SPOILER. DO NOT READ IF YOU HAVE NOT SEEN.
I’m almost embarrassed (not) at the STAB of joy I felt when I saw Charlie.
See, this is the good thing about ignoring SPN feeds on Social Media, and ignoring all upcoming promos, commercials, sneak peeks, and gossip.
I had no idea she was returning. It never even crossed my mind.
haha!! I was in the same boat — I don’t know if I would say I was STABBED but I definitely had a lovely hey girl! feeling. Great surprise. I really enjoyed seeing that rhythm emerge between her and Dean again.
I don’t have too much positive to say about the rest of it but I will say that I was also surprised — really was left taken aback and unsure by that explosion from Dean at the end — it was unexpected and powerful — ALIVE. His “every time” lament felt like the only true and authentic piece of speech in the whole thing.
Same, I had no idea! It’s so funny because I joked about that on Twitter last week, like “go get Charlie, thanks.” Ha!
As for the rest,… sigh.
And I’m still in my season 12 re-watch, I had to see again the Who We Are episode again and it is hands down my least favourite episode of the whole show. Dumb Racist Truck, Shortest Night With Bug Spray, and even Chicago Spin-off Debacle don’t look so bad in comparison.
:(
I don’t even remember “who we are.” which one was that?
Uh-oh, it’s rant’o’clock.
The one where Sam is a Leader because they’re Heroes-who-save-the-world-this-is-what-we-do, so a bunch of hunters takes down the military men of letters using some fumes and their dicks, they also force an nth bitch/jerk moment, and in case that wasn’t enough they go “kick it in the ass” for such a lame scene – I can’t forgive them to compensate for such lame lameness by spitting on Kim Manners’ grave.
Meanwhile Dean has his “I hate you but I love you” scene with Mary, which breaks my heart for all the wrong reasons, the main one being that Jensen Ackles acts the shit out of it, because of course, he’s Jensen fucking Ackles – and all I can think about is how I feel the exact same thing for the show during those 50 minutes: “I love you because I can’t help it, but also I fucking hate you so much right now, why are you doing this, oh my god please stop.”
I have no response to this but D-:
Oh God, THAT episode.
Honestly, I have PTSD. It gave me everything I wanted – but they had scorched the earth so much on the WAY to giving me what I wanted – that I watched that Mom/Dean scene and thought, “Yuk.”
“every time” – yes. He brought it to the level it needed to be – or maybe even further than they had imagined. His whole history in that line.
In re: the rest of the episode:
Oh great: angel-killing bullets. So now we get to have MORE opportunities for SHOOT-OUTS with multiple people, because yeah, that’s totally what Supernatural is about.
I am so over the camo and GEAR of the alternate world. This must be Dabb … or maybe it’s just cultural? A cultural adoration of militarized GEAR. Whatever it is, I’ve been resenting its incursion into Supernatural for 2 seasons now.
More positive thoughts:
— I loved the snowy landscape. That was not a choice I expected – and it was a relief after the ridiculous gravel-piles or whatever it was version of the AU we’ve become familiar with.
— Dean in broad glaring winter sunlight staring up at Charlie on the bridge – beautiful. Not too many people can “take” being filmed in light like that.
— This is the very first episode where I liked Ketch and didn’t feel like shouting “OH GOD JUST GO AWAY.” He had some complexity in his line readings. He actually served a purpose.
— Ketch saying “Good lad good lad” to Dean as he put the ointment in Dean’s wound was insanely … something. It was so British. Or … a stereotype of Britishness. It was so un-Ketch-like. But it “fit.” Good lad??? Hilarious. I don’t know. I liked it. I like it when anything happens on this show that feels unexpected and character-driven, as opposed to plot-driven. “Good lad” is a perfect example.
— Buh-bye Asmodeus. What a waste.
— One of those episodes that has four plot-lines, when two would suffice.
— Beautiful shot of Jared: in green-checked shirt, standing in the door of Gabriel’s room – with the green walls and all the Enochian letters behind him.
— When Asmodeus said he was going to burn the bunker to the ground I felt a surge of hope, and thought: “DO IT, MAN. DO IT.”
— Charlie as Princess Leia. Dean suddenly in the Luke Skywalker role. It’s two years too late in my opinion but finally they dealt with Charlie’s death. Neither Sam or Dean has even MENTIONED her since her death. I have really resented the show for that. Fuck them, basically. You create a beloved character, you then kill her in the most disrespectful way, and then never mention her again. So Dean finally talking about Charlie – God, it was like I exhaled. and it was weird – I can’t remember his exact lines – to Ketch – and then at the end, before he came back to the bunker – but it sounded like he was indicting the SHOW for its treatment of Charlie, not just himself.
//— Beautiful shot of Jared: in green-checked shirt, standing in the door of Gabriel’s room – with the green walls and all the Enochian letters behind him.//
Second this. Always welcome when beauty is given her due.
//I loved the snowy landscape. That was not a choice I expected – and it was a relief after the ridiculous gravel-piles or whatever it was version of the AU we’ve become familiar with// oh I agree 100% wig you on this. Unexpected and gorgeous. Jensen’s face reflected in that light was just breathtaking.
They sure are lighting both Jensen and Jared in the most ethereal ways this season.
I am so over the camo and GEAR of the alternate world. This must be Dabb … or maybe it’s just cultural? A cultural adoration of militarized GEAR. Whatever it is, I’ve been resenting its incursion into Supernatural for 2 seasons now.
cosign 100%. We got TWO looks at “angel organisation” this episode and both storylines were banal and had nothing interesting to say about angels at all, or god, or the world, or our world vs au world. Ok, I get it: angels are boring and have no imagination (except for the obvious examples to the contrary that populated S4/5). That’s your mythology, I guess you feel committed. If you can’t figure out a way to present boring people in a non-boring way, then you’ve failed. You have less imagination and are more boring than an angel. Put your pen down and stop wasting my time. Every time someone says there’s not many of them left I just feel like, I can’t wait for them all to be dead!
I loved reading your reaction to Charlie! And agreed on the “good lad” stuff with Ketch, it felt natural and unexpected.
And also agree on the beauty of many shots of Jared including those wet-eyed closeups, but I couldn’t help thinking, man, his shirt matches the wall so exactly that it just felt like a cruel joke about him becoming talking wallpaper who knows how you feel.
// Ok, I get it: angels are boring and have no imagination (except for the obvious examples to the contrary that populated S4/5). That’s your mythology, I guess you feel committed. //
Jessie – hahaha I mean, when you put it that way, it just sounds so insane. Why even COMMIT to something you find so boring?? Seriously, if they just re-watched Season 4 and 5 they might get re-inspired. Because this is just not working.
I am trying to track it – I have a hard time keeping the whole thing in my mind at one point. When did angels start going down the tubes? Like I said – the Amway version of Heaven, which followed the destruction of Raphael and the power struggle that followed – did a lot to destroy the mystique of angels.
And Castiel’s absolutely useless presence for three seasons – accompanied by Crowley becoming useless for three seasons – was just the nail in the coffin.
Couldn’t anyone take a look and say, “Wait a second – WE are actually in charge here, as the writers. We can make up whatever we WANT to make up.”
This is what scares me – because they are under no obligation to create a boring Heaven and useless angels. This is their CHOICE. They aren’t following any playbook from an extant source – this is all on them.
// Put your pen down and stop wasting my time. Every time someone says there’s not many of them left I just feel like, I can’t wait for them all to be dead! //
This is exactly right.
Normally I can figure out why they are doing what they are doing. Even if it doesn’t work, I can feel the INTENT.
But not with the boring angels. THEY seem bored by the angels. Just nuke ’em. Let’s move on. But they still feel so obligated to just trudge along, following this out …
And it has huge consequences. Look at what’s happened to Lucifer – which Michelle mentioned below.
It’s like there’s a vortex of banality – and the writers have to be REALLY conscious of it to avoid it – I’m not sure how that operates, or why it operates. Like: in such a fictional world, why does this vortex pose such a threat?
They need to get some real fearless freaks on the writing staff. I say that with total respect. People who aren’t afraid to get messy, to blow shit up and worry about how they’ll get out of it later – people who love nothing more than backing the Winchesters into a tight spot – and then keeping them there for 5, 6, 7 episodes in a row – before making up some totally insane shit to get them out of it …
Everyone is playing it really really safe over there. Everyone’s afraid of the tight spots – and do what they can to let Sam and Dean off the hook. (They suffer through months in a super max prison, and just pace the room. etc. Don’t get me started.) The bunker – for me now – is the biggest example of how everyone “over there” is playing it safe. They don’t seem to get how giving Sam and Dean such a huge space space, a home, has fractured the fabric of the show. They clearly don’t sense it – otherwise they would have gone the distance and blown that shit up. Or allowed the Frankenstein psycho brothers to have torched it to the ground.
Let it get messy. Let everything be destroyed. Let things stay unresolved. And then scramble your way out of the tight spots. I realize SPN hasn’t been THAT since the end of Season 11 – Dean and Amara, the possibility of that, was the last time the writers created a situation that seemed impossible to get out of – and instead of GOING there with it (like Dean actually becoming a Demon, or Sam actually going down into the pit, and on and on) … they backed off and went for some Family Therapy instead.
I’ve liked this season okay – am mostly just relieved it’s not Season 12 – but that overall feeling of “playing it safe” … and also the feeling that threat of banality … it’s a huge issue.
It was great!. The heart to heart with Ketch where Dean says, “she’s my sister and I let her down. I wasn’t there in time and she died bad.” Wow.
And yes, the ending was ALIVE!
I’ve got 100 days to Chicago SPNCon! If I re-watch 3 episodes a night, I could have them all fresh in mind by then. Giving myself an amazing GOLD ticket 50th b-day present!
Ohh, that sounds like fun, Linda!! Report back!
I was thrilled to see Charlie again!! It was indeed a wonderful surprise!
Gabriel’s return got ruined for me. I hadn’t had a chance to watch the episode live and even though I stayed away from Twitter, I wasn’t thinking about Google. Since I read articles about Supernatural those tend to show up in my feed. The very night I was planning to watch the episode I had opened my Google app on my phone to do a search and the very first article on my feed was “How is Gabriel alive?” I was livid!!
The explosion from Dean at the end was powerful. The rage and frustration just boiled from him and it was amazing.
I’m DONE with Lucifer. I want this whiny, pathetic, spoiled brat off my screen now. This is no reflection of Mark Pellegrino. His acting is always amazing. This has everything to do with how the character is being written. Everything that I was terrified the show would do with this once amazing character….they are doing. My husband and I watched some Season 5 episodes this past Monday. I watched episodes where Jared and Mark both portrayed the character. They were very different portrayals but they both got the essence of the character…..deep, dark, and very powerful. Now I watch and my stomach almost turns. I’m sure the show is going somewhere with this intentionally, but the journey right now is making me do nothing but cringe.
I do admit that seeing Asmodeus burst into flame was deeply satisfying, right now I’m just wishing that Lucifer could have been tossed in there with him.
Michelle – Funny – in my comment above I didn’t even MENTION the whole Lucifer plot, which speaks volumes, I think. You’ve captured here some of my thoughts about it. Pellegrino is so great, so charismatic – he makes anything entertaining – but you’re right – it’s the conception that’s off. It’s lost its “supernatural” edge.
// I watched episodes where Jared and Mark both portrayed the character. They were very different portrayals but they both got the essence of the character…..deep, dark, and very powerful. //
All of that has been lost.
This feels “same ol same ol” too. Like: “who’s in charge of Heaven/Hell? Let’s do a power struggle and take over!” Crowley already went through this. Castiel when he went dark side.
It’s the whole “corporatization” of Heaven thing that happened … when did it happen? The Leviathan season, I think? Help me out here … it’s always bugged me. Naomi brought a spark to that “corporitization” – she made it frightening. (It took me a while to come around on Naomi. A re-watch of “her” season made me go: “Oh. Wow. She’s actually really effective.”)
Once Heaven became a corporation … we lost sooooo much.
And Lucifer has now been sucked into that structure, and everything just gets boring and rote. They can’t seem to help themselves (the writers, the creators) – I don’t know. It just keeps happening.
Agree so hard about Lucifer. Take yourself and your whiny tantrums and get off my screen.
Re heavenly corporatization: I think they were always in danger of going down that route, given Zachariah’s whole middle-management vibe, but for that character it really worked. All the angelic characters introduced in seasons 4-5 had clear, idiosyncratic personalities regardless of whether they were positioned as bureaucrats, dysfunctional family, or soldiers. Demons were the same. (Think of Azazel, and then think of Asmodeus. No comparison.)
I think the rot set in around season 6 for both Heaven and Hell. Oddly, I can forgive the Leviathan, because the ones we got to “know” again had distinct personalities, and the corporate element had a powerful hivemind kind of logic operating behind it. (Also they both alarmed and entertained me, for which I will apparently forgive a lot :) )
Yes – you’re right – Zachariah worked, and it had some irony in it, it was a joke that worked, because when you put him beside Balthazar and Uriel and Castiel – like, of COURSE he was a middle manager compared to those superstars!
But then … the Zachariahs took over. The show seems afraid of angels. Afraid of their power. I know they were very concerned about Castiel’s power – and how they felt they had to hold him back, because if he was around he could easily fix any situation … lessening the tension.
So instead of grappling with what they have unleashed – they emasculated all angels permanently and yet still kept them around, being Amway-salesmen and dicks. It just doesn’t make much sense story-wise.
Heaven has NO relevance anymore. Let’s move ON.
“The show seems afraid of angels. Afraid of their power. I know they were very concerned about Castiel’s power – and how they felt they had to hold him back, because if he was around he could easily fix any situation … lessening the tension.”
And this is EXACTLY why I do not understand why they’ve done what they have with Rowena. They spent all this time depowering Castiel and the other angels to the point of irrelevance, and then they bring in yet another character to do all the plot-required superpower stuff!
Yes – it’s really really lazy. Rowena hasn’t really been a factor this season, thank goodness.
I’m having a hard time keeping the season as a whole in my head – I can’t say what it’s “about” – I know they’re trying to get Mom and Jack back … but everything else is a bit of a wash for me.
It’s actually a relief to not have them manufacture some “big bad” – or am I wrong … wasn’t there some kind of creature OLDER than the Leviathan, creeping out of that pit early on, as Jack and Asmodeus watched? What happened to THEM?
I could be misremembering.
Like I said, I’m having a hard time keeping the season intact in my head.
“It’s actually a relief to not have them manufacture some “big bad” – or am I wrong … wasn’t there some kind of creature OLDER than the Leviathan, creeping out of that pit early on, as Jack and Asmodeus watched? What happened to THEM?
I could be misremembering.
Like I said, I’m having a hard time keeping the season intact in my head.”
Me too, on all counts :)
Wasn’t it the shedim? Asmodeus wanted to let them out and Jack almost did, but then Jack realized that he wasn’t talking to the profit but to a prince of Hell and closed it back again.
Oh and forgot to mention:
Sam had one of those “we kill monsters. It’s what we do. It’s my life. I fight to make the world a better place” speeches – with the Winchester Family Theme rising up beneath him.
Why do they keep doing this?? I am so curious about what seems to me to be a level of insecurity behind the scenes about what they are doing. Those lines – when used so often – so repetitively – over and over from episode to episode – betray insecurity. It’s a strange thing.
Jared played it beautifully. Sincerely, and backed up with an objective – but honestly, they need to do a Ctrl F on all their scripts and look for the words “this is what we do” “hero” “we kill monsters” and get rid of 90% of it. Hold that shit back for when you really need it.
and hold back on using the theme while you’re at it, please! way to cheapen everything! I don’t know what to say, Sheila, I feel like if I could understand what they were doing I might feel more charitably towards it — but absolutely none of these choices make sense to me in terms of caring about his character — or even in terms of good story! I mentioned elsewhere that as pretty as the snow was, so was the red lighting in the bunker incursion — why not make that incursion and red light fill the bunker storyline? Why not seek out characterful tension? why not use your imagination?
I so agree with this.
I don’t understand what they’re doing either. Some of these writers have been with the show for a long time – but it’s like you can feel them checking the white board in their office for “SPN character markers” and just including them, to throw us a bone, check it off the list.
// why not make that incursion and red light fill the bunker storyline? //
Good point.
I went on and on in another comment just now up above about how Banality is never far from this writing staff’s hearts/souls. It’s like they have to consciously avoid it. Which is super bad – you need writers – or a writing team – with the OPPOSITE group energy. Who are off the walls with ideas, tension – dramatic stakes – keeping the pressure on …
I mean, they’ve had a hard time keeping the idea of Mom afloat, let alone Jack. It’s been a RELIEF when the show “forgets” about Mom and Jack – because then we get to just watch the behavior, and the guys, and all that.
But then if you look back at season 3, or Season 6 … or season 8, hell – even though that wasn’t the best season – each season had a taut season-wide arc, reinforced with every episode without bashing you over the head with it – and each episode somehow poured into that arc, and yet also stood alone.
They’ve really lost a lot.
This season I FEEL the characters at least. But still, a lot of ground lost in the process.
Sheila,
I have to say I saw Sam do it different this time, though. Different then I’ve seen it before. What he said was, I got out. I went my own way, and then I got sucked back in…I fight to make the world a better place, that’s what a Winchester does.
I think it’s the first time I’ve seen Sam truly resolve that this is where he should be and wants to be.
Thoughts?
Linda – I think Jared played it beautifully and it did have an objective behind it – trying to pep Gabriel up – which is why it worked. You’re right!
I guess the problem is they’ve overused such speeches in the past year and a half – and the Winchester theme! Once you use it too much, it loses its potency.
But I totally agree with everything you said!
My friend and I observed that Cas and Sam at the end looked exactly like students who’d been sent to the headmaster’s office. It’s really interesting to me that through everything that’s happened over the years, all the mistakes they’ve (all three of them) made, Dean is still clearly The One In Charge.
I didn’t know Charlie was coming back either, and I loved that it meant her death was finally spoken about. However. I’m starting to find these alt-universe callbacks…lazy? manipulative? cheap? Basically, coasting on the goodwill we have for these characters without doing anything to earn or sustain it. I was so happy to see Felicia Day, and alt-Charlie, but that’s just it – she’s alt-Charlie. Not our Charlie, not the one who was like a little sister to Dean, and a friend to Sam, and delighted to meet Castiel. I am particularly, and perhaps unreasonably, narked that the writers of 13.18 who brought “her” back and reap the audience goodwill by doing so, are the same ones who killed her off in such a cheap, lazy and disrespectful way in the first place.
Kirinleaf – Interesting. I see where you are coming from. I felt similarly – but hadn’t quite put it into words. (I felt that way with alt-Bobby, for sure.)
Also, and this is just my personal taste: what was so wonderful about Charlie was her human-ness. Alt-Charlie might as well be a “wayward sister” with her “badassery” – I have a lot of complicated feelings about women being called “badasses” – or, it’s not complicated. I dislike “badass” as the ULTIMATE compliment, because “badass” means you can’t be vulnerable, or flawed, or funny, or self-deprecating. I find “badass” as a compliment really really alienating.
and so now Charlie is such a badass she is resistant to torture – more resistant than a freakin’ arcangel.
This is not just a Supernatural issue. In general, female roles are “going this way” and I think it’s really disheartening. It’s just as limiting as stereotypical “weak” roles, or “damsel in distress” roles.
Mary is also a casualty of the “badass” pressure. Writers think it’s feminist. It’s not. Putting Mary in camo, and having her be a fuck buddy to Ketch, and then a “badass” ninja is a total betrayal of the symbolic resonance of what Mary has actually meant in the story. It could have worked if they had stuck with it – if Mary had actually had some ambiguous feelings about having two grown sons – all that family psychodrama stuff SPN was always so good at. But no. Mary has to be a “badass” – which means she totally lacks interest.
At least when Charlie went off to Oz to fight in a war, she was starry-eyed and ruby-slippered. And when she came back, split off into two Charlies, the “good Charlie” was trying her best to be “good” – but couldn’t hack it! (Pun.) She wasn’t some commando who could be tortured for 4 days and not break.
This is a pet peeve and it’s hard to talk about because people think you’re some kind of reactionary.
I agree with pretty much all of this, and you’re really not alone in disliking the insidious reductiveness of “badass” as applied to female characters. (I remember last year there was a very annoyed response from female viewers/creators of the Wonder Woman movie to James Cameron’s opinion that showing Wonder Woman enjoying her first icecream and being affectionate towards babies was weakening the character and turning her into a female stereotype. No, dammit! She gets to be physically powerful AND enjoy food and like kids! That’s how you strengthen a character!)
You’ve reminded me that in Charlie’s final episode the writers really did seem to be going in this unfortunate direction with her – queen-of-the-geeks Charlie, who has always been shown relying on her brains and specialised knowledge to deal with danger even when shit-scared, was suddenly (much like this season’s angels) punching and shooting all her problems. Sigh.
But yes, this weird phase we’re in where “strong character” seems to mean only physically strong…I don’t get it. I always thought a strong character meant a well-rounded or complex one, regardless of physical, mental or moral capabilities. I have no idea if I’m explaining myself well, or even making sense, but I assure you you’re not alone!
This is about the last episode “Funeralia”
I love the show but it’s getting ridiculous how many times they’re bringing back dead/presumed dead characters. Just this season we got Bobby, Rowena, Mary, Cas, Ketch, Lucifer, Charlie, Michael, Gabriel, Naomi. I’m kind of sick of hearing the Winchesters gasp “I thought you were dead!”
This episode was based on Rowena wanting to bring back her son Crowley. Please don’t.
Forgot to add Kevin Tran to the people who made an appearance this season.
O completely agree, although I was just missing Naomi. The idea of her “fraternizing” with Crowley back in the day adds much more interesting dimensions to her character. The silver hair is also a great choice. At least she’s not Alt!Naomi. The whole inter dimensional thing kinda ruins the show for me. It all started with French Mistake. As much as I love that episode, the concept places the Winchester’s world not in my world and declared that there is no magic or supernatural in my world. It ruins the most basic idea that I might just pull into a truck stop somewhere and see these 2 guys gassing up on their way to fight some evil thing. I don’t actually believe it, but it is fun to imagine that the Winchesters have our collective backs.
I hear you! Although in that episode, didn’t they say that there was nothing supernatural in that world, including, I guess, God and angels, and I believe in those things so that world couldn’t be our world. Plus, Jared and Jensen didn’t get along so it’s another alternate reality not our world. So you can keep looking for Baby and the Winchesters at gas stations!
// The whole inter dimensional thing kinda ruins the show for me. //
Melanie – I know. For me too. It’s one of the reasons why I am unable to keep the story-lines in my head – they just won’t stick. The AU just doesn’t work. It’s here in our world where things matter. This is too sci-fi for me. Not to mention the camo and Seal Team 6 “gear” which is so not this show – although it HAS been this show for 2 seasons now.
Comment is regarding episode “UNFINISHED BUSINESS” (S13E20)
I liked Gabriel in S3 through S6 but after a while, the character just became ‘meh’ to me. I wasn’t thrilled to see him back in S13, but it looks like he’s going to help the Winchesters stop Lucifer and get Mary and Jack back. Okay with that. However, I just didn’t care about Gabe’s wanting revenge on the Norse gods and taking Dean and Sam along. Don’t ask me what the deal is with Jack and Mary and the blinding white light… I don’t even know what went on in the AU universe because I checked out of that whole sub-plot weeks ago. Sorry, this comment is a bit harsh but the ending turned me around.
The last 5 minutes saved the whole thing for me – don’t even care if it felt tacked on by the director (Richard) who knows that the brother moments are what the fans crave and he threw this in as a bone. The BM was so raw and heartfelt that I want the brothers to get a win before the season ends. The whole season has been them pining for their mom and hoping to get Jack. Geeze, let these guys have something positive happen.
Hey Pat. Yes, even as the episode was happening I was finding it difficult to keep Gabriel’s objective straight. Also … Sam and Dean have been PERIPHERAL to a lot of the action this season – as opposed to CENTRAL … and I am not really pleased about that.
Also: yet another gun shootout. Why do they keep doing this? (Rhetorical question. It’s just so lazy and anti-Supernatural to me.)
They seem to be having a difficult time juggling all of the arcs they need to … I wish they kept it simpler, like they used to do – even in a highly complicated season like Season 5, there was one overall arc, and it manifested in a million ways, but you could follow that throughline. I’m kinda getting lost here. No anchors.
and yes, the final scene was great. Even though I’m sick of the bunker. Something different starts happening in these types of scenes when they’re in the Impala – they just work better, they feel more urgent, more restless … but never mind. It did feel tacked on – but yes, it’s necessary – especially if our two leads are not the central players in whatever drama is going on. there have been a couple of episodes like that this season and I’ve liked those better (the Maltese Falcon one, and the … see, I’m horrible with titles. The one where they get sucked into this freelance thing which is a complete tangent – I enjoyed that one too. at any rate … I love it when the show is random – I don’t need everything to dovetail in – but honestly, I think it’s a bit much this season, from Asmodeus, to those … creatures in that pit? What happened to them? and Lucifer and Rowena and the “family reunion” going on in the AU – which I think has been a mistake. Not sure how I feel about it … it’s not holding my interest. In a way, I wish Jack had been with Sam and Dean for longer – that dynamic was so filled with potential.
Also did you notice Richard S. had pretty much fried his voice – playing this dual role with TWO screaming scenes? Not to mention directing, which involves talking to people all day long. A lot on his plate! I did appreciate that one of the porn stars was male. :)
Sam and Dean have been PERIPHERAL to a lot of the action this season – as opposed to CENTRAL … and I am not really pleased about that.
This has been a huge problem for me this season and I’m fairly steamed about it! If whole chains of scenes are not about these two guys, or about characters experiencing a situation that directly, immediately, urgently concerns S&D, something that only they can affect — then the episode has to work extra extra hard (and look extra extra good) to not be some kind of generic grey supernatural/hero drama with too much talking and not enough imagination.
I know that there are a lot of immovable-object factors at stake: peoples’ jobs, contracts, advertising revenue. And I know that not every episode can be Roadkill, which I’m sure blessed JA and JP with an extra day off and was a really really well-made episode besides. But if you’re not able to tie your story into what’s going on with Sam and Dean then why are we here? There have been quite a few parts of this season that I’ve really enjoyed! But erm, I’m a little too invested not to experience this state of affairs as a heartbreak. And I miss celebrating how good it is with you lovely people!
// But if you’re not able to tie your story into what’s going on with Sam and Dean then why are we here? //
This is the thing.
And – for me – these brother-moments at the end – while they’re very good (because duh, they’re both great actors) – a lot of it is just a rehash of stuff that has been WELL covered (and better) in other seasons. So now we’re back at Dean wanting to protect Sam. Which … feels like was pretty well covered and gorgeously in Season 9, when that aspect of their relationship came to a head.
Can’t they find something ELSE to mine? These are such rich characters. Since nobody there seems to care about character development – they haven’t found anything NEW to challenge this relationship – and the relationship is only satisfying when it’s being challenged. not that they have to be at each other’s throats – of course not – but when there’s tension IN the relationship, that’s the engine that keeps a season running.
For example: the big blow-out at the grief counselor’s – where Sam lost it, expressing his betrayal that Mary only reached out to Dean … my GOD that had so many possibilities.
But it was only referenced one time.
This is really really lazy. They don’t seem to recognize the gold that they have – how potent that one particular argument was – an entire season could have been centered around that. All of the AMBIVALENCE around Mary is far more interesting than “we’ve got to get Mom back.” (cue Winchester Family music theme)
I feel like I’m shouting into the wind though, on this.
There are so many things that could come along and threaten the brothers’ relationship, things they could address multiple ways as a season goes along. Things that could then be clarified or re-affirmed through each MOTW ep, pouring into whatever larger arc they wanted to create. But you have to care about the characters to do that.
Off the top of my head:
— how about reviving that old “Sam researching college” thing?
— how about NOT killing off Eileen and having Sam actually fall in love with her? Thereby … changing the entire dynamic. God, the possibilities there.
— how about having Dean go off the rails in some way? Delayed grief about Mom? Denial? Acting out?
— how about having Sam and Dean NOT be on the same page in re: Mom. (which is why the grief counselor scene was so tantalizing)
It occurs to me that SPN is often at its best when the brothers are STRIDENTLY keeping secrets from one another.
Much of this, though, would require S12 to not have been the shameful debacle that it was.
So many great ideas here, Sheila! So much wasted potential for this show.
All of the AMBIVALENCE around Mary is far more interesting than “we’ve got to get Mom back.” (cue Winchester Family music theme)
The complete avoidance of exploring who Mary is and what she means for them, what her presence does to them, has got to be the most boneheaded move the show’s ever made; and not one mistake but one mistake continuously enacted. I mean: WHY does Dean want her back? I have a hundred answers when it’s John missing, or Sam; but with Mary it’s just because she’s ‘mom’ — she is still just a mom-shaped-word. What does she mean to him? How does she change him? How is he a different man in her presence than out of it? Does she change what he wants out of life? Does she make him want to double-down on his path? Does she make him think of his fate and provenance and future differently? Is he ashamed if she knows his secrets? Does he want to confide in her? Does he ever wish she’d never come back? Does she affect his relationship to Sam? To John? To hunting?
If they activated this stuff in the characters then the relationship between Sam and Dean would be alive — whether there was conflict and spice as in the counselling episode or whether it was more copacetic and supportive and open. At least the show would be about them!!!
Jessie –
// If they activated this stuff in the characters then the relationship between Sam and Dean would be alive — whether there was conflict and spice as in the counselling episode or whether it was more copacetic and supportive and open. At least the show would be about them!!! //
This is so true – and all of the questions you ask in your comment – they’re so evocative, so interesting, so many avenues of exploration, so many missed opportunities.
I just don’t understand any of their non-choices in this regard.
“mom-shaped word” Ugh. I know.
I’m with you guys, there was a lot in the first half of “this is what’s been happening with Gabe” that felt like dead air to me — I really didn’t care. I understand they were gong for a Kill Bill flashback structure (as part of a revenge narrative — like Tarantino is the only person who’s ever made a revenge film? Why go back to that well, when your version of it is so shapeless?) and I appreciate that they tried to do something with the other gods again but it just was very awkward and dull for me.
There were some fun moments! Magic fingers; JA’s reaction to Sam’s “pretty face.” And once Gabriel stopped backstory yapping and snapped at the guys about his torture I felt a lot of things spark up into life and by the final scene I was pretty engaged in the Sam-Dean stuff. It doesn’t hurt that Speight films them like he finds them interesting, like there’s actually something going on there. They looked amazing.
The alt-world: maybe if this hadn’t been spliced so clumsily into the real story the real story would have had time to really sort itself out. Who knows. Who cares? Why should we care if Mary ever sees “her boys” again? They’re giving Jack a major character plotline and three-and-a-half scenes to have it in. The choices made about the alt-world were mistaken at a fundamental level imo, and considering the shoddy emotional foundations of S12. But I guess we won’t know for sure until the finale.
Is it just me or have the h/motel rooms all been ridiculously large this season? The way they’re put together and lit feels very stagey to me — a dead kind of light (excepting that second episode in that gorgeous dark hotel room — but even that was huge).
// It doesn’t hurt that Speight films them like he finds them interesting, like there’s actually something going on there. They looked amazing. //
This is a really good observation. I so agree. They both looked great – and he cared about reaction shots that were not just plot-related. Lots of behavior and subtext and all the rest.
// The choices made about the alt-world were mistaken at a fundamental level imo, //
Yes. I agree. It has never once interested me – although it did somehow make Ketch a character I was actually interested in watching. (“Good lad, good lad.”)
But you’re right. When something is misguided on a structural level – when from the jump something’s “off” – it’s never gonna course-correct. I think it was Barb who said (and I’m sorry if I got this wrong) that the alt-universe has become a lazy-ish way for the show to walk down memory lane, and “bring back” characters from the past. Let’s have a RE-DO of Season 5 – only now in an alternate reality – hoping to cash in on our nostalgia? I don’t know. If you set something up, and then I’m like HO-HUM when freakin’ Bobby Singer shows up … you should know something’s way way off.
Also, there’s too much camo and gear. It’s so un-sexy.
I’ve been thinking those were really large hotel rooms too! Thankfully, I never stayed in true holes in the wall when traveling. Motel 6 was pretty budget but not gross. But I never stayed in rooms that were that big.
They’re basically furnished apartments!
Which I’m fine with. But the whole “weird motel and on the road” fabric of the show has been ruptured – due to the bunker (grrrr) and I keep hoping they’ll “get back” to that aspect of the show.
I held out such hope in that episode where the Frankenstein Brothers broke in with kerosene and a lighter.
a) being ho-hum about Bobby’s name being tossed around — lord, it hurts but it’s true!
b) you took the words outta my mouth. All that camo is unsexy and boring boring boring.
I’m glad the huge rooms bug you too Aslansown, it’s such a weird thing to get hung up on but I can’t help it! They really bug me! They just reek of Stage 1.