It reminds me of Odets’ great love/confrontation scenes, particularly the ones between Lorna Moon and Joe Bonaparte in Golden Boy. Only with swears.
These are two tough people. Hard-boiled. They are not only not used to love and softness, they fear it and attack it in themselves and in each other. Jeff Bridges and Michelle Pfeiffer play the hell out of this scene, but it sure helps to have such good dialogue. I wrote a bit about Fabulous Baker Boys (screenplay by Steve Kloves, who also directed) in my 5 for the day piece about Jeff Bridges, and wrote:
It’s not an ingratiating part, Jack Baker, or at least not the way Jeff Bridges plays it. We are struck by his beauty in that film, his smoldering sexiness, his stoic tough-guy appeal. But he doesn’t let us in. It’s not in his nature. His beauty is a fortress, and whatever is going on behind it, is deeply private. He has set up his life that way. He’s not playing hard to get. He is hard to get.
It is said about Bach’s “Goldberg Variations” that the music is so mathematically perfect that if you understand the structure, then the piece plays itself. I play the piano, but certainly not with a level of competence that could help me understand that concept, but I will take the experts’ word for it. When a structure is perfect, then the fault would be in you if you can’t pull it off. It’s also true that you must rise to meet the challenge of the material.
The same is true for great acting scenes. Of course you must have talent. That’s a given. But often, if the writing is poor, even talented actors can’t justify what they are doing. The writer has abandoned them, the writer has given them too much clunky exposition, the writer doesn’t understand how emotions work, how one thing leads to the next, how a conflict can escalate, drastically, with one cruel remark, how conversations can swerve off course dramatically: conversations are organic, things don’t happen in a proper order. People are messy, we don’t always express ourselves clearly. A good writer can put dialogue on the page that begs to be spoken, to be filled out and lived. That’s what people mean when they say something “leapt off the page”. It doesn’t happen often. You know it when you see it.
Give two talented actors a scene like the following, however, and it almost plays itself. That’s good writing.
SUSIE: I told Frank I’m quitting.
JACK: Congratulations.
SUSIE: As of now.
JACK: Well, if you need a recommendation you let me know.
SUSIE: Jesus, you’re cold you know that? God, you’re like a fucking razor blade.
JACK: Careful, you’re gonna have me thinking you’re going soft on me.
SUSIE: You don’t give a fuck, do you? About anything?
JACK: What do you want from me? You want me to tell you to stay? Is that what you’re looking for? You want me to get down on my knees and beg you to save the Baker Boys from doom? Forget it, sweetheart. We survived for 15 years before you strutted onto the scene. 15 years. Two seconds, and you’re bawling like a baby. You shouldn’t be wearing a dress, you should be wearing a diaper.
SUSIE: Jesus, you and Egghead are brothers, aren’t you.
JACK: Let me tell you something. Over the years, they’ve dropped like flies in every fucking hotel in this city. We’re still here. We’ve never held a day job in our lives. He’s an easy target, but Frank’s done fine.
SUSIE: Yeah, Frank’s done great. He’s got the wife, the kids, the little house in the suburbs. Meanwhile, his brother is sitting in a shitty apartment with a sick dog, Little Orphan Annie upstairs, and a chip on his shoulder as big as a Cadillac.
JACK: Listen to me, princess. We fucked twice. That’s it. Once the sweat dries, you still don’t know shit about me, got it?
SUSIE: I know one thing. While Frank Baker was home putting his kids to sleep last night, little brother Jack was out dusting off his dreams for a few minutes. I was there. I saw it in your face. You’re full of shit. You’re a fake. Every time you walk into some shitty daiquiri hut you’re selling yourself on the cheap. Hey, I know all about that. I’d find myself at the end of the night with some creep and tell myself it didn’t matter. And you kid yourself that you got this empty place inside where you can put it all. But you do it long enough and all you are is empty.
JACK: I didn’t know whores were so philosophical.
SUSIE: At least my brother’s not my pimp. You know, I had you pegged as a loser the first time I saw you but you’re worse. You’re a coward.
Wow, that is intimidatingly good writing. So good it’s pissing me off.
Steve Kloves wrote and directed, and also wrote Wonder Boys with Michael Douglas (one of the great scripts of the last 15 years or so), and then went on to write on all of the Harry Potters. Wtf? That actually makes him a Wonder Boy in a certain respect.
We’ve both raved about Bridges, he’s my favorite living actor, and this role is a good showcase for what makes him so special. You NEVER feel like he’s an actor in a role, he just disappears into the part. I get the sense he has created backstory for his characters entire LIVES in his mind, that’s how deep he’s submerged into his parts. (I have no idea on his process). And talk about range, I mean, from a killer in Jagged Edge to Lebowski to a truly great American President in The Contender, what can’t he play?
And a quick scan of Pfeiffer’s bio shows me she’s WAY underrated. Baker Boys may have been her best role, but she’s also got more range then you’d think, and isn’t afraid to get down and dirty or be very vulnerable. (Scarface, Married to the Mob, Witches of Eastwick, Dangerous Liasons). I don’t think she’s been truly pushed to her limits yet.
She suffers a bit in that she’s SO good looking it distracts from the fact that she can actually really act. I think she could be interesting, even fascinating in more mature roles at this point in her career. I feel she has a still to be made home-run role in her.
The Fabulous Baker Boys is a really precious movie, thanks for reminding me.
Michelle Pfeiffer had a great great run. When it was “her time”, she WENT for it. She did not squander her moment. She did not waste her time in the spotlight. She was everywhere for a good 6, 7 years. That’s a pretty good run for an actress. It was that Married to the Mob period, with Dangerous Liaisons, and Witches of Eastwick, and Fabulous Baker Boys (and she can SING too) – she showed tremendous range, was nominated for Oscars, and did pretty well for herself. I am not so sure she is under-rated. I remember vividly those years when it was like, “What will this actress attempt NEXT?” She could do anything, play any period, do any accent … it was amazing to witness. Very few careers last at white-hot intensity. She’s still working. She still gets good parts. She still seems like she’s having fun. But when it was her moment to show what she could do – she exploded out of the cannon. Go, Michelle.
And yeah, Fabulous Baker Boys is a gloomy mood piece. The script is pretty spare for the most part – this is the most “talk-y” scene (except for the fight between the two brothers – member that?) – Beau Bridges has most of the lines. But this scene!! And yes, the way they play it … but if you look at it – the scene is “on the page”. That’s another thing actors always say – about those great scripts. Most of the time you know you are going to have to “add” something, to make the script better (and most writers count on actors for that). But this? Just say the lines, it’ll get you halfway there.
Great stuff!!
Yes, I suppose underrated isn’t the right word, she just doesn’t spring to my mind when I think of great actresses the way people like Julianne Moore or Holly Hunter do. But she should.
Yeah, these lines are pretty damn good. Crap.
David Mamet has an interesting process outlined in his book On Directing Film, he ONLY wants his actors to just “say the words”, bringing as little to no “technique” as possible. If any actor doesn’t understand the motivation or meaning behind dialogue (which is often given the eliptical nature of some of his verse) Mamet would not help them out. “Just say the words”.
I’m not sure this is the best way to get top performances from actors, nor do I think most actors like working this way. I think his characters can come off like pieces in a chess game as opposed to people, but it absolutely works in movies like House of Games or The Spanish Prisoner, which are really puzzles turned into movies. If you can write like Mamet sometimes “saying the words” can actually get you all the way there, not to take anything away from the acting in those films.
// I think his characters can come off like pieces in a chess game as opposed to people, //
That’s it exactly. I think Mamet is full of it when it comes to commentary like that. I’ve written about it before. His book True and False is excellent for actors – and I would give it to anyone starting out. But his “just say the lines” thing is rich, coming from him – whose scripts were MADE by actors who had full emotional lives, serious Method training, and knew how to “fill” his spare dialogue. I think Mamet in particular needs actors to NOT “just say the lines”. As you observe, his scripts can seem very very empty when there isn’t an actor working at full emotional throttle behind them.
His point in True and False, which is a good one, is he likes actors who don’t “fuss” – who don’t “make a big deal” out of their acting process. He doesn’t want to hear about it. He doesn’t want to hear about how they “got to” such and such a moment. “Just do it.” I agree with him there. Have your process, but don’t make a big show out of it. Be a professional. But that’s an idiotic thing to say, first of all, to young actors who are learning their craft (True and False is geared to them). Unless you’re a Marlon Brando, you need training, you need to try different things, you need to work on your craft. You don’t have to go to school to work on your craft, you can find out what works on different jobs. But you certainly have to have a technique of some kind to rely on. (This is what is wrong with Kevin Spacey’s acting. He has nothing to rely on. No technique. So he falls back on his “tricks” that got him praise 20 years ago, and I was sick of it then. His lack of technique showed when he was on Broadway in a Eugene O’Neill and someone’s cell phone went off – yes, very very annoying, I get it – and he broke character, broke the fourth wall, and said out to the audience, “Tell them you’re busy.” I think that was appallingly unprofessional. His technique is so thin, his concentration so nonexistent, that he was unable to filter out the annoyance of a live audience. Amateur. The only time I like Kevin Spacey is when he’s been on talk shows and has done imprssions of other people – or like his Christopher Walken SNL sketch. He’s an awe-inspiring mimic. I wish he could somehow utilize that in his acting, but he doesn’t.) Also, good professional actors draw on all KINDS of things other than the script – and they’ll never ever talk about it. How does Mamet know what William Macy is drawing on? Or Jack Lemmon? He thinks his script is so superb that they are ONLY saying the lines and that is taking them there?
He has a contempt for acting process. So I take what he says about actors with a grain of salt, although there is a lot of good stuff in his books.
The only playwright i would say, categorically, you never need to “add” anything to the lines, is Shakespeare. You ruin his stuff if you add too much. The script IS the thing there.
Great response. Yeah, I can’t imagine it’s fun for an actor on his films. I remember Delroy Lindo on “Dinner for Five” talking about filming Heist, and Mamet provided ZERO feedback. Lindo was like “What is my character talking about here”, and Mamet would respond “just say the words”. Host Jon Favreau commented that “‘for most actors that’s never enough.”
Surpised to see you so down on Spacey, who I sort of like, (LOVE Swimming with Sharks),
but you have such a highly evolved bullshit detector when it comes to actors that I will take your word for it!
I miss Dinner for Five.
Delroy Lindo – hahahaha. Yeah, to Mamet it’s like “just say the words” – but actors have all kinds of ways to bring words to life. He may not want to hear about it, but that’s irrelevant. Like I said, I do agree that you shouldn’t make a fetish out of your process, and show off about it. That’s unprofessional. But Mamet can be a crank about it.
I have only liked Kevin Spacey once or twice – yes, Swimming with Sharks (but that was early), maybe Glengarry Glen Ross – but it’s all so “thin” for me, and his talent is extremely narrow – which makes him play it safe. Also, I think the praise he got (plus the TWO Oscars – BAFFLING) went WAY to his head. (Which you can see in the talking to the audience moment I mentioned. What an arrogant prick – to do that to his fellow actors onstage, to think he’s better than Eugene O’Neill, that he can afford to leave the play behind, speak to the audience, and then bounce back in. Also: if I had been in the audience that night, I would have been so angry. Yes, it’s annoying when people do not turn their cell phones off. But as an actor, your job is to keep going. Your job is to have the concentration to stay in the world of the play even if the world is falling apart. Rip Torn did an entire second act at the Public Theatre WHILE passing a kidney stone. He was rushed to the hospital immediately when the curtian fell. How would Kevin Spacey have fared in Shakespeare’s time, with the groundlings throwing food up on the stage and shouting thru his precious monologue? His behavior that night onstage with the O’Neill was evidence of his arrogance and rank unprofessionalism. I was DONE with him forever when I heard that anecdote.) He’s also delusional: Bobby Darin? Really?
But on the flip side: seeing him do Christopher Walken auditioning for Han Solo? Or see him imitate Al Pacino and Brando on Inside the Actors Studio? He’s INCREDIBLE. and likeable – and really really good at mimicry.
So he’s a weird case. He will be forgotten. He has zero resonance as an actor.
and yes, Dinner for Five was awesome!
I liked him in LA Confidential, too, that role suits him – with its above-it-all smirk and soulless opportunism. I’m still baffled at his enormous success. Do not get it.
I will stop bashing Kevin Spacey now.
I know this scene well, but …WOW–it really is at the top of the craft.
It really is. I love how it goes south so quick. They both say things they regret. They’re both so tough. But you can feel the hurt too. Such a good scene.