T-minus …
Still busy working for a living – my October schedule, holy mackerel, it’s nonstop, but let’s keep the chatter going! I won’t be watching tonight, will have to catch up with you all sometime tomorrow!
And thank you all for continuing to show up here, even with the lag-time between re-caps recently. I really appreciate our discussions and every one of your contributions!
A Princess Bride reference. It’s official. I adore Demon Dean.
Ha – that was great!
I don’t like this season like at all. I miss the days when it was just Sam and Dean fighting against the world. But now well it is just Dean being a jerk and it does not look it is ever going to get fixed so supernatural this my favorite show or was anyway so please bring Dean back to normal cause if you don’t I don’t think that I am going to continue this season. Or the whole show.
Yes, but Dean is such an entertaining “jerk.” I hope they don’t cure him right away. I want more of it.
Best episode in years. I will miss Demon Dean when Sam manages to cure his brother.
Cole is now going to get into hunting, Demon hunting. His brother and Crowley have defanged him and now Cole will actually be a threat. Good times.
Good times, indeed!
I’m going to miss Demon Dean too and we’re only 2 episodes in. How on earth are they gonna shuffle everything into place? Can’t wait to see how it all works itself out. Before, of course, getting messed up again. :)
Great episode!!! Jensen is absolutely knocking this out of the park. Cole still very much intrigues me. I know that phone call from his wife may very well have been set up to let Sam escape, but still going from preparing to crush a man’s kneecap to chatting so pleasantly on the phone with his wife and going into daddy mode with his son creeped me out…but in a good way. I like Cole’s character so far. Loved the fight between him and Dean….well the beat down from Dean is more accurate. I too adored the Princess Bride reference.
Sam and Dean together at last and it was heartbreaking and intriguing all at the same time. Watching Dean look at Sam with coldness and hostility is just so wrong on so many levels. You keep expecting that brother vibe from Dean that is ingrained into him and it just isn’t there. Yes the “You’re my brother and I’ve come to take you home line” was cheese to the max, but to watch Dean throw it back in Sam’s face was so heartbreaking to watch. Mocking his puppy dog eyes. I think Jared is knocking it out of the park too….both of them are amazing.
It was good to see Baby at the end…however brief the glances were. I think I’m loving the fact that so far while Dean has not been “Dean” we have had no strong focus scenes on the Impala. I loved the whole “It’s just a car Sam.” and Sam’s “It’s just a car….wow you have gone dark.”
If I were Crowley I would be taking myself to a volcano or the moon. That look that Dean gave him at the end?? Wow!
Totally random, but total kudos to the makeup department. When they did some of the close ups on Sam’s face he looked absolutely horrible and not just from the encounter with Cole. You could literally see the months of little sleep and horrible worry etched into every line of his face.
My new nickname for Hannah is now “Grasshopper.” :-) She is so early days Cas right now…and totally crushing on him.
Michelle –
// still going from preparing to crush a man’s kneecap to chatting so pleasantly on the phone with his wife and going into daddy mode with his son creeped me out…but in a good way. //
Yes, that was great. He has more in common with the Winchesters than he knows. He’s on his way to being a John Winchester.
// Yes the “You’re my brother and I’ve come to take you home line” was cheese to the max, but to watch Dean throw it back in Sam’s face was so heartbreaking to watch. //
I loved that exchange.
And yes – to how horrible Sam looks. Really good – reminiscent of when he was institutionalized (perhaps Jared’s best work in the entire series thus far).
Are Castiel and Hannah going to fall in love?
I liked when she didn’t get the jokes. I’m warming up to her.
Oh, and Dean’s line: “She’s a North Dakota 8 …” hahahaha SO mean and yet SO accurate. LOVED the scene with him and the skeezy husband in the car. Jensen KILLED. IT. “You’re a loser …” That whole plot-line was great – Dean not following orders – killing the real one who had it coming. Interesting.
HOLY CRAP! Demon!Dean is truly frightening. Jensen is amazing. That was a great episode.
Crowley thinks he can push Dean around LOLOLOL. I can. NOT. wait for the moment Dean kills Crowley. And Sammy, you know better than to make a deal with Crowley.
Oh man, that episode just rocked. The only thing even remotely as stripperesque as Warrant’s “Cherry Pie” is Motley Crue’s “Girls, Girls, Girls.”
McKala, fight through the pain. It will only make whatever is coming more powerful (I hope).
Showing us Metatron is like Chekhov’s gun : “One must never place a loaded rifle on the stage if it isn’t going to go off. It’s wrong to make promises you don’t mean to keep.” Gee, will compromises be made for Castiel’s grace?
And no one cleans up the rubble in Heaven? Jeeze.
Hannah’s line, “Castiel, I think the Winchesters are a bad influence on you.” And her crushing on Cas. Yuck.
Michelle, I’m with you. “It’s just a car.” I’m thinking of the line in Springsteen’s “Hungry Heart” – “we took what we had and we ripped it apart.” The writers must have been playing that one when they wrote this. Or reading Hegel: thesis, antithesis, synthesis. What’s the synthesis going to be when we work through the anti-Dean? “It’s just a car” – No Dean, no!
Crowley with his “the crazy ones are for flings, not relationship” and then The Delfonics’ “Lonely Girl” and the (G-rated, non-triplets) flickr. WTF!
JA and JP just nailing everything. And Cole not running away, with his tail between his legs. God, doesn’t this just make you happy? The table is being set. Perhaps some anointing oil is nearby. My cup runneth over.
“Cherry Pie” is so hilarious. Dean’s fantasy-dreamlife-stripper song. He’s livin’ the dream now. Telling the stripper to pick up the money? Gross!
Dean not caring about the car … wow. I love when Supernatural destroys the things we have come to love so much. They’re having so much fun right now, you can tell. And yes: no exteriors of the car. NONE. Great choice!
That Flickr photo of Crowley and Dean is one of the funniest things I’ve ever seen in my life.
Michelle
//If I were Crowley I would be taking myself to a volcano or the moon. That look that Dean gave him at the end?? Wow!//
Totally! Ice cold gorgeous.
mutecypher
//JA and JP just nailing everything. And Cole not running away, with his tail between his legs. God, doesn’t this just make you happy? The table is being set. Perhaps some anointing oil is nearby. My cup runneth over.//
I agree. That episode was fun. And so nice to see smiles, even evil smiles. That scene between Demon Dean and the creepy husband was compelling. Good demon scene and a good Dean scene. Great fight scene too. JP is doing so well- I feel such concern for him.
Isn’t it nice that the angels ran into the kindest tow truck driver EVER, in Hannah’s incredibly obvious quest to understand humanity. Don’t want any nuance to confuse things.
// in Hannah’s incredibly obvious quest to understand humanity. //
hahahahahaha
That scene with the child in the house was … too much for me. Resist the cheese factor, please, Supernatural! Try!! I’ve seen a couple of the Castiel-focused Tumblrs going gaga over that moment with the child – so it clearly hit his fan base. Who am I to complain.
It’s interesting – there’s something so … competent about Dean right now – so certain – that the tables have turned, and like you said – I am so concerned for Sam. Normally, it’s the other way around. It’s a lovely switcheroo – and also really interesting considering Dean is a mess, and a Demon, and all that. But following Dean around, he just seems so … himself … whatever he is. It’s Sam who is going through the meat grinder.
Love the structure of the season so far.
Natalie — Princess Bride, and Fargo too!
Grean — I think I am gonna miss him a bit as well!
Michelle — totally agree, makeup killed it on Sam.
mutecypher — the state of Heaven, honestly. I thought they were getting some order back?
Aside from some narrative jostling and obviousness particularly to get Sam’s storyline from A to B I thought this was pretty grand. Dean’s smiles and threats are scary as hell. I thought I was kinda over Crowley at the end of last season but the performance remains hilarious, with his silly drinks and smoosh-faced boredom and his owning of a lonely heart.
So, he decided he was a demon, eh? He’s a bad guy who doesn’t even bother to pretend he’s good anymore? Dunno if I completely agree with him but this episode did a pretty good job of making him a stranger.
And is it me, or is Crowley doing something different with his hair? It looks like he’s trying to have cool bangs.
And what he’s doing right now – it’s so … petty … contract kills, on a one-off basis? What’s the point? I may have missed the point. Maybe Crowley is just trying to keep Dean happy – because when Dean is happy then they get to party together with triplets and Crowley can feel cool? I mean … that can’t be all there is, right? Whatever, it is still entertaining. The way Jensen said “the tiniest umbrella …” to the bartender. Very funny.
Wait – did I miss the Fargo reference? How can that be??
Sammy, you’re being followed by THAT CAR and you don’t notice it? Seriously, what kind of painkillers are you on?
The angels : I’m very annoyed. By Hannah. By Castiel. By the whole romance vibe which i find ridiculous. Last week, the trouts bored me. Now I’m starting to hate them a little. I want Metatron, or better Dean, to kill them.
Hannah (who does have the charisma of a fish, sorry) is driving? Oh great. Again: why not zap them there? I suppose we don’t care.
Castiel watching Wile E. Cayote « chasing the divine and not being able to catch him » was a nice touch.
It’s the second time in the series that strip club and angels are associated, and the still amuses me very much.
I’m starting to like Cole. Watching him completely lose it, fighting but overwhelmed by emotion, was heartbreaking. Very curious as to how all of this is going to play out once Dean is « cured ».
Dean. Wow. That’s really not Dean anymore. The way he moves, the ways he talks : I’m fascinated. He scares the shit out of me. « What I’m gonna do to you, Sammy, that ain’t gonna be mercy either ». Oh god!
And yet, somehow, I’m glad for the guy. I’m not sure I want him cured. He seems to start really enjoying being bad, and I enjoy it too. I just don’t want him to rip Sam’s throat with his teeth. And I’m scared of what he might feel when he gets cured. Committing terrible things in Hell was one thing. Having to make hard choices as a hunter is something he seemed to have accepted a long time ago. But his very identity being altered, becoming the freak (Lester, you big loser, if there’s one word you shouldn’t have used…). How is he going to cope with his worst nightmare?
I’m hooked.
Sometimes, I wonder why Crowley is still in the picture. And then, this happens: http://postimg.org/image/8nc2dpyez/ http://postimg.org/image/gkspa57jv/
It was ridiculous. And I loved it.
// I want Metatron, or better Dean, to kill them. //
hahahaha
// Castiel watching Wile E. Cayote « chasing the divine and not being able to catch him » was a nice touch. //
Yes, I caught that too – very nice touch!!
I’m with you on Demon Dean. There’s that whole thing with identity that has been going on since Season 1: “Those things you said – that wasn’t you …” Both brothers having to adjust to the other being possessed, or a shape-shifter, or whatever – moving on to Sam having no soul – and all that – and Dean (or Sam) being willing to forgive whatever went down while the other was “out.”
How is that going to play out here? This definitely feels different. On a whoooole other level of weird.
I mean … the cowboy hats … don’t they both look like SUCH assholes.
Sooo funny.
Jessie and mutecypher–//the state of Heaven, honestly. I thought they were getting some order back?// Well there aren’t so many angels left, right? And they will keep on slaughtering each other ala Hannah and Daniel last week. Maybe they just haven’t gotten around to assigning clean-up detail yet. Or maybe, total communal democracy that they are trying to get going on, no one’s volunteered to clean up the jail. :-)
So much I loved about this episode, I was practically giddy last night!
// Or maybe, total communal democracy that they are trying to get going on, no one’s volunteered to clean up the jail. :-) //
hahahaha
That’s the problem with the collective. You still need to assign someone to take out the trash and clean the toilets, because nobody willingly wants to do such things.
But yeah … that jail …
How on earth did they de-stabilize Metatron so much that he can’t zap himself out of there? Angels are so powerful – they can alter reality – so I’m not quite getting how this is happening.
I miss Gadreel.
Allyson Koerner (Starpulse.com) made a great observation about why Crowley traded Dean for the Blade (because he obviously wasn’t really planning on dropping it into a volcano). MOC makes Dean want to kill, only killing with the Blade satisfies the agression that’s building up, Crowley now owns the Blade. So it’s like Crowley set a timer on a bomb and then handed it to Sam. Yes! That makes me feel better about Crowley’s broken heart – that’s the King of Hell we know and love.
Aaagh, I was so hoping Dean was going to start playing As Time Goes By in that bar … but alas it was not to be. Love Demon Dean in this ep, funny and frightening.Great fight at the end.
Tired of Castiel’s ‘rueful’ face already.
Hannah – almost told a joke! Almost interesting in that scene Metatron!
I’m liking how the plots are thickening, Sam dealing with Crowley, Crowley undoubtedly out for payback … Hell hath no fury like Crowley scorned. Metratron, not even pretending to be all humble and likeable now … a great improvement.
Battered Cole crawling all bloody into a library, saying, ‘where’s the demons section?’ (Cole, it’s next to Teach yourself Drywalling) … does that mean we’ll get more library scenes?
I miss library scenes so much – so yes, it was so good to see one again! Also, no fluorescent lights, as per usual. A nice dark gloomy library. That was a really funny moment. The Birth of a Hunter.
Honestly? I was embarrassed in the big closeup of Castiel smiling at the child, and understanding the adorable-ness of human beings. NO. Please don’t DO that, Supernatural! Ugh.
Hannah, strangely enough, became more interesting – because she seems like early-Seasons Castiel. Not understanding jokes, no sense of irony, etc. I still am not crazy about her acting – seems pretty literal to me – no mystery behind it – but at least what was happening there was more interesting than Castiel bonding with the child, smiling at her in a shmoopy way. This is the thing – I’m trying to clock when they started going in this direction (on occasion) with Castiel. Maybe Season 6? I don’t know. I realize Castiel fans are incredibly charmed by the very same things that irritate me – so I’ll just chalk it up to “different strokes/different folks.”
// I’m liking how the plots are thickening, Sam dealing with Crowley, Crowley undoubtedly out for payback … Hell hath no fury like Crowley scorned. Metratron, not even pretending to be all humble and likeable now … a great improvement. //
Yes!
They really got a lot done in the episode if you think about it. It felt like two episodes crammed into one – but it still worked.
There was that steely look in Metatron’s eye as he came up against the bars. That look that honestly is very chilling. Inhuman. Ruthless.
Crowley is like a hurt boyfriend – watching his wild man partner go off on his own – He’s strangely sentimental about Dean (which is interesting – considering it always seemed like he had a crush on Sam – or at least liked teasing him more). Using Dean, and the Mark, as a contract killer … I’m still so curious as to what Crowley is really up to.
What’s happening with Hell? What is Crowley’s End-Game?
I really like how everything seems to be in a state of total chaos on both sides – angels, demons, Heaven, Hell … and angels and demons both need leaders. There’s a power vacuum on both sides right now, so look out!
How I would love to walk into any library and just be GIVE ME EVERYTHING YOU HAVE ON BABY SLOTHS!
Ha!!
Helena – //Aaagh, I was so hoping Dean was going to start playing As Time Goes By in that bar//
According to the Internet, he played the first two notes of “Hey Jude,” the song his mom sang to him as a lullaby (as mentioned in “The Song Remains the Same” in season 5). I don’t know whether that’s true or not–I’d need to listen to the song and the episode both in succession to judge–but it certainly would be an interesting connection.
Jessie –
Here’s everything I have on baby sloths.
Hope it helps.
Barb –
Are you suggesting that the Tragedy of the Commons is being played out in heaven? Maybe angels aren’t all that bought into “cleanliness is next to godliness.” Or maybe they just append “in a really small dictionary.”
GIVE ME EVERYTHING YOU HAVE ON REMOVING BLOODSTAINS FROM UPHOLSTERY!
GIVE ME EVERYTHING YOU HAVE ON PLAYING THE FIRST TWO NOTES OF HEY JUDE ON THE PIANO!
GIVE ME EVERYTHING YOU HAVE ON CHRONIC TRAUMATIC ENCEPHALOPATHY!
Ouch
GIVE ME EVERYTHING YOU HAVE ON PILOTING LIGHT AIRCRAFT!
GIVE ME EVERYTHING YOU HAVE ON SELF-PUBLISHING EROTIC FICTION!
//Here’s everything I have on baby sloths.//
Slittens. Gak.
mutecypher, I…..don’t know how to deal with that.
This reminds me of Kristen Bell’s beautiful meltdown, as captured on video by her boyfriend, when he gave her a sloth for her birthday. Have you seen that footage? It made me love her forever. Basically just Google “Kristen Bell – sloth” and it’ll come up.
Helena and Jessie-
Hey, now, I know it’s an emergency, but there’s NO YELLING IN THE LIBRARY! Also, bleeding on the books WILL get you kicked out.
One question at a time, please.
Demons, you mean, biblical? 265.9. Witchcraft is 133.4, next to the true ghost stories.
You might also like this book by a man named John Dee–it’s some kind of magic system, protection and summoning and so on. “The 5 Mysteries,” 133.
hmm–baby sloths? I’ve got a picture book called Baby Sloths in the J section. No? Animal encyclopedias, 590. Or there’s our online magazine database–
(What do baby sloths have to do with demons?)
Anyway, start there and come back, ok? Slittens? I’ve got nothing–you might want to evaluate your source on that. I’ll just be over here, on the phone. No, I’m not calling the security guard–
mutecypher: Tragedy of the Commons–Yeah, we could go with that, I think. :-)
(What do baby sloths have to do with demons?)
I can’t imagine a baby sloth having anything to do with demons. But demons might want to do something to baby sloths, cf, slittens.
Does anyone else think they may have stumbled into Wonderland when they looked at the slittens? It gave me a distinct “down the rabbit hole” feeling.
Re: Hey Jude, I just realized buying every episode this season is going to be a necessity, not a luxury. I thought I would at least try to get by with watching the episodes as they aired, but that’s not going to work, is it? I now need to rewatch and parse every scene. Damn it. I guess I can cut the frozen pizza out of my diet and live on ramen exclusively. Priorities.
Ugh, Natalie, I hear you. I buy them on Amazon.
Helena, Jessie, you joke, yet those questions are suspiciously similar to the loopy lady I mentioned in another comment thread, who desperately need books on enochian.
Natalie, I do believe there are *looks around suspiciously*other ways to watch SPN that don’t cost money. Like, doesn’t the CW website or Hulu air them for you American-types?
So is Cole supposed to be a reflection of Dean from 10 years ago? It seems like that is what they’re going for.
I am enjoying Demon Dean. I kinda like that he’s mean to Sam—there is something cathartic about it. But, Dean still seems pretty conflicted. He’s drinking too much, for one (the drinking seems more like a coping mechanism than enjoyment).
I am also bored, so very bored, of the angels. The angel plot lines all seem so cliché and really make me miss when SPN was smart.
// who desperately need books on enchain. //
hahaha I love that lady.
Cole does seem to be a mirror-image Winchester – and I’m really interested to see how that all plays out. Dead parent, witnessing death of said parent, thrust into a life he didn’t choose. Only Cole seemed to also be able to have a personal life – he has managed to get married and have a child, despite all of this. It wouldn’t surprise me if Cole eventually became an ally.
Special Forces! I can clock one of them from a mile away!
I’m with you on the angels. I feel like the writers are bored, too. This is that “pandering” feeling I get sometimes – throwing a bone to the Castiel fans. It’s in the script, that feeling. “I know, let’s have him bond with a child, that’ll really get ’em!”
The real interesting shit is going on with Sam and Dean.
Natalie –
Step away from the ramen.
//So is Cole supposed to be a reflection of Dean from 10 years ago? It seems like that is what they’re going for//
Definite parallels going on aren’t there? Dean forever trapped in that moment of losing his mom in the fire. Cole forever trapped in the moment of finding his father bloody and dead on the floor and Dean Winchester walking into the room with a bloody knife. Finding out that monsters are real and heading down an apparent hunter path for revenge has strong echoes of John Winchester’s journey thrown in as well.
You know I’m just trying to imagine from Cole’s perspective what he must have went through over the years if he truly was tracking and trying to find Dean. Dean Winchester murders a woman….wanted by the police…..killed by a SWAT team…..he is dead. Wait….no, Dean Winchester involved in a bank hostage situation…..not dead….hunted by the FBI. OK….yes Dean Winchester is dead this time along with his brother Sam Winchester. Blown up in a building and tragically the brave FBI agent that was hunting him also killed. Wait…wait….nope Dean and Sam Winchester are NOT dead. They have murdered people again. They are on the FBI’s most wanted list. Oh what’s this?…..OK folks Dean and Sam Winchester are dead. They have been killed by the police. These horrible criminals are really and truly dead this time….really….they are.
Maybe this is why Cole never stopped keeping his eyes open for Dean Winchester?
Didn’t catch it until I watched again…..the amulet and the brown leather jacket both made an appearance in that first scene!
// Didn’t catch it until I watched again…..the amulet and the brown leather jacket both made an appearance in that first scene! //
Dammit, I missed it.
Frankly, I’m a little overwhelmed by this season and the different-ness of Dean I need to watch more carefully!! The amulet!!!!
May – I’ve tried both the CW’s website and Hulu (which defaults to the CW’s website for Supernatural). It’s a valid choice if you want to watch in 10 second bursts with a minimum of 30 seconds of buffering between them. I don’t have this problem with other network websites, which leads me to believe it’s a website issue, not an internet connection or computer issue. The episodes are two dollars a week on Amazon, so I’m exaggerating on how much it’ll set me back, but I still don’t love spending the money.
mutecypher – But . . . Thirty cents for a whole meal. And chicken and beef sodium flavoring are almost as good as real protein, aren’t they?
//And chicken and beef sodium flavoring are almost as good as real protein, aren’t they?//
Check for the name Roman Enterprises on the packet …
hahahahahaha
Natalie –
If it doesn’t kill you, there are side benefits.
I may be excoriated for referencing a Christopher Nolan film here…
Kind of off topic and actually rather sad, but if Jerry Wanek ever needs to take a holiday Supernatural could do worse than travel to Ohio:
http://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/gallery/2014/oct/17/haunting-homes-ohio-abandoned-country-houses-in-pictures
Wow.
It reminds me of some of the great and haunting photos of Detroit – which feels like a city post-zombie-apocalypse. Sad.
Ahh, so finally I have 10 minutes to breathe! I hadn’t even visited here because I hadn’t seen it yet!
Okay. Thought it was incredible. Wonderful weaving together of all the elements set up – and good to see Metatron again. That jail looks so flimsy, people. Like a jail on a Gilligan’s Island set or something.
Both Jensen and Jared are blowing me away right now. How awesome is it that Jared looks so AWFUL and Jensen looks so sleek and perfect. Sam looks destroyed. I think this Cole guy is great. That fight scene with Dean was unique. Dean doing kung fu, shot from overhead? That’s not Supernatural’s style at all – I liked it. This is a new Dean. Requires a new style.
I like how Jensen has conceived of Demon Dean. One of the things I really like is that that power of listening is still there. It’s even MORE there, because there is less in the way, less guilt/shame/self-loathing. He listens. You can see him take it all in, consider what he’s heard, turn it over, grin to himself … it’s all real thought going on. And yet he’s strangely … opaque … so it’s hard to know WHAT he’s thinking now, whereas before, when he was himself, he was an open book. I think that, so far, is my favorite part of JA’s conception of this Dean. It’s enormously subtle, what he’s doing.
I feel like the moment with the child and Castiel was bordering on Major Cheese. It felt like pandering. It’s that cutesy thing that happens sometimes in the writing of his character that I don’t like.
But then, I’m rather dead inside, so take that into consideration.
I cannot wait for next week now. Dean sitting in the back seat? The look on his face? And Sam. Wow. This is completely new territory for these well-known and familiar characters and I’m really happy about it.
Also, if there really is going to be a musical episode – it seems that they’re priming the pump for us. Dean doing karaoke. Dean at the freakin’ piano?? Ha.
//It’s even MORE there, because there is less in the way, less guilt/shame/self-loathing. He listens. //
That new little tic, that cocking of the head and the dry ‘hmm’ he keeps doing – love that. Never bodes well for the person he’s with.
//How awesome is it that Jared looks so AWFUL and Jensen looks so sleek and perfect.//
Yes! JP looking more and more like a harried dog (and so skinny! how did that happen?) and, after last week’s bedhair look, JA this week looked ludicrously awesome. There were moments – eg at the piano – when I couldn’t quite believe what I was seeing. Quite happy for this state of affairs to last, though I also loved his Haggard Viking look from last season too.
//bordering on Major Cheese//
It was a full on invasion of Cheese, with tanks. Eck.
Okay, “Haggard Viking.”
I’m guffawing. That is so right on.
I love the “hmm” thing too. Back before he was a demon, that “hmm” thing always fascinated me – I think I wrote about it in the “Faith” re-cap where it shows up. This is Dean thinking. It’s always strangely unexpected, gentle almost.
And now the “hmm” takes on a whole other feeling. He’s so … self-contained. Like a little hard universe with firm boundaries. Everything circles back to himself. He’s growing in power now too. He’s not afraid of anything. I love how free he seems – yet also how trapped in his own little world-view. I’m not sure how that works, and how both things can be true – but it’s sure fun to watch.
Maybe I should be a Haggard Viking for Halloween.
Oh, and welcome Sheila – so good to have you here, even for a brief moment!
So this is what it’s like to watch in real time … just 40 minutes a week is never enough! And then there’s Christmas hiatus, or something. Do they have no pity? Do they enjoy toying with us mortals?
Thanks! I missed visiting my own site. I missed you guys!
I saw 10 movies in the last 3 days. I mean ….
I barely know who I am anymore.
Speaking of The Princess Bride, there’s an interview with Cary Elwes over on Rogerebert.com about the film!
http://www.rogerebert.com/interviews/interview-cary-elwes-on-the-lasting-power-of-the-princess-bride
//Everything circles back to himself. He’s growing in power now too. He’s not afraid of anything. //
Loved that bit where he cuts his hand and watches it heal. Testing the idea of being invulnerable, enjoying it, revelling in it. I hope this goes on for a while, I’m enjoying it – I don’t want his toys taken away too quickly. There’s already a sense already that he’s heading towards the beastly snare of over-confidence.
Yes! And it’s so great because, like they’ve done so many times, Supernatural is giving “us” what we want – let Dean be happy, together, confident – and so they’re basically like, “Here. Okay? Careful what you wish for!”
This type of thing was building all through Season 9 – that wish – for Dean to be released from the pain. They really hammered that home in Season 9. So now. Here we are. Wish granted.
So it’s fabulous to see the pain taken away … and to kind of realize that the pain helps him be human, helps him have a conscience – he was a warrior, when you think about it – to withstand what he withstood and still be (basically) a good person.
And yeah, that opening scene in the strip club. That kind of thing would be bad PR for Crowley, and certainly shows Dean as a wild-card, lashing out, over-reacting, all that. It won’t end well.
// there’s an interview with Cary Elwes over on Rogerebert.com about the film!//
I saw that! And in honour of SPN I watched the film for the first time last night – about time, eh?
Oh my gosh!! Welcome to the club! So excited for you!
//Maybe I should be a Haggard Viking for Halloween.//
Yes, but without photos it didn’t happen, so remember …
//Sad.//
Very sad, and yes, those pictures of Detroit are post-apocalyptic. Here’s to things getting better for people in that great city.
To quote Only Lovers Left Alive: “Detroit will rise again.”
One of the things I’ve always admired about Eminem is that he still lives there. He hasn’t moved to Los Angeles. Detroit is his home. One of the many strange little things that connects him to Elvis, as much as he would probably hate to hear that. Memphis has a similar depressed vibe – the sidewalks overrun with weeds – even in the downtown area!! There’s a gigantic mall right in the middle of downtown Memphis, an enormous building – which opened to much fanfare – and then one by one all the stores closed. The building stands there, in the middle of downtown memphis, totally deserted, locked. Homeless people probably squatting inside (shades of Gone Girl). Elvis’ presence still brings needed money to Memphis – him and Fed Ex. Keep Memphis afloat. And Eminem is probably a one-man job creator in Detroit – his staff, his studio, his production team, everything. But it’s still admirable that he stayed. He doesn’t feel at home anywhere else.
Still. Detroit is a tragedy.
Oh, and anyone get a Silence of the Lambs vibe from Metatron and Hannah, with Hannah as Clarice Boring?
Metatron just can’t help being meta.
Re: Fargo: the wounded husband had Jerry Lundegaard written all over him! And in the Fargo TV adaptation (an adaptation as apparently unnecessary and shockingly good as Hannibal) the character who starts out as a Jerry analogue is called Lester.
What does Crowley want? Per his outburst while being cured — just to be loved? He’s basically role-playing himself, and with increasing apathy. Someone, I forgot where, pointed out that he’s basically handed Sam a loaded bomb. Does he want them to destroy each other since he can’t have either of them?
Yup, Sam looks skinny and ruined. It seems to me he’s been running half-blind and not smart at all. Of course he should have picked all of Cole’s tricks. Of course walking up to Dean and trying to slap a pair of cuffs on him (one-handed!) wasn’t going to work. I kept expecting him to have a trap in his back pocket. Bucket of holy water over the door at least. But he’s got nothing. He’s at the end.
I really enjoyed the fight scene, how easily he whipped Cole like a dog (fabulous line and delivery!) — although the stunt cutaways were a bit obvious, and I wonder why they decided to film it in the day — and that little shrug he did after laying the gun on the ground killed me. Where does he come up with this stuff? That last line about mercy; mercy, me!
I’ve seen that Kristen Bell clip too many times! Incredible. I love her. Have to say though my favourite sloth-related quote is Stephen Maturin chastising Jack Aubrey for debauching his sloth. Makes me laugh for days.
// It seems to me he’s been running half-blind and not smart at all. //
I agree. Sleep-deprived, devastated – and without his brother, who helped carry the load. They’re both in brand-new territory.
Ahh, Jerry Lundegard. Also the North Dakota reference!
// He’s basically role-playing himself, and with increasing apathy. //
Yeah. It was satisfying to see the look on his face when Dean informed him he killed the husband. That whole scene was great.
It’s hard to believe the show will ever ever get back to a “monster of the week” format. There were only, what, 6 or 7 of those episodes in the entire season last year?
One of the things I like about the show – even when it’s hit or miss – is that you get the sense that the writers go where the SHOW wants them to go. I know there’s so much thought that goes into it – but there’s also an improvisational free-wheeling feel to some of the choices – “Okay, so let’s bring in some angels and see what happens …” “Let’s have a whole half a season where Sam is not himself …” – and I appreciate that they just GO with it. Other shows are more strict. (Other shows haven’t lasted 10 years.)
But still. There’s nothing quite like Sam and Dean working a case.
So it’ll be interesting the first time that happens after all of THIS has been sorted out. Lots of stuff to look forward to.
Love that you know that Kristen Bell clip!! She’s just fabulous.
//Does he want them to destroy each other since he can’t have either of them?//
I’m entertaining that possibility too … I mean, Mark of Cain, at the root of it is one brother killing another. Dean keeps warning Sam to keep out of his way, like he knows he could kill him if pushed but doesn’t quite want to. That might the last barrier, the last bit of humanity to go, that and the first two notes of Hey Jude.
I’m hoping it’s something like this, anyway, and not some dreary old plotty type thing rather than the charactery thing we all love. I feel we’ve barely scratched the surface of what’s going on with Crowley and Dean, and like Crowley, I can’t quite believe it’s come to this already … please no!
Great musical choices for Crowley, loved the Delphonics, loved Miracles by Jefferson Airplane back in Season 6 … would love his in-car playlist.
This shoulddefinitely be on Dean and Crowley’s playlist …
// I feel we’ve barely scratched the surface of what’s going on with Crowley and Dean, //
I agree.
This season, so far, feels extremely character-y, as opposed to plot-ty. Everything is relationship-based. Heaven and Hell are out of the picture somehow – no one’s in charge – and so everyone’s running around, having all these relationships – of convenience, of desperation – whatever it is … It’s a bit chaotic, and maybe even a tiny bit un-focused – but I like it. The plot isn’t really “the thing” here – it’s all of those dynamics, and the rich behavior we get, and all that.
A Dean and Crowley playlist is something we all should contribute to!!
graa, too much italics!
I fixed it!
//This type of thing was building all through Season 9 – that wish – for Dean to be released from the pain.//
There was an exchange in the handcuffs scene I can’t quite remember – but Dean basically saying that this was his idea to leave, that it was what he wanted. So I keep thinking of that moment at the end of S9 where he opens his eyes, and doesn’t feel that all that pain … and that feels great. The sheer sense of freedom and pleasure after all those episodes of pain, regret, guilt, physical pain , the sense of something going very, very wrong as the Mark began to work … isn’t that the most seductive thing ever? Who wouldn’t celebrate that with a few cocktails or hundred?
Right! And be able to let out all that aggression with no regrets. That too was building in Season 9 – the “look at me, bitch” moment (yowza) … and it made Sam afraid for him, and now here we are. It’s strangely exhilarating at the same time that it is heartbreaking.
Princess Bride, Helena! Do you feel about 20% more keyed into pop culture references now?
I think Crowley is hoping Dean will rock up at his door with car woes.
//Princess Bride, Helena! Do you feel about 20% more keyed into pop culture references now?//
I understand everything now, absolutely everything. I feel like Dean after he drinks the dog potion in Season 9.
Even the birds quote The Princess Bride.
//I think Crowley is hoping Dean will rock up at his door with car woes.//
Wouldn’t that be just great … and then this happens.
Prefab Sprout’s Cars and Girls is now my theme tune for Season 10 and in my head it will play over the end credits of every episode.
Helena–Kinda jealous you got to see the Princess Bride for the first time! That movie is magic–and Mandy Patankin got so many of the best lines (though not all of them, to be sure.) My favorite (after “hello, my name is–“) is “you keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.” (My kids are a little sick of that one, I confess.)
//Even the birds quote The Princess Bride.// I love this so much!
Shelia-all those movies, sounds like heaven! And yeah, I can imagine mind-wipingly fatiguing, too.
About Demon Dean, owning his power, and seeming to find his center, as you said, //So it’s fabulous to see the pain taken away … and to kind of realize that the pain helps him be human, helps him have a conscience – he was a warrior-// That’s one of the scariest things about Dean right now. When was the last time we saw him so grounded? I’m thinking right after he got out of Purgatory–that experience helped him figure out his place, that he was a “warrior”–and he was apparently happy. But at the same time there was an element of pushing too hard to make Sam see things his way, and sometimes a bit of mania to his happiness. And when he was hunting in those early season 8 shows, he was downright vicious.
Any chance the writers are going to try to achieve an actual balance for Dean after he has been healed?
// Any chance the writers are going to try to achieve an actual balance for Dean after he has been healed? //
Ha. My guess is that balance will be achieved in the last 10 minutes of the series, before it fades to black. And not before then!!
Maybe we’ll get one or two “Yay Dean’s back” episodes – kind of like the glorious couple of episodes in Season 8 where Dean was soooo happy “nesting” and cleaning and setting up his room. Yeah. That didn’t last long!
and yeah, thanks in re: the movies!
Seen SO much good stuff though.
Standouts – many of which haven’t come out yet – but keep your eyes peeled for them:
Foxcatcher (terrifying, everyone is so good in it – Steve Carell, Mark Ruffalo, Channing Tatum – tragic and scary – Bennett miller is one of my favorite directors working right now)
St. Vincent (cheesy, but totally works – I cried many tears)
Kill the Messnger (very good)
A Girl Walks Home Alone at Night – too early to say but I think I might put this in my Top 10 of the year – an Iranian vampire movie? You guys. Soooo good.
Beneath the Harvest Sky (strangely powerful, wonderful young actors)
Thou Wast Mild & Lovely (haunting – if the world were a fair place this director would be MAJOR- as of now, she can barely get distribution for her stuff.)
Dear White People – SEE THIS MOVIE. A true satire. Brilliant. Smart. Hilarious.
There’s more – they’re all starting to blend together!
//I agree. Sleep-deprived, devastated – and without his brother, who helped carry the load. They’re both in brand-new territory.//
Sam Winchester has never lived in a world where Dean would willingly walk away from him. Even after their worst moments….Ruby….Dean came back to him. Dean ALWAYS comes back to him. Now Dean has willingly walked away and could care less that he has done so. Sam does know that Dean is a man of his word and that little promise that Dean made, that what he was going to do to him wasn’t going to be mercy? Sam knew he meant it. This is absolutely core foundational, soul ripping shattering that is going on in Sam’s world right now. Tragic and beautiful to watch. Jared is letting us see that in spades.
//So this is what it’s like to watch in real time … just 40 minutes a week is never enough! And then there’s Christmas hiatus, or something. Do they have no pity? Do they enjoy toying with us mortals?//
Haha!! AGREE with this 100% This is my first time watching a season of this show episode by episode. Love it and hate it at the same time!!
Thank you for the recommendations! I will certainly watch for these, though out here in the hinterland, mostly we just get several screens playing the sure-fire hits. (thank the gods for Netflix, that’s all I can say! And the library :-) ) The good news on this front in my town, though, is that there is a move right now to try and get an independent theater up and running to bring in these kinds of movies. If you want, I’ll keep you posted.
Please do keep me posted! It’s so important. I am definitely spoiled, living where I do – although the art house situation in New York is terrible as well. Some things play for only a weekend. But yes, thank goodness for Netflix!
Foxcatcher will probably be pretty big – so that will probably reach the multiplex – but the others? Not so much.
Hopefully I’ll get to review some of these – either for Ebert, or The Dissolve – or I’ll just do so on my own site. I love highlighting smaller films!
Sheila –
Have you seen 20,000 Days On Earth? I’ve read the review on Ebert, just curious for your thoughts or quick impressions. I’ve become a Nick Cave fan in the last 18 months or so and the movie looked very cool.
I hope you get to do something fun this weekend.
On out-of-the-mainstream music, here’s just an awesome lecture Iggy Pop gave for BBC 6 recently. Funny and thought-provoking.
http://www.gigwise.com/news/95155/stay-away-from-drugs-and-talent-judges-iggy-pops-john-peel-lecture
“Even Superman and Barbie were German before America tempted them to come over. Tough luck, Nietzche.”
Ooh. This sounds awesome. Thank you.
Sheila, thank you again for giving us this space. I know I’m a little late to the discussion again, it’s that work thing interfering with my personal life.
I was mesmerized by this episode! So many thoughts. Dean in a red shirt….. And the color pallet for the last 2 episodes, almost like old times. I bought a season pass on Amazon again this year, I want to be able to go back a rewatch any time. I agree with you guys that JA & JP are killing it. I have to admit that as good as the work JA is doing JP is better than I’ve ever seen him, like Sheila I thought Mental Hospital!Sam was some of his best work, but he’s knockin’ it out of the park here.
I loved seeing the amulet again. Perfection for me – Sam returning the amulet to Dean after he cures him.
Helena: It’s inconceivable that you never watched the Princess Bride before (sorry I just had to ;) ) love that movie, watched it with my daughter when she was little (she literally wore out the vhs had to buy a new one) I recently bought it on Amazon to watch it with my grandson.
Crowley’s play list: Van Halen’s “Running with the Devil” plays during a montage of the Misadventures of Growley & Squirrel.
Lately I’ve been wondering about Mark Sheppard’s approach to playing Crowley. He has hinted at interviews that Crowley may not be a demon. MS to a fan question (paraphrasing) “are you sure he’s a demon? ever seen his eyes turn black?” I think it would be fascinating to hear the backstory he’s created for Crowley.
// I agree with you guys that JA & JP are killing it. I have to admit that as good as the work JA is doing JP is better than I’ve ever seen him, like Sheila I thought Mental Hospital!Sam was some of his best work, but he’s knockin’ it out of the park here. //
I know, right? It’s such a wonderful collaboration, requiring this equilibrium – Dean wouldn’t be as effective if Sam wasn’t equally as effective. It’s such a two-hander. Dean is a show-stealer, a scene-stopper – he just is – that’s part of JA’s thing – but he can’t operate in isolation. We need Sam to be just as strong. I’m soooo interested in what’s happening with Sam right now.
and very interesting about Crowley. I never even wondered why his eyes never turned black. Where has my mind been at that I missed that? Mark Sheppard is so great – a very very thoughtful actor, clearly having the time of his life.
Speaking of that, the couple of times Dean turned his eyes black were just … awful to see. He looks so terrible. We get so used to black-eyed demons running around – but it’s terrible seeing HIM do it.
Kim: //Lately I’ve been wondering about Mark Sheppard’s approach to playing Crowley. He has hinted at interviews that Crowley may not be a demon.//
Well this is certainly food for thought. Crowley is a very interesting character in the narrative in that he has always believed in the boys, almost above all. He saw them as an answer to Lucifer, Leviathans, his purgatory problem, Abaddon; quite an impressive list. He tends to not underestimate them. So did he really think he could turn Demon Dean into a contract killer? He is a big bad that keeps getting away with it.
What’s interesting to me right now is how small-time Crowley suddenly is. Doing one-off killings? What about his “stadium tour”, you know? I know he’s “up to” something – but right now whatever is happening seems very relationship-based. He’s totally focused on Dean – and, in relation, on Sam. I’m very curious about the bigger picture that will eventually be revealed.
Heather, I always think Crowley’s playing the long game. He underestimated Demon!Dean, or did he? I wondered why he didn’t zap his 2 minions and Dean when Dean shoved him to the floor. Sam giving Crowley the Blade? I kept thinking, Sam don’t you watch this show? This will reach out and bite you in your fine behind!
I rewatched last night and have a few more thoughts about how JA is playing Dean this season. I really love how he is giving us and withholding simultaneously. We think we are getting glimpses of our Dean, but we aren’t, he’s subverting our expectations. And Sam is us, we want to see our Dean, we hold our breath when they finally meet again, is he there? The Dean we know, our flawed hero? Our heart breaks with Sam. We all knew Meg, she wasn’t a black and white demon, could Dean there be something left?
// how he is giving us and withholding simultaneously. //
Yes. JA is so so good at that. It’s part of who actual Dean is too – that burlesque act thing I go on and on about … but now it’s even more extreme. It’s almost like Dean is totally surface-level right now. He’s all need and drive, there is nothing buried, nothing suggesting a war within himself. Everything about him can be seen.
Which – strangely enough – makes him even more mysterious and un-gettable. It must feel good to Dean to be “un-gettable” for once in his life. I wonder how Demon Dean thinks about his human self, his human past. What are his memories? There must be something there. Or maybe the Mark is obliterating it. Regardless, it’s all rather fascinating!
Heather/Kim –
Crowley certainly has some long game in mind, but it really is hard to discern at this point. Does he want a BFF at this point? Is it really Dean he wants as BFF, when, as Sheila pointed out, he’s seemed to have more of a thing for Sam? Is Dean the one you f*** and Sam the one you marry? (if you’re Crowley). Does Crowley need the Winchesters for some other, yet unmet, Big Bad? The person/thing who sent a fax to Cole? If Dean killed Cole’s father 14 years ago, I assume it was for a legitimate reason. Which makes me think Cole’s not human. Or won’t stay human.
Since the image for season 10 in the intro is a point-down pentacle in blue fire, we’ve left the angel-centric season 9 broken wings. I’m not sure what aspect of the pentacle (or ‘pantacle’ if one follows Aleister Crowley) is being hinted at. Keeping with Mr. Crowley, the first organization he joined, Golden Dawn, had this belief:
When I went looking for pentacle images, it was far more common to find point-up ones than point-down pentacles. So perhaps this distinction is a clue. Now, according to Symboldictionary.net
Are witches/magic practitioners this season’s Big Bad? We saw back in season 7’s “Shut Up, Dr.Phil” that powerful witches could freeze even Leviathan for a while. Gothwich.co.uk says of the inverted pentacle
Now I’m even more confused/intrigued. If we’re being given a hint right in the intro, then is someone about to have a new beginning? Dean (well, duh)? Who else? Sam? Crowley? Is the season about change and becoming? I do like that idea.
John Dee was told (by the angel Uriel) to draw a pentacle, though it’s a circle with an inscribed septagon, a pair of interlocking quadrilaterals, with an inscribed pair of interlocking septagons, and then finally a point-up pentacle. So I don’t think Mr. Dee has much to say about this. We’ll see.
I do think we are being given the hint that the season is about becoming, about change. Whether we’re also being given a hint about the Big Bad, I don’t know.
I love all this pentacle stuff! Yeats was a member of the Order of the Golden Dawn – he was really into all this stuff.
I was thinking, too, about the design of the intro – the exploding blue light – there’s nothing earth-bound about it. One could even say it’s practically spiritual. Or at least ethereal.
// The upright pentagram is more about becoming, //
I like this. Let’s definitely keep it in mind as we watch.
One of the things I am really liking so far about this season is it’s all about relationships. It’s not too plot-heavy, not yet. The Leviathan season was almost all plot. Relationships are plot too – but in a different way.
Very off topic for this thread (well, libraries are never off topic), but a long time ago we were wondering if the MoL archive had a catalogue? Well, at the end of the golem episode Sam gets a card out of a set of card index drawers – so, eureka! maybe, but then I’m not sure if it’s the actual library catalogue or an index of MoL knowledge in general. Hmm…
Oh wait – that’s right – I remember that moment. I need to go back and watch. There has to be some sort of system there, a way to find stuff.
Random thoughts during/after my second viewing of the episode:
Is Cole seriously only supposed to be 24? If so, did he enlist when he was 14? When did he find the time to get married and have a kid in the midst of his special ops training and tours? And if he’s really that young, are we supposed to assume that the weathering of his face is from desert sun exposure? (Never mind that the actor is actually 3 years OLDER than Jensen Ackles.) Don’t get me wrong, I am enjoying the character and the storyline and the performance, and I’m dying to know what Cole’s father was/did for Dean to kill him, but the timeline is just not jiving for me.
How did they actually make Dean look younger and less chiseled in that flashback scene? It’s not just the amulet and jacket. He really looks 10 years younger.
The back and forth cuts from the strip club fight and Sam being tortured are brilliant, and remind me of the back and forth fight cuts at the end of Fool for Love on Buffy (which is one of my all-time favorite scenes from any show ever).
Good God, Sam is breaking my heart.
I still want to know what Crowley’s endgame is. I don’t even have a guess right now.
I’m a little disturbed by how much Dean is turning me on right now. It’s like when he punched the demon waitress in Lazarus Rising times a thousand.
Did they make Metatron’s teeth look so disgusting on purpose? Or does the actor have bad teeth?
The confrontation between Cas and Metatron after Hannah left had glimmers of season 4-5 Castiel. Is there hope yet?
//He listens. You can see him take it all in, consider what he’s heard, turn it over, grin to himself … it’s all real thought going on. And yet he’s strangely … opaque … so it’s hard to know WHAT he’s thinking now, whereas before, when he was himself, he was an open book.//
I agree. And this is sounding suspiciously almost like a description of John Winchester.
// I’m a little disturbed by how much Dean is turning me on right now. It’s like when he punched the demon waitress in Lazarus Rising times a thousand. //
hahahaha You and me both.
and yeah, no way is Cole in his early to mid 20s. He’s got a baby face, but I definitely thought: “Huh?” Seems like they cast him on his acting chops (which are considerable) hoping we will just forgive/ignore the fact that he is obviously older than he is supposed to be.
It seemed like the flashback was fuzzed-out – softened – almost like the soft lenses they would put on Marlene Dietrich and other female stars – to make them look younger. They did a great job – Dean looked young, almost 10 years younger. Equally amazing was Jensen Ackles having to play Demon Dean in this episode, as well as a version of himself 10 years before – two totally distinct characters – and it was perfect. He’s so fluid with his process – he knows this character so well!
I agree that there are serious John Winchester connections with Demon Dean – a disturbing thought. So when Cole’s father was killed … that was 2003, right? So in our Winchester timeline, that happened when Sam was at Stanford. Is that right? Dean in his early 20s? Am I missing something?
Does anyone have a good explanation for the title of the episode: Reichenbach? I know it’s the waterfall in Switzerland where Holmes and Moriarty had their fight to the death. Well, not Holmes’ death.
And from Google, I learn that there was a German philosopher named Hans Reichenbach, a founder of the Berlin School of of logical positivism. Probably not what the episode refers to since “everyone who gets into heaven, gets her own heaven” is pretty much the opposite of logical positivism. I’d call it Surreal Solipsism. Heaven is (for us humans) whatever you choose heaven to be. Hell and purgatory are imposed upon you. Hmmm.
I got nothing. Any theories about the episode title?
Natalie, I’m with you. The math on Cole’s age doesn’t really add up.
Hmmm, Reichenbach. No clue. Moving down the comments thread now – maybe someone has something interesting to say.
Kim: //We think we are getting glimpses of our Dean, but we aren’t, he’s subverting our expectations.//
I agree. For me the question is: is this Demon Dean, subverting expectations on purpose (as opposed to necessity) or is this JA subverting expectations AS Demon Dean?
mutecypher://Is Dean the one you f*** and Sam the one you marry? (if you’re Crowley).// hahahaha, not if you are a female. Marrying Sam is not a safe plan. But for Crowley…? I actually thought Crowley was envious of Sam, as in, he wanted to be Sam. To have the loyalty and devotion of Dean and be the super-awesome-evil-chosen-one.
//Since the image for season 10 in the intro is a point-down pentacle in blue fire, we’ve left the angel-centric season 9 broken wings//
You are right. I had thought it was a devil’s trap on first watch, but there are no sigils in the negative space. Interesting. Isn’t Crowley a witch, or his mother was?
//Does anyone have a good explanation for the title of the episode: Reichenbach?//
I don’t know about good, but my thinking went to Sherlock. In which case it could reference Cole’s dream of a death match with his perceived Moriarty? Or maybe it is the supposed death/fall of our hero, Dean, into evil. Demon Dean did self-identify as a demon towards the end of the episode- but at the same time he didn’t kill Cole. Creepy evil speech in the back of the car aside, it is worse to kill someone then beat them in a fight. I am hoping it is the FAKE fall/death of our beloved Dean.
Natalie: that was a great episode of BTVS!
//And this is sounding suspiciously almost like a description of John Winchester.//
Ooohhh, you’re right. That smile that is creepy and says nothing is very John. Interesting.
Ooh I like these Reichenbauch thoughts. There are multiple levels of connection there – which is usually how SPN operates, yes? Also, it’s all about pairs. The episode was all about pairs too – soooo many characters pairing up. Cole and Dean, Dean and his former self, Sam and Dean, Sam and Crowley, Dean and Crowley …
// is this Demon Dean, subverting expectations on purpose (as opposed to necessity) or is this JA subverting expectations AS Demon Dean? //
I love this. I am getting a bit of both – I think JA is having a looooot of fun messing with us.
// I actually thought Crowley was envious of Sam, as in, he wanted to be Sam. To have the loyalty and devotion of Dean and be the super-awesome-evil-chosen-one. //
I think on some level Crowley really does just want to be loved. Which is sick and disturbing. He’s like the creepy guy who can’t understand why women aren’t falling all over themselves because he’s so “nice.”
Reichenbach … Sherlock and Moriarty … On the Road … Dean Moriarty … Sal Paradise … Heaven/Hell … who knows?
Love the Moriarty/On the Road connection – the final words of that book. “I think of Moriarty. ”
So. Hmmm.
Natalie //Is Cole seriously only supposed to be 24? If so, did he enlist when he was 14? When did he find the time to get married and have a kid in the midst of his special ops training and tours// I did the math – if he was 13 in 2003 then he was born in 1990, which would have made him 18 in 2008 (just old enough to join,) when the Iraq war was winding down and we were withdrawing (my daughter was in Mosul 2005/2006 I started with her age as a benchmark.) He couldn’t possibly be 24 and do all that, plus have a kid that looks to be about 8 or 9 years old. That’s one of the little things that bugs me about this show (which don’t get me wrong, I love, love, love) the sometimes lazy writing. Of course, I hope Sam’s Army recruiting poster bugged the guy since he was a Marine in RL (that was his pic in ep 1.)
Mutecypher //I do think we are being given the hint that the season is about becoming, about change. Whether we’re also being given a hint about the Big Bad, I don’t know.// I think we are being given some sort of hint, Carver teased in an interview that the boys would encounter a very powerful witch later on.
Heather // is this Demon Dean, subverting expectations on purpose (as opposed to necessity) or is this JA subverting expectations AS Demon Dean?// Oooh, good thought! But all I know is the performance is pulling me in, making me watch for our Dean somewhere. Really it’s very small facial expressions that give us the tease, they’re very quickly replaced by Demon Dean.
I’ve seen the extended promo for next week, and I’m excited for what’s to come, but I have decided to quit watching/reading so much of the press & promos. I think I will enjoy much more if there’s more of an element of surprise.
Kim – thanks for the military timeline in re: Cole. Very helpful. I think what probably happened is they needed a guy who was going to “last” in the show – as a possible villain (and, I’m thinking, an eventual ally) – meaning someone who could actually hold the screen with JA and JP (not an easy thing to do). So they cast the best actor who showed up, even though he’s way too old, baby-face aside.
I mean, though, JP was, what, 22, 23, when they started filming the show – and HE clearly had “chops” from the get-go. It’s not like it’s unthinkable that a younger actor out there could handle the role. I mean, think of the actor who played Adam. Clearly the right age, and clearly able to hold the screen with those two leads.
Anyhoo. C’est la vie!
// Oooh, good thought! //
I agree. I like the “performative” aspect of Dean right now – something that was also there in his real life – where so much of his life was about “acting”. Dean walks around self-consciously, in his own awesome movie, or in his own shitty movie. Whatever, he’s self-aware and is given so much attention that he acts like he’s on display. And that same feeling is there in Demon Dean – only it’s … different.
I’m with you – I’m ignoring promos. It’s fun to go in blind.
Heather –
I hadn’t thought about Cole-as-Sherlock, Dean-as-Moriarty. Shouldn’t the episode be “Reichenbach Fails” then? (rimshot)
I think you have the right idea, though Helena’s “Dean Moriarty” is an evocative riff. Who’s Sherlock?
I noticed that one of the upcoming episodes is titled “Girls, Girls, Girls.” So, possibly more strippers, for those who look forward to such things.
A couple of random observations upon re-watching the episode. Lester drives up to his house in a car with Montana plates, but Mindy’s a “North Dakota 8?” Did he steal one of their women? The spirit of Andrew Jackson lives! Were the Montana plates part of his “alibi?”
Also, Sam pretending to be an FBI agent driving that beaten up Ford pickup. And giving his “Lemmy Kilmister” FBI card to a guy who works as a bouncer at a strip club? Seems like a bouncer would be the sort of guy who’d recognize that name. Another sign of Sam being off his game?
“Girls Girls Girls” is also the title of an Elvis movie. So that’s where MY mind goes.
Kim –
//Carver teased in an interview that the boys would encounter a very powerful witch later on.//
What a dope. I spent all that time reading the horrible prose on the sorts of websites devoted to pentacles, and I could have just looked for an interview by someone who would actually know.
Never ever stop perusing websites devoted to pentacles. We need your input!
I’m not from round these parts, so what’s a “North Dakota 8?”
It’s kind of an insult. In North Dakota she’s an “8.” In New York or LA or Paris she’s only be a 2 or 3. So not only is he insulting her, he’s also insulting North Dakota. Which is basically a big state in the middle of the country. Farmland. Beautiful but nowhere sculls.
I meant “Nowheresville”- although I love what autocorrect just did to that word!
An “8” is a very attractive woman, using a 1-10 scale (recalling Bo Derek’s movie “10”). A “North Dakota 8” is suggesting she’s attractive by local standards but perhaps would not be an 8 if she were considered in some other area of the country. Kind of, “she’s the prettiest girl in town, but not a standout in Hollywood.”
Nowhere sculls – I was just trying to figure that out … god bless autocorrect, sometimes it spews pure poetry.
And thanks, Sheila and mutecypher, I’d kind of figured it was an insult but that confirms it. Dean is just not very complimentary towards or about women at the moment, is he? If he weren’t a demon who just doesn’t give a shit you’d almost think he was talking about himself. Ah, for those raptures about the delectable Amy … happy days.
But in a way – he’s complimenting her – saying: “She’s better than you, pal, because you are a loser.” So he’s insulting her (“your looks wouldn’t fly in LA, sweetheart”), but also insulting Lester – as well as the entire state of North Dakota.
Ha.
It was such a well-written scene. I loved how JA played it – so reasonable, so mean.
Nowhere sculls. I mean, really? I need to write a short story about a ghost town called Nowhere Sculls.
Mutecypher //What a dope.// don’t say that – think of all the stuff you learned and by extension the rest of us, with your extensive research! And I hadn’t even noticed it was upsidedown/inverted. Just thought it was a symbolic of a devil’s trap and the ‘demonic’ implications for the season.
Natalie –
“Fool For Love” was a great episode. And then they called back to it in season 7’s “Lies My Parents Told Me.” Spike’s comment to Principal Sexy about the how difference between his mom on Spike’s was that Spike’s mom actually loved him – that’s as nasty as anything Dean’s said this season. Both episodes kicked some firm buttocks. Learning exactly whose black leather jacket Spike took as a trophy… yeah, baby. It’s important to make yourself indispensable.
Kim –
Thanks. It was fun. “The journey is the reward” said some guy who used to run a company where I worked.
//Nowhere sculls. I mean, really? I need to write a short story about a ghost town called Nowhere Sculls.//
Nowhere Sculls, North Dakota. Where the women are an 8 and the men are all losers.
Or maybe let autocorrect write it for you.
Re the Surely-Must-be-Happening-Sometime-Soon-Musical-Episode …
Take a peek at this clip from a never completed MGM musical. Whizz straight to 5.40 for the fluffiest and pinkest version of the inferno I’ve ever seen.
Or scroll back to 2.20 or thereabouts for girls dancing about in their underwear. Being the 1930s it’s still more clothes than I see young girls wearing nowadays in midwinter, but still.
Wow, Helena – how did you find that?? That is amazing!
Helena –
The Devil’s Cabaret was crazy! Thanks for sharing that.
Sheila –
Re the Hawks’ Woman we were discussing in “No Exit,” I finally watched Only Angels Have Wings last night. What a great film! Jean Arthur’s character had a lot of similarities to Angie Dickenson’s in Rio Bravo – not a coincidence, I’m sure. What a great world he created there, with the men finally inviting Bat McPherson into their good graces! And an interesting piece of work getting us to root for Jean Arthur to get together with Cary Grant without making Rita Hayworth a villain. Even giving her a chance to understand her man. And dropping nitroglycerine on Andean Condors to get the damn things out of the pass, imagine the uproar today if a movie showed that!
Oh I am sooo excited you saw Only Angels Have Wings!! Perfect timing – because it’s actually going to be playing at the Film Forum here in New York – I’m going to a screening next week. It will be my first time seeing it on the big screen. Cannot WAIT.
They created a “special Oscar” back in the day for those flight sequences, which are still stunning to witness today. That precarious landing on the small cliff. Wow!!
Richard Barthelmess, who was so wonderful as the guy who “bailed” out and then redeemed himself – was a huge silent film actor, a big star, who sort of lost his way once talkies came in. His career was pretty much done. He was a broken sort of fellow. Hawks remembered him, loved him, and gave him this phenomenal role – which also (incidentally) allowed him to tap into all of that lost sense of confidence that he, the actor, felt in his real life. I love that performance.
and yes: Rita Hayworth was so great. There are no villains here. They also didn’t “sell out” Rita’s character – yes, she messed up, but then she was able to pull herself together and do the right thing for her husband. The film didn’t shame her. And, wow, her dress. I mean, really.
Thomas Mitchell’s death scene gives me goosebumps. He wants privacy. Because dying is going to be something new, and he doesn’t know how good he will be at it, and he’s afraid. Just incredible.
In Godard’s latest film, Goodbye to Language, he “samples” the final moment – with Jean Arthur figuring out the two-headed coin and running to the door, screaming, “HEYYYYY.”
So Only Angels Have Wings is everywhere right now!!
//Nowhere Sculls, North Dakota. Where the women are an 8 and the men are all losers.//
This is neither here nor there, or nowheresville, but when I was a kid, we used to tell North Dakota jokes–you know, as in, “Q: What’s the state tree of North Dakota? A: The telephone pole.”
I’m sure another state somewhere picked on Montanans, but I don’t know which one.
Anyway, Nowhere Sculls sounds like it could have been a town back in the days when they were giving towns names like “Anamoose” and “Donnybrooke.”
North Dakota is one of the most beautiful states I’ve ever been to – there was something about that flat landscape, so foreign to my New England eyes, that blew me away. My boyfriend and I spent a bunch of time there – we were supposed to be moving on but we kept finding excuses to stay. Just a gorgeous state – but in general, you do get the sense of how empty it is – we would drive for miles and miles without seeing a soul.
Barb, a never ending source of entertainment with Supernatural is the names of the all the towns. I love anything with Falls, Creek or Canyon in the name but my two absolute favourites are Kermit, where Sam camps out with the sexy vet, and Concrete, with the wishing well, I think.
Helena–Absolutely, I love the places they pick! Some do have a poetry all their own, like Blue Earth.
I confess, though, on occasion the place will pull me right out of the story, if I know it well. They’ve been to a couple of my hometowns, after all. And while I don’t insist that they, or any other fiction, get the details down cold, it does bug me when they are way off. Their biggest sin against Montana, for example, was placing Great Falls in the middle of the mountains, when in fact it’s a Great Plains town, about as flat as you can get! Honestly, would it kill them to look at a topo map? :-)
I really don’t know how New Yorkers and Los Angelinos manage to suspend their disbelief at all. Is there a “movie” New York and a “real” New York, or something?
I remember when I saw Day After Tomorrow – and there’s a wall of snow covering New York – and they are clearly standing on what used to be the West Side – right on the Hudson River – and someone says: “We are now standing on top of the New York Public Library.”
Totally pulled me out of it. Because no, the New York Public Library – the main branch, the one with the big lions – is at 42nd and 5th, i.e. Midtown.
It pissed me off because here they were destroying New York City (and that movie came out soon after 9/11 – and I remember being unreasonably upset by the whole spectacle of New York being flooded) – and they couldn’t be bothered to get the landscape of my beautiful city right. I was thinking, “Huh? They’re clearly on the shores of the Hudson. Ain’t no NYPL branch over there, no SIR.”
In general, I forgive stuff like that – but for some reason Day After Tomorrow really got to me. Too close to 9/11 to disregard its very specific landscape before destroying it again.
I love the name Blue Earth, too.
… Ypsilanti, Broken Bow …
// Is there a “movie” New York and a “real” New York, or something?//
Definitely. And Woody Allen films take place in the ‘movie’ version. Londoners have a lot of fun with this game too.
British place names have a particular poetry to them. Back in the ’60s Flanders and Swann wrote a lament for the railway stations closed in a still infamous round of cuts. Just some of the places mentioned: Kirby Muxloe, Mow Cop and Scholar Green, Blandford Forum, Midsomer Norton, Mumby Road, Chorlton-cum-Hardy, Chester-le-Street, Four Crosses, Dogdyke, Tumby Woodside, Trouble House Halt, Audlem, Ambergate, Chittening Platform, Goole, St Erth.
And if you want to get us all misty-eyed on this side of the Atlantic all you have to do is say the name ‘Adelstrop’
Tumby Woodside!
Tumby Woodside sounds like a character in ‘Only angels have wings.’
Or The Hobbit.
Or a hobbit’s address.
Off topic, but if anyone is interested – a found a new, more complete, humorous VC Andrews recap blog – that includes a drinking game. You’re welcome.
http://casteelkidsstolemygroceries.tumblr.com
The whole purpose of that jail is to hold angels, so I don’t think they had to do anything in particular to Metatron to keep him in it. He can’t get out because teleportation is disabled in there, just like a normal human can’t get out of a real cell because there are bars and stuff.
(And none of the angels who fell can zap anywhere, which is why Hannah and Cas have to drive places. Metatron was the only one who kept the ability.)
I realize that – I still thought the set was horrible.
Oh – realize this is on another thread entirely, so not sure what you are responding to.
We were just talking about the bad Heaven Jail set on another thread and I thought you were responding to that – sorry!