Hey, y’all. Clearly I haven’t been around on these posts. Not because I haven’t been watching episodes. Just slammed with work and moving to a new apartment. I will be back. When I come up for air.
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Re: 12×13. I feel like the powers that be just wrapped Pellegrino in pretty paper and a bow, and gave him to fandom as a gift.
Pellegrino is the last remaining good thing about the Lucifer plot. He is a joy to watch!
He really is – you never know what he’s going to do next! I love how he finds everything funny.
I don’t know what to think about Mary anymore. I was pumped when it was dropped that she was returning, but the use of her character has been anti-climactic. She’s such a cypher that it’s almost a surprise when she pops up again – oh, right, Mary’s back.
JA deserves all the awards just for the face he made when Mary informed them that she’s been working with the BMOL. After last night, I’m neutral to her involvement, other than it’s painful to see the affect her actions have on her sons. I don’t want her to leave in a way that hurts Sam and Dean, but if she sacrifices herself for the greater good, that’d be a saving grace.
I feel like the Arc of Mary not being what they expected is a rich RICH possibility – but it hasn’t been explored in any ongoing or intense way. So whatever happens now, it just feels “Meh.”
They’re all too into showing Mary as a “badass” (my now least-favorite term, especially in connection to female characters) – and ignoring the effect that all of this has had on her sons. It’s there in the performances but without the support of the STORYLINE there’s only so much JA and JP can do. They aren’t even talking to EACH OTHER about this. There’s no feelings happening. We’ve had episode after episode of plot – with no subtext.
So the possibilities of Mary – I mean, even if she did get up and leave them now, or get killed – that at least would be SOMEthing, something dramatic – something complicated – but I feel like they’ve squandered the possibilities there, they’ve taken the LEAST interesting possible road with Mary Winchester.
I’m really bummed.
OMG!! I could not agree more! When I watched Mary give the Colt to the Brit MoL I was so done! It’s disappointing when writers take what could be a wonderful plot and turn it into pablum. On the plus side, JA’s and JP’s reactions have been subtle and amazing! Their expressions and body language are what keeps me tuning in each week.
I feel like the show has turned into such a lightweight version of the one I loved-all the impact seems to be muted. Events that would have emotionally resonated before, just seemed to be passed over.
I’m pissed and hurt at what has been done to the show. Mostly to Sam and Dean.
They have left no room for emotions and subtext. Perfect example is that the final montage underneath the song – the argument between mother and sons CAN’T BE HEARD. when that’s ALL I for one give a shit about. What are they SAYING? What about the RELATIONSHIP? My GOD what ELSE do I care about?
And – yet ANOTHER episode without a “BM” moment. There was a brief one mid-episode but it was short, and nothing was said. The show has squandered its emotional capacity. It feels like it can’t even TAKE emotion anymore.
My feelings are really strong so I don’t want to take away from anyone who’s enjoying it. I’m more hurt than anything else. Watching it is a very depressing experience.
There are good moments because these are all good actors. But … there’s no THERE there.
As I understand it this final conversation will be picked up next episode….because apparently GAVIN and FLASHBACKS are a more important use of screen time?!
This episode makes crystal clear that the show intends to salt and burn the Myth of Mary that Sam and Dean and John have spent the last thirty-some years calcifying into a holy text. A legitimately great story choice, in my opinion. How has the unravelling of that myth not been the primary emotional storyline of the season? How has there been barely any emotion at all? The three of them interacting — the Face, Sam’s whiplash stammering betrayal, Mary, sheepish but unrepentant: that minute had more Winchester stakes to it than the last ten episodes (excepting the amnesia one). Imagine how much more power it would have had if there’d been buildup. At this point in season one we were just about to hit Sam’s powers crisis in Nightmare and John’s reappearance in Shadow. Rrraaaaargh!!!!
// the show intends to salt and burn the Myth of Mary that Sam and Dean and John have spent the last thirty-some years calcifying into a holy text. A legitimately great story choice, in my opinion. //
absolutely! What an AMAZING opportunity. But … but … where IS that story? It’s there but it’s also somehow … not. They’ve muddied the waters with the President and Guantanamo and … Rick Springfield and … the BMOL (ARGH) … and they’ve neutered Sam and Dean. They are no longer the main characters. There are no main characters. The show is now just a device for a plot-line. Sam and Dean don’t even talk to each OTHER anymore.
// How has the unravelling of that myth not been the primary emotional storyline of the season? //
It’s mind-boggling.
and if they’re saving it for the finale … Guys, I don’t presume to tell you how to do your job, but here goes anyway: By then it’ll be too late.
// The three of them interacting — the Face, Sam’s whiplash stammering betrayal, Mary, sheepish but unrepentant: that minute had more Winchester stakes to it than the last ten episodes (excepting the amnesia one). //
So agree.
But … but … where IS that story? It’s there but it’s also somehow … not.
I know! I don’t understand how they’ve identified it as a story but then just sort of, not DONE anything with it? What is going ON?
Sam and Dean don’t even talk to each OTHER anymore.
Their conversations have the predictability and heft of the obligatory “where’s Cas this episode?” exchange: “Mom hasn’t texted me.” “She needs some space.” Oh well that’s sorted then. Tickety-boo, motherfuckers!
Once again, thank you for expressing my own frustrations with direction the show has gone in such eloquent terms!
I haven’t completely lost my “I want to believe” – the groundwork for something big with Mary and Sam and Dean has been … I don’t want to say “laid” exactly. “Excavated but not groomed?” “Shoveled and left in a heap?” “Partially exposed and left to the elements?”
The possibility is there. But my faith that it will be used in a powerful way is … getting really weak when they do things like NOT LETTING US HEAR THE ARGUMENT. Frack me.
I don’t think they’ve even broken ground yet. I think the plans are still in a lightless stairless cellar, shoved into the bottom of a locked filing cabinet stuck in a disused lavatory with a sign on the door saying Beware of the Leopard.
my delusions. my beautiful delusions.
What is there that matters? Tara! Home!! I’ll go home and I’ll think of some way to get him back! After all, tomorrow is another day!
Jessie, you can’t get me down!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIRqL689rBI
I’ll be deluded with you, mutecypher! Let’s run away to Atlanta together!
// The three of them interacting — the Face, Sam’s whiplash stammering betrayal, Mary, sheepish but unrepentant: that minute had more Winchester stakes to it than the last ten episodes (excepting the amnesia one). //
Can’t wait to see where they pick this up at next episode.
Mentioning powers!sam – how dare you, Jessie? I’m crushed he hasn’t made an appearance after American Nightmare. Now, that would have made things interesting.
ha ha, Paula! I know there’s a lot of excitement out there about Powers!Sam or Witch!Sam. I think I’m glad they’ve left that alone though. As mutecypher says, faith that they can create a storyline without slipping it into the plebeian or inconsequential is a diminishing resource…..
and the Colt! I am a huge Colt-lover. It’s back!! I should be more excited.
I get that the issue may very well be with me – and the disappointed mood I greet each episode before it even airs. But having 8, 9 episodes in a row – with no introspection, where Sam and Dean are treated like guest spots (even LESS than guest spots – the guest spots get to have arcs! Look at Gavin and Fiona!) – I’m left with this empty feeling. So I’m like, “Oh. Colt. I love you. Hi. Wait, what’s happening?”
The Colt – I agree! Was excited to see it but then it’s tucked away without comment and Mary turning it over with the barest affect. No regret, no nothing. And she read John’s journal – she had to know how important it was at the end to him, right?
Same with the guest appearances. I was so excited to see Mark Pellegrino and Alaina Huffman, and then she was gone in a blink of an eye (because that wasn’t a flashback they showed, it was new footage. So what, she filmed it on a lunch break and then left?)
Don’t serve me filet mignon on a paper plate with plastic silverware. That’s what it felt like.
//Don’t serve me filet mignon on a paper plate with plastic silverware.//
Excellent, fitting metaphor!
Ugh, Sheila, I know! I’m even more negative than you – I’m so sorry guys. When I saw the Colt my first reaction was “don’t fuck this up TOO, please! Leave the Colt alone, in the great episodes where stuff actually mattered, where every frame has something interesting, when there was tension, meaning, emotion, great lines, humour, etc.”
No need to apologize – I so so get it. We’re so invested in these people and all of their symbols and mythology. it’s WEIRD to see it all come back here and just have no resonance at all.
So, I knew beforehand who wrote the episode, and as such went in with my standards sufficiently lowered. As a result, my initial reaction was, “Hey, that didn’t didn’t completely suck and leave me wondering WTF just happened! Nice!”
There were actually things that I liked about this episode (Mary getting called out on her bullshit, Rowena being spiteful – if they’re going to keep her around, they need to keep her vicious), but that’s about all I can give it.
Thinking back to season 3 and especially season 4 – and, hell, season 6, too – the ramifications of coming back from the dead played out in every single episode. Where is that, with Mary, other than her leaving and joining fotces with the Brits? Other than that, it’s all, hey, let’s play Words with Friends and I’ll send you warm and fuzzy texts about how I’ll always be your mom! And somehow, at the same time, I think they’re doing way too much telling and not enough showing. Where’s the beef?
I girded my loins and downgraded my expectations too, Natalie, and was pleasantly surprised by a couple of things: the best cold-open murder in a while; Rowena’s parting shot; Sam’s stuttering; Pellegrino’s no fucks given. All tangled in with things I didn’t like unfortunately, including a sodden exposition-only A plot. And where does the fault lie for the ugly way this was stitched together? Writers who can’t end a scene or provide subtext or emotion? A director who couldn’t find the footage? An editor who fell asleep on the dissolve knob? Can’t blame her.
And somehow, at the same time, I think they’re doing way too much telling and not enough showing. Where’s the beef?
Yes! Mary’s coldness and refusal to nurture (while paying lipservice to love) is fascinating and should be exploding inside Dean and Sam. But Dean’s “long long long time” rant (which didn’t even make sense? What’s the time gap between episodes?) is the first sign we’ve had of this distance meaning something to him! Shaking him, as a character. So even where they get it right (for instance Counsellor Sam PhD’s appearance at the beginning was initially rage-inducing but ended up working for me for the first time because structurally it was set-up for the final scene pay-off) it feels tainted because they’ve turned their backs on the goldmine of Winchester feelings, subtext, horror, etc.
I was so relieved to get that episode with the amnesia spell, but now it feels like they tried to put all the emotion they left out from other episodes into that one. And now that that’s done we’re back to expo only. JA and JP are great actors but the are not really given a chance to spread their wings. Show me some pain and struggle and turmoil! That’s why I love the show and that’s why I did an evil thing and got my mom hooked on it! I sacrificed my loved one’s time to Supernatural, it better not be in vain!
I was glad to see the best Lucifer so far return. He makes that whole plot line bearable, so they better keep him around.
My hope for the whole Mom thing with Rowena going all “I’m your mother, who better to crush your heart!” is still not completely dead…. But maybe that’s just me being too optimistic for my own good :\
Sheila, I hope you haven’t completely lost your love for the show and, when you have the time for it, will do some more reviews of earlier episodes. I love those in-depth insights you give :) I read other reviews with great interest but the Supernatural ones are my personal favorite.
// Show me some pain and struggle and turmoil! That’s why I love the show and that’s why I did an evil thing and got my mom hooked on it! //
Ha!! It’s a POWERFUL drug, it sure is.
And Barbara – you’re so sweet! I have not at all lost my love for the show – I’m feeling kind of HURT by it right now, which I realize is ridiculous – but I’ll keep watching. I don’t know, I’m very confused by what has happened. I can almost feel where it went off the rails – well, I think we all can.
I so want to get back to reviewing earlier episodes! I haven’t given that up and I just wish I had the time – I just don’t right now! It’s all good stuff – my writing career got really busy last year, and this year – we’re only 2 months in – and already it’s even busier. So this is all good and – of course – I need the $$.
But I do want to get back to celebrating those early seasons. Season 3 is one of my favorites!
Can I just say that I love you folks? You have all expressed the same confusion and frustrations I’m having with the show this season. The ret-conning is bad enough but treating Sam & Dean like minor characters is infuriating. And as much as I enjoy Mary being a but of a kickass character, it doesn’t ring true for me. She’s back for a few months after being dead for over 30 years and she’s a better hunter than her sons? I just don’t buy it.
Whew! It felt good to get that off my chest. I’m so glad to know I’m not alone in feeling this way. ?
She’s obviously not a better hunter than her sons. Ketch thinks she’s the bomb, though.
Ketch also thinks Sam and Dean are too soft. According to his lights, that makes them bad hunters. He’s judging Mary on something quite different, actually – on how she handles herself in a fight? with weapons and blood flying – but he’s never seen Sam and Dean fighting, he’s only come by afterward and maybe been disappointed because there wasn’t blood by the bucketful all over the landscape.
Ketch is kinda like Gordon Walker, imo. He’d be impressed by the sight of Dean bandsawing vampires through the neck. Just hasn’t seen it yet.
Mary herself is very confident and knows she’s a good hunter (and says so) but that doesn’t mean we should believe she’s better than her sons. I doubt we’re meant to believe it, either. It looks like she’s pretty cool in a fight, like Dean, but she’d be out of her depth against the kind of high-powered Big Bads that Sam and Dean deal with. Like she was with Ramiel.
It’s an unreliable narrator effect.
Sylvia – Sure. All of that is clear. And, sad to say, none of it works for me in the slightest in how they’re executing it.
It COULD work, but it DOESN’T. No subtext. No “BM” moments where the brothers hash it out. Without those things, it’s just Plot. and a boring one at that. Granted, I was bored with the BMOL from the moment they arrived. I’ve wanted them to leave from the get-go. But whatever, the show seems to be invested in them, so I suffer through it.
It feels very adolescent nerd-boy sensibility. Cool gadgets! Training montage! Scary British accents! Bad-ass women with guns! Just like a comic book!
Yawn.
Who are you, and what have you done with my show?, is basically my reaction.
“Cool gadgets! . . . Bad-ass women with guns! Just like a comic book!” – That’s what I’ve been picking up on and trying to ignore, hoping it wasn’t true. I’ve been wondering if the network wants it to fit in with Arrow, The Flash, Supergirl, etc., a “superhero” type show instead of what it was when it began. (I’m basing my evaluation of those other shows on commercials alone since I don’t watch them.)
Yeah, that’s my sense of what might be happening. Supernatural – at its height – is a weird weird show. More of a melodrama than anything else. The humanity being the most important thing.
Somewhere else we were discussing – on one of the other threads for this season – how much of the show always used to be about their BODIES. The beauty of the bodies – and also their strength – highlighted by how vulnerable their bodies were. That uneasy beautiful mix. We saw that beautifully in last season’s werewolf-episode, which was all about Sam’s body – and then Dean’s body writhing on the floor and vomiting, and Dean reaching inside Sam’s body for the bullet …
You know. These guys are human. In a huge and mythic way. It’s hard to describe!! But now in this season I don’t feel them as bodies at ALL.
The amnesia episode was a glitch in the fabric – it was about the deterioration of a body/mind – I mean, think about how entire ARCS were about either Sam’s body and its compromised blood, or Dean’s body being affected by the Mark – and all that.
I really miss them being BODIES.
Debbie – :)
I have to call it like I see it. I know there are others who seem to be enjoying this season – I personally don’t get it – but that’s okay. I felt things slip-sliding away at the end of last season but this … THIS … I never anticipated it would go THIS awry.
I feel like teenage boys are in charge of the narrative now. No offense to teenage boys. Or at LEAST I feel like it’s being written by people who don’t understand the earlier seasons or the mythology at all.
I don’t buy the Mary thing either. also I might not care that I didn’t “buy it” if Sam and Dean were at least talking about it, having feelings about it, SOMEthing. One 5-line exchange in the Impala in 10 episodes is NOT enough.
I’m baffled at the choices being made and it feels like whoever is in charge is flat out not interested in the things that interest me. Which, again, is fine – I’m not in charge – but I’ve watched 11, 12 seasons of this thing – and have been, overall, truly satisfied – and I trust my gut reaction. Things went to shit in the last 3 episodes last season and they have never gotten their bearings since.
Brief glimpses … and they have been thrilling. The amnesia episode was, overall, great.
although they have GOT to stop reminding us that Sam and Dean are heroes. Every episode now: “You two save the world” “What would the world be like without you?” “You two are amazeballs.” STOP. there was a moment like that at the end of the amnesia ep too. “When I think of … what we do …” I’m like, “Yeah, yeah, I know, you two are heroes. Stop reminding us please.”
Those constant reminders feel like a lack of confidence in the writer’s room – and an artificial way to keep reminding us “These are the two main characters, even though they are basically not the main characters anymore, and they’re playing support staff now to everyone else.”
Just not working for me.
I couldn’t agree more. In fact I remember my reaction to Dean’s statement at the end of First Blood when the agents ask who they are and Dean responds “we’re the ones who saved the world” (or something like that). I was shocked. I’m sorry – that’s just not something my Sam & Dean would say.
I loved the Tarantino homage in some of the shots from Stuck in the Middle (With You) but overall this season I feel like the writers haven’t watched the previous 11 years of the show. The retconning is irritating. C’mon – I’m supposed to believe that Mary hunted after Dean was born and John never caught on? That requires too much of a suspension of belief for me. And how can Mary not know what the Colt means – she read John’s journal. ARGH!!! I just don’t get it.
“We’re the ones who saved the world.”
Yeah. No. I just can’t feel the characters in that language. and to have the other characters – like Castiel – make a speech about their heroism – in the middle of a season where Sam and Dean are barely registering as the leads of the show …
Me confused!
and all of the aspects of Mary that go against the grain of how Sam and Dean fantasized about her – what RICH subject matter – what HUMAN subject matter. How we put people on pedestals, how children mythologize their absent parents as perfect – all that. I wish there was ANY exploration of that in Sam and Dean – but no, they just adjusted to it, texting her, playing words with friends and being … like, they never discuss it.
If they’re holding stuff back for the big finale – it’s not working. They’ve wasted a lot of time and emotional power focusing on other stuff.
Frankly, I don’t even know what the Arc actually is. I can’t feel it in the narrative.
It’s all very strange.
I’m a glutton for punishment – I am glad they were renewed. Maybe they can remember who they are.
I keep hoping they’ll find their true path again too. If it weren’t for Jared & Jensen I’d have given up by now.
Who woulda thought Andrew Dabb had a praise kink.
The whole thing about explicitly stating “these guys are heroes” falls under the recent tendency to TELL instead of SHOW. Add to that several recent comments (both to and from Cas) about him being family. Supernatural used to SHOW so much; now it’s stating things out loud instead of letting us figure it out.
It just feels like they – whoever they are – have lost the human touch somehow. THEY don’t know who these people are.
I mean, the low point of that was Sam saying, “Why are planets round?” last season – a moment I keep trying (unsuccessfully) to block out of my consciousness.
So I just finished watching the episode. Had to miss it on Thursday because I was traveling to Nashville at the time….for a Supernatural convention!
Knowing who wrote the episode I have to say that it was a very pleasant surprise. I usually strongly dislike most episodes that they are involved in. This one was quite decent. I fully admit ghost episodes make me very happy for some reason….not quite sure why but they do. Again knowing who wrote it I honestly had no expectations of any emotional depth from this episode…these 2 writers don’t do that very well. Believe me when I say that I agree with all of you over the lack of emotional resonance this whole season in general has had. The past couple of episodes have seemed better than the majority of the first part of the season but I still want more…everything I guess. I’m hoping that some of this is just the fact that so much of this season is a brand new set of people….from writers to show runners. I miss Robbie Thompson so much and desperately miss the heart he brought to so many episodes. However, I remind myself that some of his early episodes were not stellar masterpieces and he grew a lot in his writing. I’m keeping hope that all these will do the same.
The fact that Lucifer is back in Nick’ s vessel again is great. Nobody can play him like Mark Pellegrino and I’m glad he is back. That being said though, unless show is going to actually get in gear and write something amazing for this character I don’t want him around. I don’t want to watch this character who was so terrifying and such a source of fear and pain for Sam and Dean to continue to be diminished into a shadow of his former self. I don’t want a petulant teenager with daddy issues.
Speaking of Mark Pellegrino and totally off topic….that man can sing!!!! He performed at the concert they do on Saturday night’s at the conventions. He absolutely blew me away.
// I’m hoping that some of this is just the fact that so much of this season is a brand new set of people….from writers to show runners. I miss Robbie Thompson so much and desperately miss the heart he brought to so many episodes. //
That’s what I keep hoping too. This feels like a FIRST season, as opposed to an 12th. The team has not gelled. I miss Robbie Thompson too.
Cosign everything you say about Pellegrino. I ADORE him. and at least with him I have no idea what to expect – whereas with Crowley, Rowena, Castiel – and now even Sam and Dean (sob) – I always know what they’re going to say and how they will say it. Pellegrino is just so WEIRD in the role, and it’s very very entertaining. But I also agree that unless he’s given something to do …
My main concern is the lack of emotion behind ALL of this. None of the plot points have ANY emotional resonance. It’s shocking, frankly, especially considering how invested I am!!
and very cool about the convention. It sounds fun!
I don’t know, I guess I’m experiencing this a little differently, because I have gotten emotional several times over the last few episodes (I wrote a manifesto over on the other thread!). I agree on some of the points being made here, especially the “hero” thing. I have to believe it’s building to something, though what I don’t know. The Winchesters have a hell of a reputation, at any rate, which is becoming explicit, and which the BMoL want to use. Seems like they are buying their own hype, maybe.
On the Gavin story, it occured to me that it’s a variation on the “cosmic consequences” theme?
Another stray thought – I loved how they introduced a variation on the “family” melody in the last scene with Mary. It sounded like a chord was added, and it may have been in adifferent key? I’m not a musician, though, so I can’t quite describe it.
I hope that the show gets better for you, Sheila. I know what it’s like to be so disappointed by something that has been cherished, to the point that it hurts. In the meantime, I’m looking forward to your next recap, and am attempting to wait patiently for it–The Kids Are Alright is one of my favorite episodes!
Barb – I’m almost envious of you! :) I wish I was having your experience. I am open to it turning around, that’s for sure. I haven’t given up!
I feel like I’m being a downer. I do not want to dampen the pleasure of others who are enjoying this season. I’m serious about that!
I hope we all can co-exist here together still – :) – because at least we’re all bonded in love/investment in this show.
I’ve always felt like Sam Winchester and I share a mysterious, deep, unbreakable connection, and today I realised that it is because I, too, go into a fucking fugue state every time there’s a godforsaken flashback.
Sheila –
Were there any fucking fugue states in 50 Shades Darker?
I know there were in .The Love Witch.
At least Sam isn’t looking into some yellow/green recollection of hot dogs, spaghetti, limes-in-garbage-disposals, and injured canines.
It’s not hot dogs and spaghetti, it’s boiled worms.
I am in a fugue state for 90% of my life, so I relate.
I haven’t seen it yet though. I am drowning in Bette Davis and Joan Crawford. Will catch up with y’all!
Sam, how does it feel to have a snake for a penis?
Hahahahaha
I only saw the second half of tonight’s episode. I thought it kicked. Sam being seriously resourceful. Mom and Dean having a conversation. The Colt being “holy cow!” The Alpha Vamp being all John Quincy Adams about not going abroad in search of monsters to be destroyed. Monsters, in his case, being the BMOL.
Was the first half good?
I hope you get to see the first half, there was some interestin’ conversatin’!
oh and I know you were excited as me to see Aaron Douglas, he played both sides of his turn so well! I hope we see him again.
I wonder if he will be made to love Big Brother.
//The Alpha Vamp being all John Quincy Adams about not going abroad in search of monsters to be destroyed.// this is perfect.
Such an interesting direction with these senior statesmen of the monster world. I mean, who would have thought retirement? First, Cain. Then, Ramiel. Now, Alpha Vamp. Reminds me of Anne Rice’s vampires going into the ground when they became old and tired of the world, only I like SPN’s version better. Beekeeping, fishing and hanging on the bayou – weirdly peaceful after millennia of chaos and havoc. Just don’t poke the bear (or kill its children).
I saw the full episode last night. This really was a return to form, I thought.
Now, as they say in sports, “was this just a good game, or is this who you are?”
I enjoyed this episode – it had a lot of good stuff: the talk at the beginning was great with Sam and Dean talking to Mary like grownups. Sam was a savage – killing vamps and trying to keep those wussy BMOL alive. Good seeing Mr Alpha Vamp again – the actor is great and his speech was funny “get off of my lawn!”. Too bad he got the Colt treatment.
I have a tiny bit more respect for the BMOL as they seem a little bit more righteous and sincere after this episode. I guess there will be conflict ahead, as Sam tries to get Dean on his side about joining the BMOL team.
Seeing the Colt in the hands of Sam gave me the most powerful emotional jolt I’ve had this season….and I mean that in the absolute best way. Loved the talk/argument that Dean, Sam, and Mary had.
“You are not a child.”
“I never was.” That face. Loved it.
I love it that Sam hasn’t seen the Colt for years, but he knows from memory how to make bullets for it.
On the bad side, that means that the BMOL now have the Colt aka Supernatural’s Very Own Smoking Gun plus bullets. As many bullets as Mick wants to make. Please, BMOL! Shoot it at interesting targets.
Or maybe they can trade the gun for some good intelligence officers, since they yet again turned out to have really, really bad intel.
Ketch is in every way the blunt little instrument that Dean once got called.
Sorry – not smoking gun, I meant Chekhov’s gun.
Blah.
I’m late to the party again – finally got around to watching last week’s episode, and all I can really add to the conversation is, can Robert Behrens write every episode from here on out, please?
*Berens. Oops.
I, too, just watched the episode. I’m with you Natalie.
I am not crazy about people running around in bunkers with flashing lights wearing Commando outfits. Again, it’s an adolescent boy fantasy and it has no place in this show. Part of the texture of the show is its DIY rough-ness – which I know they’re trying to compare/contrast to the BMOL, but enough already (I felt the same way about the gleaming-corporate look of Leviathan – and also did not like those monsters – but I got over it, and now see a lot of great stuff in that season.) But I don’t like the “badass” vibe in GENERAL this season because it neutralizes their humanity AND somehow – I don’t know how it happens – NEUTERS them. As long as they’re running around taking down whole SWAT teams, they don’t seem as tough anymore. They just seem phony.
That being said – what was good, for the most part, was that JA and JP were actually given some shit to PLAY in the scenes that they had. They had objectives and FEELINGS (Good God, what is WRONG with those writers who don’t know they need to write feelings into this damn thing) – and both of them (in my opinion, because I watched them both like a hawk) were in their Zone, happy to be given something to DO. Not just physically but emotionally.
I am bored of Mr. Ketch but there was a nice seductive quality to that scene – I have missed Dean as erotic muse. Dean as sexual suggestible combustible muse. It was there – slightly – and it’s only because he was playing it.
Mary as Bad-ass bores me to tears.
It was such a relief to have an episode without Cas and Crowley. It PAINS me to say that.
But at least we got to see some, you know, ACTING, from the two LEADS of the show.
I have to say that I was initially rolling my eyes when I saw the BMOL bunker (like – come on, is James Bond going to be rolling up in an Aston Martin now?), but by the end of the episode where it basically turned out that the bunker was functionally useless and the BMOL had severely underestimated how good they were, I was more okay with it.
//But I don’t like the “badass” vibe in GENERAL this season because it neutralizes their humanity AND somehow – I don’t know how it happens – NEUTERS them.//
YES. I think this ties in to the lack of blood and darkness and grittiness. It makes it all too clean and lowers the stakes. There was a Buffy episode in season 5 where Buffy was seriously injured when a vampire stabbed her with her own stake – Joss Whedon said in the commentary that he felt it was necessary for that to happen because Buffy had gotten TOO good at her job, and the audience needed a reminder that she was mortal and every fight she was in was life or death. I feel like we’re in a similar place here.
And yes to the feelings. Dean’s expression when he said “I never was,” and Sam’s expression when he told Mary to leave – I actually felt relieved at those moments. Like, oh, okay, the show still knows how to go there
The badass Mary thing feels to me like a reaction to the accusations of sexism over the years. My reaction to Mary’s line about not being “just a mom” was, “No kidding? You’ve only been banging us over the head with that for the entire season.” I get that we’re deconstructing Mary as the perfect Madonna figure here, and it’s certainly ironic that I want to see more of her character as reduced to her reproductive abilities and maternal instincts, but it’s like they’ve mistaken deconstructing the image with erasing any character traits beyond Mary as hunter, instead of making her more multifaceted. It seems like there should be a way to deconstruct the image while still maintaining that, whatever her flaws and characteristics beyond being a mother, she is still the same character who made tomato rice soup for Dean when he was sick.
this show you guys….down is up….up is down….I’m having feelings again (you guys remember feelings right?), strong ones, so that is a good sign…..but those feelings are mostly rage and confused despondency…..but I liked some stuff….but other stuff was like….noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo………..and why does it look so ugly……….I think this season has broken me………send help
I mean the show was always glossy…but not saturated and blank and impersonal like this…we talk about Route 666 and Bugs being stupid but…at least in those episodes the stupidity had shadows……places to hide….it didn’t just sit there like a fart at a funeral…..it needs its GLAMOUR back…..glamour is about mystery and concealment and trickery and denial….the glamour is why Sheila has to keep referring to classic Hollywood…this isn’t classic Hollywood……………………it’s classic ED Wood maybe…without the love or charm
I understand what you are saying about beauty and shadows. Anna Biller was writing about shooting The Love Witch on film and the difficulty in getting it processed, how the expertise is nearly gone- the examples of shadows she used were just beautiful. Like the ones Sheila’s shown before.
I did like Dean in glasses. Dude would rock as Clark Kent. And Sam in glasses could be Lily Tomlin’s grandson.
dean in glasses was high on the list of things to enjoy! And JA and MP once again treated us to some A+ joke delivery
//Lily Tomlin’s grandson// *still weirdly attracted despite this rather accurate description*
There were some funny bits. Lucille making a cameo makes me appreciate how SPN doesn’t take itself too seriously and includes the audience in on the joke. Sometimes it works and sometimes it falls flat, but not many shows even try it.
“You tend to ride the brakes.”
*pets Jessie’s hair* shhhh it will be alright
Have to say I like NLG’s direction. Some interesting shots especially that fight scene through the fallen glasses. Although, not to be OCD, but that kindling our soon-to-be-dead-never-going-to-be-a-fiancé camper was gathering in the opener was very wet. Not the best way to impress your girlfriend.
The Lucille cameo gave me such delight that on the spot it almost made me ready to pre-forgive just about any bad parts of the episode. I was actually pretty entertained throughout. The humour was enjoyable…especially the whole “Take care of her” scene.
The parallel between Gwen and Sam and keeping secrets was so heavy handed it made me roll my eyes….but show has done this many times before even in season’s I have loved.
Mark Pellegrino is a joy as always. As I stated last episode I truly hope they do justice with his character and write episodes that will truly engage the potential that he brings to the role.
//dean in glasses//
This is my dream, basically.
get in line
Regarding: “Ladies Drink Free”
Not a terrible episode, but it’s another filler hour in a very unfocused season. No idea why they threw in another Claire episode.
This is about the last two episodes of S12: it will be a ramble, and includes random thoughts on the season as a whole.
After questioning if I was losing my love for the show during this season, these two episodes sucked me back in. My primary focus is always on the brothers and I’d been missing the feeling I used to get when watching Dean and Sam work together, seeing the love they share and the kick-ass team they were. Lucky for me, these elements were showcased and it grabbed me by the heart again. I was a brother-loving fool watching the boys work together, talk and appreciate their relationship. And multiple hugs! Thank you, Robert Berens.
The story line with Mary became a bit of an issue – I just wasn’t sure how to take her being back and how she was interacting with her sons. The way things played out in the last two eps turned me around on Mary. I got teary during Dean’s speech to her while trying to reverse the brainwashing. Jensen Ackles was powerhouse in those scenes; the man is a treasure.
I’m meh on what happened to Lucifer, Cas and Crowley. If they’re all dead… I think I may be okay with that. I haven’t been feeling much for all of those characters for about the last 2-3 seasons. I’m not gonna dwell on them – just gonna wait to see how it plays out in S13. I liked the end scene with the creepy nephilim and am excited to see how he plays into the “big picture”. I feel good to be back on board the SPN train.
Hey Pat! I wish I shared your positivity – I truly do! – but I don’t! I feel like I’ve been so negative this whole season – for my own reasons – that I’ll bow out of conversing about it here. I don’t want to rain on other people’s parades. It’s why I stopped putting up placeholder posts. Things were so wrong this season (from my perspective) that I didn’t even know where to start. I felt like Dean in the opening episodes of Season 6 – that looks like my brother, but that’s not my brother.
I’m looking forward to re-capping “Bad Day at Black Rock” whenever I get to it. I re-watched last week and God, it’s good. Jared!!! Pratfalls!
I am glad to hear you found things to love in the finale. I’m envious, almost. :)
*claps hands* Need to rewatch that in advance of your recap! The way Sam devolves into little brother mode and Dean’s patient eye-rolling makes me so happy.
Jared being SULKY is what makes it so hilarious. Like, he completely loses his adult self. DYING. poor Dean.
and Gordon!
Kubrick, too! Talk about a side character that was well done. I still cry over that flipping ceramic Jesus with the eyes that follow you.
No, no no, not Lady Toni!
Heh, just kidding. Loved the comment that besides S & D the only ones left standing were Jodi and the camera man. Now if only we can somehow arrange for Cass to stay dead.
There were lots of things I liked in these two finale episodes and more than a few ‘been there, got the tshirt’ moments. Overall I was pleasantly surprised how satisfying they felt to me. The last 2 seasons I have been very frustrated with the way the arcs were concluded: Mark of Cain and The Darkness. This season I have not been happy with the schizophrenic arcs, but the wrapups of the BMOLs, Freaking Mary Winchester, and Lucifer were all better than I imagined they could be given the meh season.
Don’t get me wrong, even though it’s not what it used to be when it was fresh and young (dark & moody, insert many other adjectives here), Supernatural is still the highlight of my TV viewing week. I may be ranting about, “I pay good money to see Dean Winchester sass his jailer, not give him the silent treatment.” Or “Why is that werewolf cure not ripping Sam’s heart out over memories of Madison?” Even so I still love watching.
Escaping the bunker lockdown:
*Seriously Ketch, you’re an a**hole AND stupid? You’re a killer, just shoot them.
*Sam “digging into the lore” and always finding what he’s looking for.
*Dean, do NOT say “blaze of glory” again. Ughhh, too late.
*Nice confession, Sam, easier to follow than to…lead. Wait, you don’t lead, Sam. You’re the heart and brains guy. Oh, I get it. It’s a setup for what’s coming next.
*Grenade launcher – yippee yi kiyay!
Showdown with BMOL:
*Oh, good! I’m finally gonna get to see Jodi smack down Freaking Mary Winchester! What?!? Robbed.
*That’s right, FMW, Jodi is the good mom. The Deodi/Jean/Dedi ship is in full sail!
*Why are the Disney brothers still breathing air?
*Sam’s speech to the troops – who tweeted the Leslie Neilson clip? I can’t find it, but loved the writer’s little inside joke.
(I do really love (and miss) these references and when the show doesn’t take itself too seriously, tongue in cheek.)
*Ahhh, the obligatory, finale fanservice, bitch/jerk, brother hug… Check. ✔
Dean saving Mom, because that’s what he does:
*You all know I have railed against Freaking Mary Winchester, mostly because she has always been so sanctified. When Dean said, “I hate you”, I felt such incredible relief for him. Dean finally broke through that 4 year old child wall. He grew up. This is what he was wrestling with on the kitchen floor at the beginning of the season, but he wouldn’t allow himself to feel that way. Remember the pilot when he pushed Sam saying, “Don’t talk about Mom like that”? This is what he was doing to himself. This scene was written with a very Biblical structure. Peter denied 3 times and Jesus on the seashore repeated his call to him 3 times in forgiveness. Here Dean expresses his hate 3 times then says, I love you, I forgive you, I forgive you. In Dean fashion, except for the impossible task of parenting Sam, Dean’s blame was all about what Sam had suffered. “I need you to SEE me.” This was a beautiful scene and, yes, I cried. One has to think Dean will be changed after finally allowing himself to experience his (Mom) trauma. It’s not by accident, I think, that Dean’s most profound, revelatory thoughts, feelings, words all take place in the realm of the subconscious – dreams.
*BMOL – “open a portal” “nah, bitch”, BOOM! Buh-bye ?queen wave.
*I agree that Sam has been a bit ‘soul-lite’ this season, but the family hug was nice.
I agree with you about the bunker lockdown. It’s 60’s Batman villainy, just a step above tying them to a conveyor belt with mechanical machetes whacking away at the far end.
But we did get the grenade launcher. And “goggles.”
Oh yeah, goggles!
Who We Are was the first episode in a while that had me engaged, since Regarding Dean and before that American Nightmare (which were my #1 and 2 for season 12, and in reality these are the only three that I will probably look back on fondly). Yes, there were plot issues (really, Walt and Roy as allies? pretty sure those two ended up dead in an alley somewhere), but Dean’s simmering anger at Mary for everything hit the spot. Not only was he done with her choices this season, but spoke up for everything they had gone through. (Of course, he had to do that by talking about Sam’s experience and not himself but that’s to be expected.) Sam’s rally speech to the roomful of hunters served it’s purpose for the plot but it missed the mark – he may have followed BMoL a little too enthusiastically but Sam doesn’t have a problem being a leader. Anyway, have more thoughts on All Along The Watchtower but need to run. Would love to see what others thought.
The gunplay annoyed me. I know it could seem a bit silly to talk about realism in a show with witches and demons, but their successful assault on the BMOL compound using handguns, when it’s defended by guys with body armor (or “armour” to be culturally appropriate) and automatic weapons, was just stupid. If they’d done something imaginative, spray painting the thing with a .50 cal like Walter White at the end of Breaking Bad, I could have put up with that. But… unimaginative gunplay?
The season in a nutshell.
I did like the DeanSamMary hug. And the “I hate you”s that proceeded it. That’s Dean being clever and open and unexpected.
More please.
I am still trying to decide what I thought of All Along The Watchtower. Probably closer to U2’s whelming version than Jimi’s.
//But… unimaginative gunplay?//
You had to go and mansplain the gunplay. I was happy until… I choose to believe body armo(u)r doesn’t help against a well aimed headshot. Hmph.
On the ther hand, what do I know?
I don’t even know the difference between “proceed” and “precede.” ;-)
//unimaginative gunplay// well, they also had a lot of pluck and resolve? *snorts*
What was up with all the headshots, too? I know Sam’s a good shot but EVERY.SINGLE.SHOT that those hunters fired was right between the eyes.
Perhaps a marksmanship spell was cast off-camera.
Now you’re talking Supernatural gunplay.
Paulanie mindmeld strikes again!
Yesssssss! Also, that Bond villainy was such high camp (where was Ketch’s “I expect you to die, Dean Winchester”) and I agree about showing Jody’s badassery (although I bet they cut any fight scene for time purposes). Poor Jody – she is always taking punches to the left side of her face.
Two things give me hope for season 13. I love this window to an alt-world because we might get another take on familiar characters or revisit other older ones (c’mon, tell me that set didn’t look like some world in Star Trek:TOS? I was half waiting for the Gorn to jump out and we got Bobby). Angels and demons without powerpoints and sweaters, hallelujah.
Second thing was the nephilim. Annoyed doesn’t cover my reaction to the whole Lucifer storyline this season and by Kelly’s pristine and relatively easy birth (as a mother, I was offended by her spotless white nightgown and slightly labored breathing). However, that last scene in the nursery had such symmetry, right down to Sam’s horrified expression over finding yet another creepy yellow-eyed creature, that my interest is now piqued.
Uh oh! Trouble in Alt!Paradise ref the mindmeld…
Only ref bringing back the Alt world. Bobby would be ok, but we might have to continue to deal with FMW and Lucifer trying to get back through the portal… arghhhh!
I’m completely on board with the rest. I actually think I saw a Gorn. Quick, throw a Styrofoam rock at it! It fits right in with Harvey Korman’s cowboy cemetary. Sheila, you’ve ruined me. You are also the perfect person to tell me this: the slowmo shot of Bobby approaching wearing the Arab headscarf feels like I’ve seen it before (or a million times before). Does that have a direct reference or is it just an overused trope? Paula in ref Kelly baby birth see “want to barf below”.
*barf” below.
Naturally my 3 season faves are same as Paula’s since she crawls in my head and steals stuff or leaves it for me to find and think it’s my own, but I have to thank Watchtower for the tidying of some pesky loose ends.
AAtW: It’s not one that will be beloved, but was, nonetheless, very satisfying.
*Rowena was sassy, but it was time to go and I would have been disappointed in Lucifer had he allowed her to live.
*WinCHESTERS got George Bailey’d. OK, said that on Twitter. As I said above, I love the references.
*Yay, AlternateUniverse!Bobby. Of course Bobby & Rufus would be the last man standing shooting down anything that flys or smokes. (Some fan speculation says the Alt!world with Bobby, Mary, Lucifer will become a regular feature – Please, Better-than-Chuck God, No! Let them go the way of Adam, Michael, and the cage, please.)
*Thank you for giving Crowley the noble end for which he was so long overdue. He will always be King if the Crossroads in my heart…also time to go.
*In the first episode of the season I had it figured that Mary (FMW) would ultimately be the sacrifice to rid the world of Lucifer. Many are applauding the parallel with Sam’s sacrifice in Swan Song – not even close, but it was gonna happen regardless. She went in by accident sorta like Adam. Did they purposely deny her the noble end which they gave to Crowley? She wanted to punch the devil and she got her wish. Good enough for me.
*Cass getting it in the back from Lucifer – didn’t see that coming, but, YES! All that crap about “I’m gonna raise your sweet li’l baby…” was making me wanna barf. Maybe they’ll spend all next season trying to bring him back and we’ll get a break. I can dream.
*Not-baby, Nephilim!Jack was pretty creepy crouched in the corner peering at Sam from the dark with glowy eyes. We’ll pretend they didn’t use the unnaturally growing up baby device last season, ok? He’s like a wildcard. Who knows if he’ll be good, bad, or both – reminiscent of Jesse, the antichrist boy, who is apparently hanging 10 down under. Maybe they’ll team up for some fun. I really did like it ending on the eyes like Dean’s black eyes. Creepy!
There’s my thoughts. I enjoy everyone else’s thoughts, as well, even when different from mine. I’m sorry that some aren’t finding enjoyment. Let’s get some hoodoo up in here and bring back the magic… Love y’all.
/Nephilim!Jack/
They need to do a Witches of Eastwick riff next season. Oops, wrong Jack.
“I do not understand that reference.”(Pretend there’s Sheila’s gif with that, k?)
No really, I don’t get it, but I’m sure it’s an awesome reference. While flailing with the changer trying to find something to watch last night, I suggested Twin Peaks, but we would need to go back and watch TOS. My husband said, “We watched that.” “No honey, that was Northern Exposure.” *snort* I really gotta get with the program.
Just a Nephilim!Jack/Jack Nicholson + Lucifer’s/Devil’s Baby + Witches (SPN and John Updike) riff. They could throw in some Changing Channels references, what with the Eastwick witches needing to turn off the TVs to keep Daryl Van Horne (Jack N’s character) from corrupting the kids he fathered.
Nobody’s creepier than Jack!
Thanks for prompting this Pat!
Thanks for pointing out the nursery parallel Paula! I didn’t pick that. It’s pretty cool. I love reading all your thoughts guys and don’t ever change.
As for my feelings on the episodes and being excited for Season 13, at the moment it’s still hard for me to divorce “how we got here” from “where we are.” Some of the S13 possibilities intrigue including alt-world characters, the hopeful end of some plotlines/tropes, and the nephilim. But goddamn. I’m still pretty livid over how we got here and I’m struggling to let that feeling go.
Same with elements of the episode like the Mary-Dean interaction — I’m so close to enjoying it like you guys but all I can think of is how there was just no set-up — they just wasted maybe fifteen episodes if I’m being charitable on not giving a crap about Dean and Mary — and even less Mary and Sam. So while that scene had some lovely qualities — I love what you see in it Melanie! — the only feeling I got from it was frustration that it was popped like a cherry on the top of a shit sundae (and I don’t even LIKE CHERRIES so thanks no thanks).
Certain aspects of these episodes made me so furious — Sam’s vomitous speech, unconnected from anything he’s ever worried about in his life and apparently serving as the capper to his season’s tackfarting “plotline” — smiles for Walt and Roy?!?!??!?!??!?!!?!? WHAT THE EVERLASTING GOBTROTTER — the detressificatory devolution of hunters as a concept — the snootmootling of Lucifer as an enemy — everyone’s stylish glimcruck jackets and shirts — fankfutting gunbattles as the primary mode of action — more gazzwazzy hero talk — oh man, the flames will never subside.
As for the season as a whole, I’m disappointed for us, I’m disappointed for the actors, I’m embarrassed for the writers. I sincerely hope Dabb can refocus on and reinterest himself in the heart of the show. They need to ditch the fanservice and references and hero fetishes and figure out why they’re bothering to write about Sam and Dean in the first place.
I can UNABASHEDLY SAY that I ADORED the pre-grenade speech and have wallpapered the insides of my eyeballs with screenshots from it frame by frame.
Jessie and I have already ranted about this in private so all I can say is: Cosign.
I’m so sorry, but Cosign!!
It speaks volumes that I’d look at that family hug and feel nothing – followed by rage at the missed opportunity of this entire season.
Like I think I’ve said elsewhere – I’m envious of people who liked it and – like you all up above – have things you want to discuss about it – whereas I’m like, “WTF” the whole time. :(
Every time I think of the made-up out of the blue issue of Sam as a “leader” – and that SPEECH – I get more annoyed. I’m already angry at Sam’s non-entity status for the whole season and then … that? They don’t understand Sam at ALL.
After an entire season where there were almost NO “BM” scenes – LITERALLY – now suddenly I’m supposed to dissolve in tears at a family hug? These people don’t know how to write emotions. They don’t know how to sustain emotions.
and I’m furious at the shoot-outs. Shoot outs? In Supernatural? Sam and Dean killing other human beings like commandos? This is not this show. I checked out from the moment they took down a whole SWAT team. These men are not impenetrable superheroes. They are flesh and blood. THAT’S the appeal.
// They need to ditch the fanservice and references and hero fetishes and figure out why they’re bothering to write about Sam and Dean in the first place. //
Every single episode somebody said “This is why we do what we do” “We saved the world” “Thank you so much for saving the world” “The world is a better place because you’re in it” … it was nauseating. It was like they had no faith in what they were trying to do – so if they just kept reminding us that we all love these guys (as though we need reminding) … it would give the series some weight. It already has weight. It has weight in those two guys. But when you create an entire season when Sam and Dean almost never TALK to each other (furrrrious about this) … then suddenly you have NO show.
and don’t get me started on Eileen Leahy. Once upon a time, Supernatural cared about its ancillary characters, cared enough to develop them, and develop them through their intersections with the Winchesters. Consider the time given to developing Charlie. Or Lisa. Or Garth. (It was good to hear Dean talking to Garth on the phone, I will admit that.) These characters were invested in. It’s no secret that the fandom fell in love with Eileen last season. It was great to see her again. And then they kill her in the TEASER. Without ANY development of what we saw in that nursing home episode – the feeler Sam put out – “call to hang out” … none of the emotional possibilities that were so PALPABLE in that first episode. This writers room is too in love with SWAT gear to understand that in order to have Eileen dying be any kind of “payoff” – you have to invest in her. You have to GIVE a shit about the inner lives of these men and don’t just rely on JA or JP to “fill in the blanks” with a brief closeup.
and the “callback” to French Mistake … ugh. Horrible.
The “callbacks” in general have been horrible. Winks at the fans. “See? We watch the show. We know the sign-posts.”
The only part I liked of the finale was the goggles moment and it speaks volumes that that came from a real situation during filming – not anything created in that abysmal writer’s room.
at least the Big Bad next season won’t be a bunch of boring Brits in SWAT gear. So we’ve got that going for us!
It felt to me like the whole season was in those two episodes. Like the writers/showrunner didn’t know how they were going to end the season until they got there. I mean, if they knew Mary would be brainwashed, why not have it done at the beginning of the season and not let the audience in on it and have Sam and Dean struggle with why she’s acting so weird to them and maybe she just doesn’t like the, leading to all kinds of angst. And in the background there would be constant updates of hunters being killed, and worry about their friends, happening around the usual monster of the week episodes. Some of those monster of the week episodes could parallel/hint at brainwashing. And the Crowley/Lucifer “shift in power” could be shown much earlier and built upon to increase suspense.
I mean, how stupid was that? Just all of a sudden. I realize it had to do with the baby’s power or something but it came out of nowhere. And if Sam and Dean really wanted Crowley to stay in the bunker, why would they leave him with a blade stuck in one hand? No Devil’s Trap? Even I could probably manage to pull a knife out of my hand with the other one.
Yes, lots to complain about and very odd. Definitely feels like it was all made up on the fly. Still, I will probably tune in next season:)
I’ll definitely tune in next season. I feel like S13 was a prison sentence. I’m not giving up now although I know people – hardcore fans – who no longer watch the show.
I agree with your sensitive critiques here, especially in terms of how they set up the arcs (or didn’t), and then suddenly – in the last 2 episodes – “resolved” the arcs, without having invested properly in them all along. The Mary arc. They took the LEAST interesting route with her. It started promisingly. It should have been the ONLY thing dealt with. It should have been talked about between the brothers at the end of EVERY episode, to create that emotional thruline. There should have been switchbacks – Sam falling apart, Dean rising up, Dean crumbling, Sam talking him out of it … not just … Dean playing Words with Friends (ARRRRRRRGH) and Sam being lovely and sympathetic towards what their mother needed. No, we started with: Dean looking at childhood photos while his mother is right upstairs. Sam shyly bringing her tea and hesitating to come near. So much potential. Then … nothing.
This is my main feeling about everything:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92IkddsjtAA
… which is why I hesitated to say anything. I have nothing to say except “Flames … flames … on the side of my face …”
I keep meaning to watch “Clue” and keep forgetting!
// Even I could probably manage to pull a knife out of my hand with the other one. //
hahahaha I know. That was so stupid.
and then Sam and Dean are like, “How did you get here??”
Guys. Come ON.
and then Sam and Dean are like, “How did you get here??”
Right? Every time it felt like the story was going somewhere good, I’d get pulled out of it by an obvious (stupid, out of character) plot device (a blade in one hand, tossing the keys{to the Impala!} to Cas, taking on a SWAT team, shooting humans. . . ) or a cringe-worthy self-referential moment (referring to the French Mistake, Sam’s speech). Ugh.
“when you were Polish …”
Ugh. So pointless. Especially when everything else – ie: the actual characters I recognize – are not in place.
I’m not sure I can bear a re-watch. The episodes I remember liking are: the one when Mary decided she wanted to go on a hunt, early on – although there was something a little “off” about everything – I figured at that early point it would pass. I also liked Regarding Dean.
In re: Regarding Dean: I did think it was funny (inadvertently) that the best episode involved Dean forgetting who he was – because the entire season showed that those in charge had forgotten who these people were. It turned into this inadvertent metaphor for me, the inner monologues of Andrew Dabb and his writing staff: “Wait a second … who is this guy again? Why does everyone love him? Because he’s a HERO, that’s it!!” (Nope. Wrong answer.)
I know this was not the intended connection to be made – but I couldn’t help making it.
That episode also – unlike the rest of the entire season – gave JA and JP something to PLAY.
Jeez Louise.
there was so much they could have done with Sam this year. So much! His mother. His body. His mind. His anger/forgiveness. This was a season that seemed to think it was about their history: it piled reference on top of reference; it had their mother who has been absent 35 years; it had the government and the BMoL looking into their past; it had nascent hunters and an “examination” of “hunter life.” There are so many ways that this season could have been about them. Bainer you have some great ideas.
The sidelining of all of this rich personal stuff for a confused retread of “is monsters bad and what about killing” shows a real lack of insight into the show, care for the characters, and ability to to marry theme, narrative and emotion. This lack of insight, ability and care is a triangle of awfulness that derails even good moments. I could deal with one or two out of three but the trifecta is a killer.
I think it’s a real shame what happened to Eileen in that the whole BMoL/hunters storyline was broken and her death should have been in service of something better if she had to die; but the death that still really bugs at me is Billie’s. Just a big ol’ absolute waste of a character for stupid reasons that left a huge dangling plot thread (that they will probably try to tie into the multiverse thing, too little too late) in a season of dangling plot threads. (Like…I know Paula has ranted about this….what was that ominous shot of Sam being asleep in the car at the end of the penultimate episode? that just ended up sitting there like a wet fart? what the hell?).
Billie. I forgot. Wow, I put that out of my mind completely when I was tallying up deaths this season. Cosmic consequences. Huh.
Eileen’s death is the worst. Everyone dies on SPN, but it’s the quality of how their death plays out. Alicia had an interesting death that resonated with her story – family meant everything and yet she killed by a facsimile of her mom. Toni and Ketch died how they lived – brutally violent – so I was fine with their quick demise. But Eileen in a cold open like a nameless victim we didn’t know, Billie stabbed abruptly, and Rowena – the female character with the most episodes in the show’s history – was killed offscreen with a snarky comment. These were badly written and deeply unsatisfying.
Classic SPN didn’t always get deaths eight either. On a scale from 1- 10 of most emotional satisfying deaths on SPN: John – 11, Ellen and Jo – 9 and Ash – 3.
Do you think Rowena’s really dead? I know Crowley is but I think Rowena could go either way (or return as alt-version — oh man, I’m going to hate it so much if twelve seasons of dead characters just start rocking up in happy coincidence with their jaunty berets). I don’t know how I feel about it — I like RC’s performance, I love MS — I wish they’d been used more sparingly and with more care, so that their storylines didn’t become showkillers and they could stick around. The deaths feel necessary as a way of resolving writer incompetence, not performer, and I feel rotten for the actors, especially MS. They were some pretty ineffective sendoffs.
Ash ha ha ha! Poor crispy Ash. I got no beef with his death :-D
Maybe we could get an alt-world Ronald Reznick back. Dude was suspicious enough to survive, if he just stayed away from windows…
That was a bad (tragic, dramatic) death.
Mandroids.
Plus, stealth is how Sam and Dean should deal with SWAT teams, like they did in Nightshifter.
Now I’m annoyed again.
Honestly, mutecypher, I wouldn’t care about shootouts/SWAT teams if the characters were still in place, if the characters still existed. Fine, be on a SWAT team, go to outer space, strap on an Uzi, do what you gotta do, but when the characters are no longer present … then all you have is empty bullshit action as imagined by a teenage boy in love with gadgets/gear. We have enough of that nonsense on the planet and it’s not why I watch the show.
That’s my main … not even complaint. I think this season was a travesty, quite honestly – although there were moments here and there that I liked.
Totally agree with you Jessie and Paula about Billie. UGH. Not over it!!
// But Eileen in a cold open like a nameless victim we didn’t know, Billie stabbed abruptly, and Rowena – the female character with the most episodes in the show’s history – was killed offscreen with a snarky comment. These were badly written and deeply unsatisfying. //
Paula – that’s it, you’ve said it perfectly. They’re kind of just disposing of these characters, as opposed to – developing them, and then breaking our hearts in the way they go out. Like Ellen & Jo. Think of how deeply those characters were developed – all of the different connections made – the fourway current of support going on – and they had a death WORTHY of their stature as characters. Charlie I’m still not sure about. I felt that her death was manipulated a bit too much (why was she typing in front of an open window? why couldn’t she just put on headphones to drown Rowena out??) – but, you know …. just swiftly dispatching a character like Eileen, especially when it was obvious from that first episode that the fandom fell in love with her …
It’s just really bad storytelling.
// I wish they’d been used more sparingly and with more care, so that their storylines didn’t become showkillers and they could stick around. //
I agree with this so much!
I loved Crowley so much, and Season 9 into Season 10 was so RICH with possibility. and then Dean stopped being a demon and suddenly … boom. Crowley’s a sulking Macbeth who barely intersects with the brothers. It would have been nice if Crowley had MISSED Dean more … missed their bromance more … made demands … “I won’t be igNORED, Dean” kinda thing … But oh well, wasn’t meant to be.
Rowena was mildly entertaining but long overstayed her welcome. Cas, obviously, is a different case. His fan base is an entity in and of themselves, God love ’em, and I have not been a fan for a couple of seasons but I always totally understood why they kept him around.
Weirdly – and I still can’t figure it out – maybe because the tension just didn’t exist at all this season – his death was just kind of … Meh.
Maybe because he’s been so separated from the brothers for about 3 seasons now … maybe because the structure of this season was so shoddy and sloppy – so there was no build.
But a MAJOR character like that exiting the scene? Let’s have a CEREMONY for God’s sake.
Think of Bobby! The episode HE got when he finally “went out” … I get a lump in my throat just thinking about it. (Of course he returned for a cameo here and there … but he DIED, and the show really put in the time and the care to give him a proper burial. And it was KILLER.)
This buncha boobs doesn’t know how much we love these people, and thinks they can skate along on our good will. (Sorry, y’all. I’m really mad.) “They love Eileen. Let’s kill her and give people Feels.” No, no, no, it doesn’t work that way. INVEST in her. DEVELOP her. Have Sam and Dean TALK about her.
Half of the issues I have with this season probably would not exist if there had been an Impala-night-talk scene per episode. I am shocked that there were maybe 4 or 5 of those talks in the ENTIRE season.
Unfortunately, fan response to this finale has been so positive I’m not sure anyone in charge will get the memo.
No “BM” scenes? Didn’t these people see French Mistake? Well, yes, as they reminded us in the finale – they did (UGH) – but clearly they didn’t UNDERSTAND it. (“Do you want to answer the hate mail if we cut those scenes?”)
I would bet Rowena is coming back. Ruthie has been suspiciously absent on SM and the last con. They probably felt they had to leak Cas’s return because oh no, fan reaction, so she might be the one surprise of next season.
And mutecypher, YES on Ronald Resnick returning (now, his death was so on point). Maybe Frank Devereaux survived too (because his death was right up there with Eileen and Rowena). All hail the paranoid bastards surviving in the alt-world!
Billie started out season 11 as such a powerful character who seemed to bring back this real threat of lasting death, but then she was, what, gatekeeping for Crowley? Even Red Meat I thought her words were like an ominous clue, but it didn’t happen and by the finale of S11 I had lost all real interest in her. Cosmic consequences, yawn. Are we supposed to make the huge inferrential leap that Cass’ death at the hands of Lucifer is somehow cosmic payback for stabbing Billie? So, again, poor handling of a potentially awesome character. (And thank you, Misha, for maintaining the delicious suspense of not knowing whether Cass would have a future in Supernatural.)
As for Rowena, her “good death” was when she thought she was going to be Lucifer’s honey mama and instead he snapped her neck. It really helped re-establish what a great big bag of ungrateful dicks Lucifer was even after she’d freed him from the cage. I thought to myself that it was exactly how she needed to go out – betrayed by the big betrayer, himself. Wasn’t she “killed” again by Amara or was it Crowley? This latest death did feel like they were too cheap to fly her to Vancouver for one quick scene so… I’m going to remember the ersatz romantic neck snap as her true farewell. I hope you are wrong about her coming back AGAIN unless they purposefully make a joke out of her not dying. I guess that could be funny.
Ronald Reznick the great unmasker of mandroids! Oh, Ron, when you see the red dot it’s too late…
Crowley. I said above that his death was noble. I was being sarcastic. This is Crowley we’re talking about! I like him best (or worst) when he’s being utterly despicable and self serving. I loved when he was wheeling and dealing for souls from his Malibu mansion, not overseeing DMV Hell from the set of Camelot meets the batcave. I liked that they allowed Crowley to give a voice to what we’ve all been feeling about Hell – bored to death, can’t stand it anymore. He was desperate to get out. You might say it was his own personal hell. The other thing he wanted & needed was to WIN against Lucifer. So stabbing himself to seal Lucifer in the Alt!world was a purely selfish gratification dressed up in the fancy suit of selfless, noble sacrifice. It was a fitting end for Crowley, exactly what he wanted… unless, of course, demons who die end up right back in Hell. ? (MS sounded pretty salty on twitter, so I guess he won’t be back. I read they cut his big final line which he just had printed on a bajillion tshirts. Yikes! I might be a little salty, too.)
Charlie!?! Still NO, just NO.
For me, the best thing about the whole season was Bobby’s scene. Jim Beaver elevates anything he’s in. I knew it was him in the trailer, too, because I recognized his little belly:) If he’s back next year, I’m in!
It was definitely good to see him!
Some Things I Liked About The Season, Sincere Edition:
I liked what they did to Sam in eps 1&2 and wish they’d treated it like it was important.
Dean with the photographs and Sam with the ceiling fan of sexual trauma
The non-Dean parts of American Nightmare were great.
Regarding Dean was great.
The goat-head monster-god episode was some classic SPN (albeit with no speaking women???) and some gorgeous and tension-filled cinematography that showed that Sgriccia is still one of the good ones.
Twigs and Twine was nicely traumatic even if it didn’t really have Sam and Dean in it.
Speight is proving to be an excellent director with a real drive towards interesting shot construction; I loved the slo-mo movement through the house in the ResDogs episode.
Aside from everything to do with Cas and the ongoing storylines there were some good messed-up moments in Lily Sunder and the Alexander Hiddig-looking dude helped matters greatly.
In fact where they were able to escape the season-“plotting” Perez, Yockey, Glynn, and Bring all showed chops and brought a few cool ideas to the table. I hope that they stick around and get in some solid viewing-time over the hiatus to help with their character work and episode-focus.
The people who do the Shaving People Punting Things videos.
The S&D bunker convo at the start of the finale.
Dean vs: wooden ship
JP’s hair was entirely rad
JA got a whole thang goingggggggggggggggggggg
//Dean with the photographs and Sam with the ceiling fan of sexual trauma// *chinhands*. The new writers – Perez, Glynn and Yockey – all had potential. Hopefully next season prunes back all the storylines and elements they try to cram in each (which always seems to throw Berens too, who is better when given time to pace the story properly). The goat heads ep (The Memory Remains) had no speaking women? Good eye, because I missed hat one completely.
(On another note, why the hell does my icon keep changing every other comment? Grrrrr.)
“Dean: Well, uh, there was this… God help me, Sam, there was this bright white light!
Sam: It’s okay. Safe room.
Dean: And then suddenly, I was, uh, I was in a different place. And there were these beings, and they were too bright to look at, but I could feel them pulling me towards this sort of table—
Sam: Probing table!
Dean: God! Don’t say that out loud!”
Is it just me or was Soulless!Sam just a wee bit overenthusiastic about the probing table?
I think we all need a shower now…