Traveling home for Thanksgiving early tomorrow morning and also can’t watch the episode tonight. Not sure when I will catch up. Have fun without me.
All you ‘Merricans out there, have a wonderful and safe holiday.
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Did anyone else shudder when violins and pianos played after The Kiss?
Just a short BM scene at the end, quickly terminated by Dean saying that he only told Cole what he needed to hear. Hmmmm.
Just how prophetic will this song prove for Crowley? Has he been blue since the day they parted?
I got a kick out of the website Sam visited to find Rowena, “Witchcraft and the Occult with Professor Farqus.” And a spell “To Bind and Purge.” Will Crowley have an Aunt Bulimia? But even better was Sam’s “Nice screen name, Impala67.”
A good, solid mid-season episode.
I have been enjoying this season so much. We got two very good brother moments in this ep. The light hearted brother teasing in the beginning of the episode made me feel all warm and toasty. Deans confession to Cole but so clearly aimed at his brother broke my heart and left me bleeding at the end of the episode. Jensen is expert at this kind of exposition. Always finding a way to rend and tear at our heartstrings. Sam’s face was perfect in response a mix of pain and fear. It was anticlimactic to find the witch is Crowley’s Mom. Although I am hoping for some good stuff to come from it. I think overall it was a good episode and one I will watch more than once.
I must say, the beginning of the episode did not really convince me. The Trouts making out, the pimps… Meh. But I must admit I didn’t expect the story to go that way. So, E.T. goes home? Good riddance. I mean, good for her! Let’s hope Castiel/Collins gets a good storyline, since he’s not going anywhere. But I like where it’s going, back to Jimmy Novak and the mess Cas left behind.
Privacy? Yeah, Sam, that does exist, I swear. I was so embarrassed by this whole conversation. By the whole situation, really.
Demons puking themselves to death? That’s new and gross. I love it!
I like Rowena, too. What a face! I have a soft spot for Scots, anyway. Someone here had guessed who she was – was that you Mutecypher ? Do you win a lollipop ? Crowley’s mommy… That should be fun.
Cole: poor guy. But, that’s it, really ? I was expecting… I don’t know, something more. Although it was a great little moment between these two guys.
Dean keeps saying you don’t come back from where he’s been. I don’t know if that’s true, but it gives him a clarity on things that’s really interesting.
This is one of the things that make me love Supernatural so much: it’s a story about stories. Not only because of the meta episodes, or because of Metatron. But also, the lore, the legends among hunters, the family stories that we believe or that we tell ourselves to cope.
No Baby this week. She’s escaping us!
Lyrie: //This is one of the things that make me love Supernatural so much: it’s a story about stories. Not only because of the meta episodes, or because of Metatron. But also, the lore, the legends among hunters, the family stories that we believe or that we tell ourselves to cope.//
I like what you have said here. I think this is a very important aspect of SPN and why we enjoy it so much, why we can kaleidoscope it for analysis but also relate to it on a human level. It digs into our literary imagination.
Cole has become an interesting character. I didn’t like him much the last two times we saw him, although both his fight scenes with Dean are stellar, he just seemed a bit one sided to me. But in last nights episode something happened and he just seemed so… beautiful, is the only way I can describe it. Still stuff didn’t necessarily make sense: really he just buys everything Dean sells him in that speech? Who was the librarian that helped him (“I need everything you’ve got on demons”), because he has already got devil’s traps and demon kidnapping down, or is this all common post apocalypse stuff now? Did Cole know deep down that his father was a monster, or replaced by a monster, and that is why he was so driven to find Dean, secretly not to kill him, but really to understand…? Some jarring questions there, but despite all of this confusion around the character, he really broke through to me last night.
Re angel trouts: My spouse was watching with me last night, which is a rare occurrence that only happened because of his cold and inability to leave the sofa, and he turned to me during one of the Hannah and Cas scenes and says “these parts are really boring”. Yes, and it looks like the show got the memo.
Crowley’s Mom – yup.
What was the name of the coven she was kicked out of? The super fun group? The magisterial super cacophony coven? The kicking-the-men-of-letters-in-the-ass magnus opus group?
To all of you able to re-watch the episode, is there some kind of indication that Dean was really on a hunt with the dating app or are we really supposed to believe that he just stumbled into that? It seems in hindsight impossible, but I can’t remember if there was a real tipoff.
Also, is anyone else having issues loading Sheila’s homepage? Mine doesn’t update and I have tried multiple browsers.
Lastly, have a lovely holiday American folk.
NATALIE! I think they’re now writing the show just for you.
This episode sort of felt like it was wrapping up storylines that aren’t working? I’m happy to see Generic Angel Number 58 leave. Though I was also happy to see them address issue of the angel’s human vessels. Remember when SPN cared about the human vessels of demons and angels? Good times.
mutecypher — //Just how prophetic will this song prove for Crowley? Has he been blue since the day they parted? //
Well, now I’m expecting a Crowley and Rowena montage set to this! I am going to be so disappointed when it doesn’t happen.
Heather — //is there some kind of indication that Dean was really on a hunt with the dating app or are we really supposed to believe that he just stumbled into that//
I’ve only seen it once, but I got the impression he was really on the dating app and stumbled into it. I’d watch it again, but it’s so embarrassing! I can’t. I experience terrible second-hand embarrassment watching some things (reality TV, many sitcoms) and usually SPN doesn’t cause it. But that scene and the beginning of “Fan Fiction”…I was so uncomfortable.
(Oh, and I’m not having any problems loading this site.)
//Did anyone else shudder when violins and pianos played after The Kiss?//
I pretty much shuddered at every scene involving Cas and Hannah up to the moment that she finally decided to leave. I was starting to like Hannah a little bit in the previous episodes but after that scene in the motel with Cas being all focus on the mission, nothing else matters (They are rogue angels for heavens sake…..not harbingers of another apocalypse) and Hannah deciding to strip her clothes off for a shower….I was DONE with both of them. I was slightly appeased when Hannah made the decision she did. I liked the fact that she let her vessel have her life back. Having Cas go find Jimmy Novak’s daughter sounds interesting and seems to have potential. We shall see I suppose. I find myself increasingly underwhelmed with much of what they are doing with the angels these days. I agree with what Sheila has been saying….I like Cas when his story is involved with the Winchesters and I wish the show would let him be with them more.
Other then those opening Cas and Hannah scenes the rest of the episode was really good. I loved the entire scene between Dean and Cole. It was so intense. It actually startled me when he said the line “The people that loved me pulled me away from that edge” It’s so very rare to hear the word love come out of Dean Winchesters mouth.
I hope this isn’t the last we are going to see of Cole though. I honestly wasn’t expecting that storyline to wrap up so quickly and certainly not so amicably.
I totally think Dean was lying to Sam at the end of the episode about telling Cole what he needed to hear. From the look on Sam’s face, I think he thinks so as well.
Michelle –
I’m wondering since Hannah has returned to Heaven, will Metatron starts wheedling and using Hannah’s pants-feelings for Castiel as a way to get his freedom. And Hannah would need a new vessel, so we might get another actress. If the writers liked the arc, but just didn’t care for who had been cast, this gives them an out. In any case, the show did a sweet job of returning Caroline to her home.
Lyrie –
Yes, what’s up with Jimmy Novak? Now that we’ve seen the MISSING label we need some sort of resolution to that. And yes to the show being about stories. I’m assuming we will get a story about the Grand Coven (aka The Super Magical Friends, Heather). Why was Rowena banned from the Natural Witch’s lunch table? And what is she up to now, gathering students and building a rival organization?
// I have a soft spot for Scots, anyway.//
Here’s one of my favorite Scotsmen, from Samurai Jack.
Speaking of Magic and Supernatural. Mike Tyson has a cartoon on Cartoon Network. Last week’s episode involved Mike investigating the question, “Is magic real?” As part of his investigation, he went to Atlantic City, where he came across Criss Angel (that douchebag). Mike got angry at Criss for misleading children with illusions – instead of practicing real magic – and he punched out CA. I thought this might be amusing for the SPN crew, what with being down on Angels.
Heather –
Cole did seem to find an extremely capable librarian (redundant, I know) who got him up to speed with Demons in a matter of weeks. I also liked his character a lot in this episode. I want him to help out later in the season. Or switch places with Adam in the Cage. But I’m with you, I want more information before I can understand why he just believed Dean. How could he be so completely sure that Holy Water was the one true test if he’d only tortured one demon before? Why did he buy the “your dad was a unique monster of a kind I’ve never encountered before or since” story? Another reason to hope he comes back.
May –
Rowena and Crowley may post their adventures to Flickr, we can hope. Then it’s a cinch to set the slideshow to music. I don’t want to see the two of them with any triplets, though. Crowley seems a bit bored with his King of Hell responsibilities, maybe he can become besties with his mom as a substitute for Dean. They can work their way through the Michelin Guide.
Maybe I should keep my pie-hole shut as I’ve only watch three quarters of the ep, but here goes …
Very pleased to see Crowley’s mum on the scene … took a while to warm to her but that last scene with Crowley? Awesome.
Goodbye Hannah. The same actress pops up in Faith way back in Season 1. She’s the receptionist at the hospital where Dean is languishing in daytime tv hell. Now Hannah’s gone maybe her vessel can get her day job back as well as her husband.
By the way, what was her mission? I totally forgot.
So, for the internet dating scenes I had my hands over my eyes and fast forwarded quite a lot (and missed Hannah in the shower – What. The.) I liked the comedy Sam was extracting out of the situation, and the fact that Dean was using a fork, but what I can’t buy is that Dean Winchester of all people has turned into a utter cretin when it comes to women. I just can’t. Somebody tell me that’s not the case. Else I will only be able to rewatch in December when I have my handy Christmas bottle of single malt by my side.
The blonde girl and the dark girl. They really reminded me of the lovely co-captains in the Golem (sigh) episode … in which case, I guess their careers didn’t quite pan out as they thought.
The ‘fancy lady’ from a few season’s back seems to be suffering from typecasting.
Great fight with Cole. Still pondering on the liver eating dad, though. (Really?)
Otherwise … this episode had a bit of a soap opera feel. Lots of things going on all over the place, not all related. The Winchesters used to be front and centre of Supernatural, everything was about them, filtered through them, and they were rarely not in a scene. In this season, even more than last season, that seems (to me at least) not to be the case, now it’s ‘about’ Castiel and Crowley too. The Winchesters feel more peripheral.
However … things Ackles does with his face. Two new, extraordinary things, right at the end in that brief exchange with Sam as Cole drives off. Worth sitting through the episode just for that. And I never get tired of watching people throw holy water at Dean. Or Ackle’s face as they do it.
Helena
//Still pondering on the liver eating dad, though. (Really?)//
The X-Files had a very scary liver eating man monster. Maybe Cole’s Dad was an X-Files monster… pre-show crossover!
//what I can’t buy is that Dean Winchester of all people has turned into a utter cretin when it comes to women.// This is part of my confusion with the whole on-line dating thing. How is it easier for Dean Winchester to use the internet to get sex? How is ‘in person’ not better for him? Sext with someone for two weeks, drive eight hours out of the way, cross your fingers it isn’t the X-Files monster? What? How does Mr. I’m highly suspicious I can spot roofies in a drug soaked daze, jump into on-line dating? This is why I have to believe he was on some kind of hunt he picked up wind of as a demon…please!
mutecypher: Samurai Jack is awesome.
Michelle: I agree, hearing the word love was very jarring/resonant to me as well.
//How does Mr. I’m highly suspicious I can spot roofies in a drug soaked daze, jump into on-line dating?/
Exactly. Exactly! And I can’t nuance this away. It just makes me very cross. Graaaah!
Happy Thanksgiving, by the way!
Dean and online dating… Several people commented on how Sam and Dean looked like a couple of played-out losers in their sunglasses back by the lake in “Paper Moon.” Is the Aging Of Dean Winchester going to be a theme that gets developed? I noticed that his age – 35 – was listed in his Impala67 profile. A really good looking 35 year old guy with nothing more than a 45 year old car to his name, that might be sending too many warning bells. At least, in situations where alcohol and more overt prowling are not involved. Karaoke Demon Dean didn’t seem to have too many troubles getting horizontal, though.
If he was hunting-via-dating-app based on some info not shared with the audience, I can see why he’d keep it from Sam. Sam would rag on him if Dean told him up front. Sam would not rag on him if he didn’t know about it. Sam will come and help if need be in any case. And hey, he might get laid if his info turned out to be a dead end. Easy decision when you map out the consequences.
RE: dating app. I thought for Dean it was more naivete than dumb. Like he sees this app where women start emailing you pix and talking porn. Right to your phone! Greatest invention since sliced pie. And he’s always ready for monsters or demons so if the good-looking woman in the pix turns out to be the real thing instead of a monster – score! Funny that she turned out to be a hooker and THAT he didn’t expect, although he wasn’t shocked, just tired and disappointed. FYI: the description on his page was an answer at a Con, what would Dean’s dating page say? That was JA’s answer for Dean.
Helena –
How accurate was Rowena’s accent? There were times it seemed more Irish to me, but I know that not every Scot sounds like the guy from Samurai Jack. Maybe it was just the purr in her burr that was throwing me.
//How accurate was Rowena’s accent?//
Well, accurate for where? There are all sorts. She had a kind of posh, Edinburgh-ish/Morningsidish accent. She reminded me of a really splendid actress called Siobhan Redmond. What was great is that she was managing to suggest the poshness was a bit of a put up job.
Let’s put it this way, I wasn’t 100% sure if she was Scottish, but I was impressed with her accent but it was right at the end, when she’s mouthing off at Crowley that it clicked. Something unfakeable about what she was doing. And well done me, because apparently the actress is from Falkirk, plumb smack in the middle of Scotland.
I think the dating app works for Dean if we think of it less as a dating app and more as whatever Grindr for straight people is.
But why did he have his REAL NAME on there?! C’mon!!
//whatever Grindr for straight people is.//
Shaggr, possibly.
Or Wankr if you just want to be alone.
Jessie!
Happy Birthday!
Oops! Yes, happy birthday!
LOL Helena, and thanks guys!!!
Call the cops guys, Sam’s hair is officially no longer on point D-:
There wasn’t a lot that grabbed me on the first run. I didn’t really get a sense of urgency or danger from any of the women. The logistics were a bit all over the place and the only thing that stopped me dying of exquisite embarrassment during the Shaggr scene was Sam being hilarious. I dunno; as a set-up for an episode it doesn’t work, as Heather points out. As an illustration of Dean “Is MySpace a Sex Thing?” Winchester, Sex God not being interested in playing the bar pick-up game it’s kind of illuminating. The photograph was INCREDIBLE. I hated it. I loved it. Dean, put your clothes on, don’t pose like that, go away. Go away! I can’t look at you right now.
What is this “WebSummon” business? What, “Search the Web” isn’t good enough for angels? Booooo! I also didn’t like the “Sam calls the Hunter Network for information”; what is that? Isn’t that kind of a big deal? Aren’t these guys still pariahs? Didn’t Sam just get done punching a bunch of hunters very hard in the nose? Who the f are they calling without a Garth or Bobby or Roadhouse to act as a node of information?
The angel story this episode actually kinda made the other Cas-Hannah storylines retrospectively work for me, structurally if not always in execution. Turns out the Grand Angel Faction War Rogue Hunters plot is actually an excuse to get Hannah in touch with her vessel which is an excuse give Cas a story about his own vessel. Bye Hannah’s fringe! I’ll miss you! Bye Hannah’s jeans! Good riddance!
The most promising thing to come out of this is definitely the Rowena “Demons are filth” and Crowley “Demon King of Demons” connection. I look forward to that. I very much enjoyed her ridiculous raised-pinky-finger-performance — to have that mask stripped away at the end was a good contrast; loved the meow. Hard to pull that off convincingly. The dolly zoom was fun.
However, the Grand Coven business makes me pretty uneasy. It seems a bit too Bloodlines; a bit too urban fantasy. Do we really want that hanging around out there? If they’re going to delve (again) into institutional dynamics why not focus more on Sam and Dean’s relationship to the Men Of Letters? But, having just been reminded that sometimes stories are not the setups for what you think they are, I’ll try to keep my fretting under control.
In an episode full of unremarkable setups and shots that final Sam-Dean conversation was a hell of a way to finish. Absolutely gorgeous, and a bit of a heartbreaker — Dean striding off into the unknown, Sam following behind.
Helena —
Doesn’t Wankr kind of defeat the point?!
The Winchesters feel more peripheral.
This feeling pops up every few seasons, I think. It is a little different now because the Cas and Crowley storylines are so separated (despite links like Rowena). But we just had two S&D-heavy episodes; I’m not too concerned yet.
Can you say a bit more about those “two expressions”? I’m not picking it up.
//Doesn’t Wankr kind of defeat the point?!//
It’s niche.
//Doesn’t Wankr kind of defeat the point?!//
Also, is that a euphemism for something? ‘Son, are you still in the bathroom?’ ‘Erm, give me a second, mom, I’m just defeating the point here.’
I thought the app for wanting to have sex by yourself was called The Internet.
//Can you say a bit more about those “two expressions”?//
As it’s your birthday I will watch again without the support of alcohol.
Ok, done. I just meant particular that half-sigh and ‘barely holding on to my patience here’ hovering down of eyelids after Dean says ‘in the wind’, and that flinch/head jerk and side glance he gives Sam when S asks about what he said to Cole. I’m not very good at describing it. And it adheres to the 3 seconds to do, far too many words to describe rule. But I liked it. I was reassured by it after all the Shaggr shenanigans.
I was disappointed that Dean did not use picture of a 67-year-old impala for his Shaggr (or maybe it’s Tossr) thing.
//I thought the app for wanting to have sex by yourself was called The Internet//
Harumph. I remember when The Internet was just scientists talking about particles.
//I remember when The Internet was just scientists talking about particles.//
What once was just a gleam in Tim Berners-Lee’s eye,
Has become a way to discuss characters who love pie,
With selling and posting, MOOC’ing and ‘shipping,
Pirates and honeypots, poker and stripping.
Excellent, mutecypher! The scansion alone merits a monument.
Helena –
aw (*blush*)
Jessie –
// The photograph was INCREDIBLE.//
You know, I wonder who Dean got to take it. And has all of his loving restoration of Baby over the last few episodes been just to clean her up for his on-line dating photo? Quelle horreur!
// The photograph was INCREDIBLE.//
But WHO TOOK IT?
//But WHO TOOK IT?//
Crowley. It was originally for him.
Jessie, happy belated birthday.
mutecypher, nice verse.
//Crowley. It was originally for him.//
There’ll be trouble ahead, then.
Heather –
Yeah, Dean sent it to Crowley with the message “Miss me?” The boy is a serious tease.
thank you Heather & Helena! I knew my bday was good for something. Good pick on that little shrug. He’s pretty over talking about it in that way — Sam keeps pushing.
mutecypher —
Crowley did seem to love taking photos of Demon Dean…
I have a lot of catching up to do! I watched the episode, found it a pretty bumpy ride – almost 100% redeemed by Ackles’ acting in that final monologue. That was some A-game shit going on right there.
In the meantime, though, I just have to leave this here, for your perusal and enjoyment. The title song of a 1962 movie starring a certain someone (all will be clear immediately when you open the link).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psZodDfJWg4
It was my first thought when I saw the title of the latest SPN episode.
Methinks we have a fan on the writing staff.
//That was some A-game shit going on right there.//
At the risk of repeating myself from another thread, Amen to that sister. Looking forward to your thoughts.
//your perusal and enjoyment.//
Thanks Sheila! This is cheering a grey Monday up no end.
Hope you had a wonderful birthday and Thanksgiving.
“Big and brassy! Small and sassy! Give me one of each kind!” hahaha Oh Elvis. Happy song, though, and fun silly movie.
I have always wondered why the ghost of Elvis has never been featured on SPN … although there have been some references to Elvis being spotted out and about alive, and Dean’s one comment about a trip to Graceland. Believe me, I keep track of these things. (Because I don’t have enough to do in my life ….)
Anyway, I take my Elvis references where I can get them, and Girls Girls Girls is the clearest nod to the King yet!!
Holiday was wonderful – birthday was great – now back to the grindstone. Working on the “Hunted” re-cap! GORDON!!
and sorry – maybe someone already said this – will read through comments later today, I promise!! – but one thought I had, and this is me projecting TOTALLY – because I’m dating now, after years of … not dating, shall we say. And so Dean’s line “I’m past saving” does not “go” with deciding to date (or even hook up). It’s a fascinating contradiction – one I very much relate to. So my projection of myself onto all of that – and my own feeling that I was past saving, and now I am getting over myself and going out with guys again on dates … like, real dates where doors are opened for me and shit – nice people, too – nice men … and I’m a floozy, people. I’m not used to this. Hopefully my floozy self will be able to operate in this more traditional environment too – but whatever, TMI. I won’t belabor the point. I still have the evil voice saying I am past saving, that it’s too late for me for all of that. But I’m going out on dates anyway. Signing up for online dating was a huge “eff you” to that sinister voice.
That was not really explored in the episode – the whole “why” of Dean signing up for a dating (or hookup App – either one – hookups are valid, too, and another way to admit you’re alive, that you’re still worth something, that pleasure can be yours too – take it with a grain of salt, just my take) – but I myself found it fascinating, the absence of the connecting links between “I’m past saving” and the mere act of signing up for an online dating site. For me, when I signed up for Match.com, it was a moment of saying, “I want this. I am worth this. Even saying I’m looking – even if it’s just for a makeout buddy – is an act of survival – a statement of survival.”
Totally personal reaction on my part, so like I said, that may not have been there for anyone else.
« Like rules? Like sexy rules? »
No, rules like « don’t put your feet on the coffee table ». Dean, you big dummy.
Helena: // The ‘fancy lady’ from a few season’s back seems to be suffering from typecasting.//
Well, the first time around we didn’t get to see her beautiful cleavage. Sad. Now it’s all OK.
Mutecypher: // Here’s one of my favorite Scotsmen, from Samurai Jack. //
AH AH AH! Thank you!
I liked the brunette hooker. She had character and she made me think of Juliette Lewis.
That fight is brutal. And beautifully shot!
A charming detail came back to me, and I feel the need to share with the rest of the class. About this : I don’t know if any of you speak French, but this means something like «the mussels restaurant». In France, «mussel» is also used as a colloquial term to refer to the female genitals. So I think you can imagine what «to eat one’s mussel» means. Because of the theme of the episode, I find it difficult to think this restaurant’s name is a coincidence. Not so classy now, is it?
I fucked the url up again. Damn!
Sheila, //“I want this. I am worth this. Even saying I’m looking – even if it’s just for a makeout buddy – is an act of survival – a statement of survival.”//
I like this, the way you have put it. I like it for Dean and I especially like it for you. And happy belated b-day to you also. I wish for you many doors opened for you this year.
I don’t know if the episode was going this deep or whether the on-line dating piece was really a hunter’s ruse, but I really appreciate this perspective. People’s optimism and fight… shall we say, spirit, is just beautiful.
Heather – thanks so much!! It really hit home – it’s exactly what I’m going through now (although, you know, without a Mark of Cain and a fist fight with Cole). So it really struck me. And it hasn’t been examined – maybe it won’t be? It very well could have just been a “way” to get Dean involved in the case – you know, strictly a plot-point – and also to put some sex in the show because dammit it has been a while.
But for me that was the whole question – and his “I’m past saving” (that whole monologue – Jesus God!!) was contradicted by the image in my head of him uploading a goofy picture (taken by Crowley probably) and writing down his stats and putting himself out there. Even if he just is looking for sex, that’s a life force, not a death force.
Who knows. Over-thinking things is a great pleasure. :)
Sheila,
Aren’t we here to overthink and overshare?
I like your imput. I don’t understand dating so it didn’t strike me, but now that you’ve said that it seems obvious.
See, as messed up as his situation is, to me he looks closer to being “saved” than he ever did. Sure, he’s also very close to eternal damnation, but these things are never simple, right ? :) But yes, dating (or hooking up), being able to acknowledge that he is loved. He may be on the verge of letting everything go to hell, but it gives him a lucidity that may very well help him.
Am I making any sense ?
It makes a lot of sense!
also, those words he said to Cole: “people who love me….” I can count the times Dean has said the word “love” on one hand. I’m sure there’s some nerd out there who has tallied it up – Go, nerds! – but whatever it is, it’s an extremely low number. :)
It felt rather huge. Almost as huge as his use of the term “brainwashing.” Things are shifting with Dean. Good, bad, I have no idea, but things are shifting.
And then connect that comment about “people who love me” – and the admission in that that he was worth saving because those people loved him – with secretly signing up for a Dating App … I don’t know. Just seems to me there’s a connection. Not like Dean is looking for marriage, he obviously isn’t – but the fact that his sex drive is back (as himself anyway, post-Demon) is a good sign. I never really related to the characterization of Dean as a “womanizer” that I see in some fan discussions. He sleeps with a lot of people – but so? You never see him badgering someone, or being a douche. He’s not using women – or not any more than they are using him. It’s a sexual transaction. It’s all consensual and it always struck me as a sign of his Health. When his libido vanished in S9, you knew things were really bad. :) Considering his background, he could have been WAY more messed up sexually. The fact that he finds such delight in it – is great. I actually find him really healthy about sex and there’s a puritanical vibe in some of the fan commentary about him sexually that I find extremely off-putting – not here, but elsewhere – but never mind about that.
I’m very wild and it’s been my style – and it’s fine – and it’s also been indicative of other problems. Both are true. I don’t think being a floozy (my word choice – no judgment implied in it!) means I’m not “worth” love or anything like that. But those issues run deep – and that, for me, was the most interesting contradiction/unresolved thingamajig in the episode, which was kind of a wreck, in many other ways.
So again. Obviously projecting. But we all do that, you’re right. It’s one of the great things about the show – how elastic it is, how much room there is to project yourself into it, or have it resonate on those really personal levels.
I’ll have to watch the episode again – I was kind of rushed when I sat down to watch it this past weekend. I usually need “second looks” to really solidify what I’m thinking.
// I never really related to the characterization of Dean as a “womanizer”
[…]
// I don’t think being a floozy (my word choice – no judgment implied in it!) means I’m not “worth” love or anything like that. //
Is that what some people see in Dean’s sexuality? Actually, I think the simple pleasures like food, sex, music, movies and stupid jokes are the rare things where he lets himself relax, enjoy, and even be taken care of. He may be the most self-loathing man on the planet, but that’s not how it shows.
There are actually a lot of things related to sexuality that I love in Supernatural. Like the fact that porn and masturbation are a part of life – I think you wrote about that too. Dean showing his hairy hand « I was bored and that nurse was hot »? Hilarious, but it also really moves me every time because there’s neither shame nor will to be provocative. It’s just there, part of this universe, no big deal. And it’s not just for men, too: if Charlie knows the name of porn stars, I doubt she knits scarves while watching their movies. It’s more than shows that are supposed to be ground-breaking do.
Dean’s rule not to pay for sex is probably because he usually doesn’t have to (and honestly, I don’t even believe he has this rule. I think he’s just disappointed because her interest wasn’t genuine and Sammy’s going to make fun of him). But his attitude towards prostitutes or strippers usually is very respectful. They have hard jobs and he knows it.
I’ve stopped reading comments about this show very early on – except here – because it really pisses me off when it’s called misogynistic, or gay-bashing, or other bullshit of the sort. Sometimes I even wonder if we’re talking about the same show! It sure isn’t a feminist show. I think I’ve said it elsewhere: in the pilot, the innocent blond women burning on the ceiling made me roll my eyes. But when I finally decided to watch, I accepted that it was a men’s world. With guns, fist fights, cars and attitudes. And I also learned that it was far from being just that. If it didn’t go any deeper, I would’ve stopped watching long ago. I AM a fucking feminist and I wish more men were like these characters.
I did not intend for my comment to become such a long rant. Sorry!
// So again. Obviously projecting.//
I admire your openness about your mental health issues – although I haven’t read enough of your blog to really know what it’s all about. I like that you’re projecting and sharing. It’s brave and your sincerity is part of what makes us all connect here. Supernatural can be very trigger-y, I think. I discovered it in July, and it had the effect of an emotional bomb. For a while, I was on an edge: I could keep sinking into depression – I was in a state I hadn’t been in for years. I briefly relapsed into an old addiction. But my life had been shitty for a while anyway, so when I got better, I REALLY got better. So here’s my projection. Supernatural is my Mark of Cain. Shit hit the fan, and I was a wreck. It also gave me a clarity I hadn’t had before. It gave me courage.
May –
//NATALIE! I think they’re now writing the show just for you.//
I KNOW, RIGHT? Lol.
I’ve received no communication about the Labyrinth episode yet, though. Do I have to put my email address in the comments, do you think?
Between holidays and the approach of finals, I’ve had little time to formulate comments. I’ll be able to participate again by the end of next week. Happy belated birthday, Sheila and Jessie!