jensen’s episode. I guess subconsciously I was like “this is done now” lol. I should knock it off though! I see what you mean about tenderness, but I just enjoy the main show more because the key players have more charisma.
Yes the cameo, sure the teen girls love him but that’s because they don’t know the “real” him! he’s her fantasy! he should have been a 12 year old girl’s fantasy, whether it’s weird or dashing or whatever! maybe after the teen Amara plotline he was like never again haha
//maybe after the teen Amara plotline he was like never again haha//
ha ha ha haaaaaa mayyyyyybe
// so that I don’t have to engage my feelings in that unfortunate project //
lol
I feel the same way.
I’m sure Jensen fans have heard this traumatizing news from yesterday’s trial testimony – in a disgraceful story full of trauma and tragedy.
attorney: “Mr. Ackles, another actor on the set, turns out that he — as he acted, as he performed — had a live bullet in his bandolier, correct?”
Horrifying. He must be so fucking upset.
This makes me wonder if JA didn’t check his gun before he put on his holster, like he normally does, because the set was so chaotic that day? Not to blame him – at ALL – I’d have to go back and watch his police interview, which I really would rather not do, because his “it was a little loose on set” diplomacy seems completely inappropriate for the magnitude of what occurred. But I know he talked about his day and the order of what he did. I’m just horrified at how live ammo was just lying around everywhere all mixed up with dummies. I don’t even know what to say. this goes way WAY beyond negligence. It’s so upsetting.
This was such an avoidable tragedy. RIP Halyna. You deserved so much better from this industry you loved so much.
Oh I hadn’t heard. This whole thing is so horrible and that detail is horrifying. That there were several weapons with live rounds – my god! I hope this helps *some people* realize that better working conditions, which are gained thanks to labour unions, are good, actually. I realize there might be more to it in this specific case, but still – shorter work days and less stress is a pretty basic way to avoid mistakes.
That poor woman and her family. RIP.
I think you’re 100% correct. Cutting corners due to budgetary concerns – or using non-union people – often leads to sloppiness or lack of oversight. If you’re a star – like JA – then you know going into a low budget film, you’ll be put up in a Holiday Inn – and not a 4-star hotel or given your own house to stay in or whatever – and you’re fine with it because you’re psyched to be in the movie. You hear about actors working “for scale” – meaning they are paid the minimum allowed, barely better than a day player. Actors willingly do this – forgoing their salaries – because they want to be in the movie. they believe in the project. they want to see it get made.
This is one thing. But hiring an inexperienced armorer – just because she comes cheap – is stupid, almost criminally negligent – ESPECIALLY in a WESTERN (for God’s SAKE), where everyone is PACKING and there are multiple gun fights.
And this? Is definitely “on” the producer. You’re the money person, the organizer. Skimping on the armorer was criminal negligence.
Just like poor Sarah Jones, killed by that train. Foolish, incompetent, criminal. Unions protect people from that sort of foolishness.
Unions can also be assholes, though. It’s not cut and dried. I mean, look at poor Shannon Doherty – kicked off her health insurance because of a gap in work – which meant she didn’t get diagnosed in time.
My actor friends have tons of issues with SAG/AE – especially the ones with lifelong illnesses.
Oh I’m well aware that unions are far from perfect – and you find the same kind of power dynamics as everywhere else, where the most marginalized are often the least protected. Still, better than no union at all. Except for a very few people at the top, most everyone benefits from what has been gained over time, even stars – some just tend to forget that.
Case in point. What a very sad mess.
so I did re-watch his police interview – skipping over his irritation at the camera crew because I can’t stomach it one more time – and there’s this haunting moment – and it goes along with something I said somewhere along here.
He was given his gun that morning – he did his safety check on it – as he always does. then they broke for lunch, and everyone surrenders their guns for the lunch break. He comes back after lunch, gets his gun again – and he can’t remember if he did a safety check. This was my question when I heard there was live ammo in his gun. !! He SAID he checks his guns and is vigilant about it – but he can’t remember whether or not he did it when he came back after lunch. probably because of the chaos of that day – the camera crew walking off, etc.
Which is yet another reason why you don’t want CHAOS on a set because a practiced gun-user like Ackles clearly either forgot to check his gun – or maybe he checked it and didn’t perceive that there was a live round in there. He seemed truly haunted by the fact he couldn’t remember if he did the check – little did he know there was live ammo in there.
What a total disgraceful shitshow.
My understanding was that the live bullet was on his gun belt, not in the gun itself.
Barb – !! ugh. it’s almost even worse that it was in his belt – because of course he wouldn’t have checked his BELT – and this means live ammo was everywhere.
Barb coming in with the details! That would help make sense of the situation, although clearly, the situation was messy anyway. Horrible.
// He seemed truly haunted by the fact he couldn’t remember if he did the check//
Who can remember everything they do with certainty, especially when it’s automatic behaviour? Truly haunting.
// Who can remember everything they do with certainty, especially when it’s automatic behaviour? // exactly! – I put my seat belt on every time I drive but I don’t have a clear memory of doing it every time!
Barb’s detail helps it make more sense but in a way it’s even worse – because there’s no way JA could have even planned for that. what a shitshow. every single new thing I learned makes me more angry.
Gun belts are PROPS. Guns sort of shift in terms of who is responsible for them – props if not being fired, armorer if they are . But a gun belt is a prop, period. so there was clearly cross-over boundary-less behavior in terms of guns/props and that is BAD.
//Gun belts are PROPS.// I hadn’t really thought about it that way, but that makes sense, and pinged for me something that I think was in one of the police interviews that were released (yes, I went way down that hole of scary badness). I could be wrong, but I seem to recall one of the propmasters saying that she assisted the armorer sometimes.
It’s all such an awful mess. I am glad that JA stepped away from the project.
Barb – yes, I think JA mentioned it himself. the question was like “who handed you these things” and he said “hannah but maybe sometimes sarah – either of them.” I could be wrong on the names. And … Sarah’s role? But I think the point is: the armorer is the one person who should handle weapons.
HOWEVER – it’s a moot point if somehow live ammo ended up in his belt, which is a PROP. a prop doesn’t need to be checked for safety (or it shouldn’t). there should never be any doubt. I am sure so many industry-wide safety measures are now going to be implemented for handling of props/guns/even fake bullets in fake gun belts, etc.
like what the hell were these people doing behind the scenes?
I actually didn’t watch the trial – or not the whole thing – and am a little surprised JA wasn’t called? but was the actual fault ever ascertained? as in: how did the live ammo get there?
was it a sketchy distributor because they scrimped on the costs – or was it a bunch of yahoo PAs and crew members fucking around after hours?
sorry to use you as a primary source, lol!!
Hi, Sheila, I’m not sure they’ve really been open about where the bullets came from.
The Variety article I found goes over the mishandling of evidence that led to Baldwin’s dismissal, but the bullets that the prosecution failed to show the defense don’t seem to have been on the set?
From the Times on the armorer’s trial, there were bullets found on the prop cart, on JA’s gun belt, and in a box marked Colt 45 dummies. The armorer said she sorted dummies into the box from a plastic bag that came from a previous job, but she blamed the ammo supplier.
Sooo– that doesn’t really answer the question, but the Times article lays out the evidence that WAS presented really well, I think.
Barb – hey sorry, your comment was caught by spam because of the links!
// The armorer said she sorted dummies into the box from a plastic bag that came from a previous job, but she blamed the ammo supplier. //
shitshow.
I haven’t read that Times piece – thanks for the link!
I JUST realized what this thread is, by the way (I had just jumped to the newest comments). From Benny’s dick to JA’s gift for precision to the terrible spin off to the importance of unions… this thread is a beautiful mess, I love it so much.
lol. It’s like an old-fashioned message board in the late 90s which you’ve bookmarked so you can keep talking about whatever. For instance:
I just got a juicer and have been experimenting with making juices. My current favorite:
1/4 cup pineapple chunks
1/4 cup orange juice
1/4-inch piece of raw ginger
as many jalapeno peppers as you can stand
it’s got a KICK.
Ha! Slàinte!
Has anyone seen Jensen in a show called Tracker? It came out last year on one of the networks. CBS, maybe? I don’t have cable anymore, so I’m not sure. But this show popped up in my Prime feed a few months ago. I’m not usually a binge-watcher, but my husband has been working Saturdays for the last few months, so I’ve been using Saturday to decompress with crap TV and catch up on my reading.
So a few weeks ago, I started watching this show, and it’s fine. I leave it on and do things around the house while I listen, and I stop to watch scenes here and there. The main character is played by the brother on This Is Us – Justin Hartley (had to look up his name). I never really watched This Is Us, but I had heard he was good in that. He’s fine in this one. It was the first season, so there was a lot of clumsy exposition over multiple episodes about the character and his tragic backstory. He has a younger sister and an older brother, and he thinks his brother killed their dad, and he won’t talk to him even though the brother has been trying to reach out.
In the second to last episode, the brother shows up, and I’m doing something else and realize, I know that voice. I go over to the TV, and it’s Jensen! I admit I may have squealed, which is so not like me. I did not know he was in this show at all. I watched the episode, and the contrast of Jensen with Justin made me realize why the show just wasn’t clicking before.
The brothers end up working a case together, of course, and Jensen’s character is supposed to be this ex-special forces guy (ugh) who served overseas and now works for some shady private security company. And there’s a moment where the brothers need to get into the morgue to see a body, and they can’t talk their way past the attendant. So Justin says come on, and he goes around to the side of the building, where of course there’s a window they can use to get inside. And Justin effortlessly climbs up on a ledge to get to it and turns back to his brother, who’s still standing on the ground. And Jensen looks up and takes a moment to gear up, and tries to scale up the wall and fails. And he tries again, and sort of scrabbles as he climbs up.
I realized in that moment why the show didn’t work for me before. The main character is too perfect. Yes, he’s got his tragic family backstory and daddy issues. But he’s so competent that he never fails. His character tracks down missing people to collect the reward money, which is sometimes $10k or higher. But he drives a brand new truck that looks like it cost well over $100k and lives in an Airstream that he tows behind it, and it also looks brand new. And it’s all decked out inside. And yeah, I guess I’d be rich too if I didn’t have a mortgage, but probably not enough to buy a new truck. But this character finds everyone he sets out to look for, and he wins every fight he gets into. He frequently has to trek into the wilderness to find people (the show is obviously filmed in Canada), and he always has a cell signal when he needs one. He gets shot a couple of times, but he hardly reacts when he does. It doesn’t hurt. Just slap on a bandage and keep going like you’re not losing massive amounts of blood. He always has exactly what he needs to do whatever he needs to do. Boring.
And Jensen, in this moment when he can’t scale a wall, put all that into perspective. We all know he can scale a wall, and it actually makes no sense that he’s ex-special forces and can’t scale a wall. Don’t you have to climb over walls in the Army or whatever branch he was in? But he knows that a perfect character is not an interesting character. Would I watch a spin off where Jensen’s character bumbles his way through cases each week, failing to talk his way past morgue attendants, and barely making it over fences? Hell, yes. (I’m also reminded of Raylan in Justified, who fails a lot. And we love him all the more for it.)
Also, there are multiple shoutouts to SPN in the episode. There’s an Impala in one scene, and there’s an element of hoodoo in the case they’re working. It felt like lazy writing to me, but I imagine the lure of getting all those fans was too much.
Jensen was very good in the episode, though, like he always is. There’s a long scene in the beginning of the episode where the brothers talk about their dad, and Jensen was playing it like he had a secret. I got season 2 SPN vibes, where Dean was keeping dad’s final words from Sam. I’m guessing their father isn’t dead. Although I may never find out. I might not watch season 2 when it comes out, even though they say online that Jensen will be back. I haven’t watched the last episode of the first season, either, because there will probably be a cliffhanger, and I don’t like those. I’m a completist, and cliffhangers make me anxious.
Sorry this is so long. None of my friends like the things I like, so I don’t have anyone to talk to about this stuff. That sounds bad. It’s just that I’m an engineer, and I have mostly engineer friends, and they’re not interested in dissecting shows or stories with me.
Hi Marie! Don’t worry about the length! I love that this is a place where people feel free to share their thoughts and get things off their chest!
I have not seen Tracker – but I am intrigued by what you say – and LOVE your observation about Jensen trying to climb up the wall and failing (even though it makes no sense for the character). JA’s sense of humor – and willingness to undercut his own strength/sexiness/leading-man-ness – it’s just an instinct he has, and it’s such a good one … imagine Dean without it!! I think I wrote somewhere else – maybe in my piece about the SPN pilot – that Dean was not written with much nuance. Sam had more nuance than Dean did in the pilot. Of course a pilot has different concerns and goals. Then “Dead in the Water” added nuance to Dean, etc., but – it is my contention that it was JA’s own instincts that led the writing team – they started not just writing Dean, but writing FOR JA.
so exciting and so smart.
“He knows that a perfect character is not an interesting character.”
Right on!!
thanks so much for sharing! I’m gonna have to check it out.
I will chime in and say that I watched all of Tracker, too, and overall enjoyed it. I think your observations about Colter’s “perfection” are spot on. That said, part of the issue with the character is that most of the time he doesn’t really have other regulars to play off of. His character is out in the field, and he calls his team and his allies on the phone when he needs information. The implication is that he’s purposefully designed his life in this way, to keep people at arm’s length.
BUT, when he does get screen time with somebody, it really clicks. The chemistry between him and Jensen’s character was believable, and they bat the dialogue back and forth with a really nice rhythm.
I haven’t found where to watch this where I am at the moment, but I was planning on checking it out at some point. These two actors have a pretty similar vibe – sensitive, handsome hunks with a sense of humour and who have chemistry with anyone or anything – so I’m really curious to see how that plays out.
Interesting to read these comments on Tracker and get a little excited about his upcoming work – I didn’t love the recent season of The Boys, although it had its moments, but the teaser guarantees I’ll hang around for s5 haha. And now there’s going to be this Boys spin-off based around SB and Stormfront which I suppose should have been expected! Not something I was clamouring for but it’s easy to imagine the emotional spaces in SB’s past that the show might (could!) explore and that interests me. He seems firmly entrenched in crime and genre at Amazon with the announcement of this contemporary cop-thriller Countdown series. To be working and leading would be very appealing I am sure. But who is going to watch it?! Jake Gyllenhaal was just last month in an (average) prestige courtroom thriller series on Apple with a couple of great co stars and I feel like I was the only person on the planet who saw it!
My friend Allison and I inhaled Presumed Innocent – thought it was great!!
// He seems firmly entrenched in crime and genre at Amazon with the announcement of this contemporary cop-thriller Countdown series. //
Okay … I haven’t heard about this, so now headed to Google.
I am so glad to not be alone in the world haha! I wanted to like Presumed Innocent very much and some parts of it I really liked – Negga, Sarsgaard, and Fagbenle were particularly wonderful – but I felt the David E Kelley of the narrative misfit the restless…kind of foggy, prestigey way it was shot and the slow pacing. So less than the sum of its parts for me.
We know virtually nothing about Countdown yet so my fingers are crossed for either 13 episodes of detailed procedural or something bombastic – something that commits!
wow – 13 episodes!! that’s a lot!
From the announcement:
Ackles said. “I simply cannot wait to partner with Derek and the rest of our Countdown family to bring this story to life.”
Fits nicely with the title of this post.
I’m all caught up on Tracker, now. It’s a well done network procedural, nothing exceptional, I like it – the most fun for me is recognizing all the Vancouver shooting locations, haha
Honestly, I’m getting a little fed up with the Supernatural references everywhere Ackles go. The Boys might be the show that did it the least, or in the most subtle way, because… they didn’t need to. I enjoy seeing Ackles do whatever he does without a callback to his other show. We get it! We know! We’ve known for a long time! Let’s move on!
I am excited to know he has more projects coming up, and looking forward to all of them, of course! I hope we get some variety.
Happy birthday to him, and his eyelashes, who have their zip code.
I haven’t watched Tracker yet – I keep meaning to catch up on it. It’s fun seeing him show up in other things without the context. He’s like a massive supernova movie star – to us in the SPN fandom, know what I mean? – it would be like John Wayne showing up as a regular on a 70s sit com. To people NOT in the SPN fandom, he’s just another actor but he’s just so EPIC to us. lol
so yeah everybody else needs to be caught up on what we have known for a decade and a half! so they’re doing SPN refs on Tracker?
Yeah, I feel like The Boys did a really good job at putting him in what is basically a familiar Kripke-style scenario – but NOT playing a character who has Dean’s charm or warmth. it was so interesting. AND he still got to be funny!
//To people NOT in the SPN fandom, he’s just another actor but he’s just so EPIC to us.//
haha yeah, on Kripke’s IG story about the 3 SPN guys (ugh, 3) being on The Boys next season, someone commented something along the lines of “millenials, just because Supernatural is important to you doesn’t mean it has to be everywhere, let it go” and… honestly I get it.
And god know I love this show deeply.
“ugh 3” UGH.
reading this news depressed me SO much – I had held out hope that it would be an actual role for Jared but this is a pretty clear signal that it will be sop. such a bummer! I guess Jared is busy with his procedurals and such. It’s a living!
Yeah, on Big Sky he gets gifted salt “for the demons” – out of nowhere, that show has no supernatural element at all. In Tracker he drives a black 1965 Chevelle Malibu SS and they are not subtle about it.
I don’t know if it’s the last five season of SPN and its spin-off that make me think we don’t want to overdo it, but… ENOUGH already!
Or maybe I’m just grumpy. lol
yeah seriously enough already. Granted, the SPN fandom can be a LOT. maybe it’s like throwing a bone to a pack of howling wolves. “come on, we have to give them SOMEthing!”
this is what I mean though – it’s like John Wayne suddenly showing up in a sit com. he was so huge it’d be almost unavoidable – you’d have to acknowledge the elephant in the room. make him say “howdy pardner” even though it has nothing to do with anything. I don’t know. Pandering!
it’s wild because to US Jensen is an epic figure – but still, this attitude mainly exists within the SPN fandom. it’s a weird thing. Dean Winchester is just so epic and we are a small audience, relatively.
Yeah, I totally get what you mean. But I’m part of the fandom and I don’t want this. I’m a grown up, appreciating the work Jensen Ackles does regardless of the relationship of the new gig to Supernatural – and if it’s none, that’s totally fine! Better, even – I want to see him expand as an artist!
I guess I can see why they wouldn’t trust that audience, but maybe don’t pander to the worst part of the fandom? This has led to the worst stuff in the original show already, why would you do that in your own production?
yeah it’s really weird! I don’t like it either.
// maybe don’t pander to the worst part of the fandom? //
For sure. why would you want to interrupt the world YOU’RE building with referencing another one?
The Boys was interesting because Soldier Boy had a bad-father backstory too – you could definitely see a parallel – but because the character was so cut off emotionally, without Dean’s openness – without a Sam in his life – everything was totally unmanaged. the guy was a MESS. it was so cool to see Jensen just cut off the normal channels Dean had to let off steam – they just didn’t exist for this character. He’s so inventive.
Yeah, The Boys is much darker, in a sense – more cynical, and that’s reflected in what happens to the characters.
I deeply appreciated that they resisted showing Soldier Boy’s wound – except for that ONE moment, or two, which are so fleeting. And yes, what JA did with it – it’s probably in this post that I explained how he scared me so much? My father, and every other men who didn’t find their way out of resentment and entitlement and insecurity about their masculinity. It’s such a details, faithful portrayal.